All Forums > SimLeague Baseball > MLB > Mike Trout turned 22 yesterday.
8/9/2013 10:16 AM
there are certianly more accurate ways to judge players nowadays.  im a fan of stats, etc.  BUT when you have a case like this, where it sort of smells of over complicating the issue with #'s, sometimes being simple is the way to go.



off topic per trout, but tying in with the whole stat boys, put down your calculator for a minute thing- jim rice was ******* awesome.  hes turned into a wildly underrated player becuase he hit into alot of dp's in his career.  and really, the big dp seasons he had were in the early 80s when he had real burners like dave stapleton and wade boggs hitting in front of him.  any player wouldve hit into alot of dps with those ******* sloths ahead of em in the lineup.  then add in boggs .430+obp and those dps are gonna happen.  jim rice was the ****. 
8/9/2013 10:25 AM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 9:58:00 AM (view original):
I got bored.  I bumped the other thread which fully explains why Cabrera had a better 2012. 

But that particular post was meant to explain how teams, with their post-season seed determined, will rest players.   This will allow lesser teams, and teams still trying to reach the post-season/improve their seed, to win more games than they do.     Want a link to last season's final standings?  That said, would you like to field either of these?

Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?
I honestly don't have any idea how that's relevant to the Trout/Cabrera debate. Did you have a stroke?
8/9/2013 12:07 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 8/9/2013 10:25:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 9:58:00 AM (view original):
I got bored.  I bumped the other thread which fully explains why Cabrera had a better 2012. 

But that particular post was meant to explain how teams, with their post-season seed determined, will rest players.   This will allow lesser teams, and teams still trying to reach the post-season/improve their seed, to win more games than they do.     Want a link to last season's final standings?  That said, would you like to field either of these?

Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?
I honestly don't have any idea how that's relevant to the Trout/Cabrera debate. Did you have a stroke?

You to read back to where you said "Angels won more games".   I know you don't retain information, even if you post it, but everything is in writing.   

Maybe it would be a good idea if you spent a few minutes each morning reading a few pages from the previous day.   Will you comply?

8/9/2013 12:15 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 12:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 8/9/2013 10:25:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 9:58:00 AM (view original):
I got bored.  I bumped the other thread which fully explains why Cabrera had a better 2012. 

But that particular post was meant to explain how teams, with their post-season seed determined, will rest players.   This will allow lesser teams, and teams still trying to reach the post-season/improve their seed, to win more games than they do.     Want a link to last season's final standings?  That said, would you like to field either of these?

Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?
I honestly don't have any idea how that's relevant to the Trout/Cabrera debate. Did you have a stroke?

You to read back to where you said "Angels won more games".   I know you don't retain information, even if you post it, but everything is in writing.   

Maybe it would be a good idea if you spent a few minutes each morning reading a few pages from the previous day.   Will you comply?

So you're saying that the team results are irrelevant to the individual MVP discussion because there's a hell of a lot more that goes into how a team does than just one player? I agree.
8/9/2013 12:19 PM (edited)
The Tigers clinched the division the same day the Angels were eliminated from playoff consideration, game 160.  The Tigers went 1-1 over the last 2 games, while the Angels lost both.

I don't particularly care about this argument, but the notion that the Angels had a better record than the Tigers because the Tigers had their playoff position locked up is silly. 
8/9/2013 1:29 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 8/9/2013 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 12:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 8/9/2013 10:25:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 9:58:00 AM (view original):
I got bored.  I bumped the other thread which fully explains why Cabrera had a better 2012. 

But that particular post was meant to explain how teams, with their post-season seed determined, will rest players.   This will allow lesser teams, and teams still trying to reach the post-season/improve their seed, to win more games than they do.     Want a link to last season's final standings?  That said, would you like to field either of these?

Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?
I honestly don't have any idea how that's relevant to the Trout/Cabrera debate. Did you have a stroke?

You to read back to where you said "Angels won more games".   I know you don't retain information, even if you post it, but everything is in writing.   

Maybe it would be a good idea if you spent a few minutes each morning reading a few pages from the previous day.   Will you comply?

So you're saying that the team results are irrelevant to the individual MVP discussion because there's a hell of a lot more that goes into how a team does than just one player? I agree.

You didn't read back, did you?

8/9/2013 1:34 PM
I did.

You said Cabrera "got his team to the postseason."
I said, "but the Angels actually won more games."

Then you said something about teams already in the postseason playing call ups and not trying as hard.

Are you saying that the Tigers did that and therefore didn't win as many games as they could have? That seems like something a stroke victim would say.
8/9/2013 1:37 PM
Are you saying that teams playing call-ups are giving best effort to win?   Do you understand what a "call-up" is?  Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?

8/9/2013 1:44 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/9/2013 1:37:00 PM (view original):
Are you saying that teams playing call-ups are giving best effort to win?   Do you understand what a "call-up" is?  Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?

You had a stroke. At this point you're pulling a bistiza and shouting nonsense because your entire argument fell apart.

It's "erase the deficit by selling more bonds" part 2.

Clarify what the **** you're talking about. What's your point? No one is saying that teams don't have September call ups or that some teams aren't exactly playing their hardest in September. But I'm not going to guess how that relates to Cabrera and Trout. Make a point or shut the **** up.
8/9/2013 1:47 PM
I really need you to read back a few pages.     And then insist that there are no atheist organizations again.
8/9/2013 1:57 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 8/8/2013 6:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 6:37:00 PM (view original):
I think some people define "valuable" differently.

Again, the objective of the game is to win.   If you win enough, you get to play more than 162.   Trout led his team to a 162 game season.  Yay.
The Angels won more games than the Tigers.
I said this.
8/9/2013 1:58 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 6:51:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 8/8/2013 6:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 6:37:00 PM (view original):
I think some people define "valuable" differently.

Again, the objective of the game is to win.   If you win enough, you get to play more than 162.   Trout led his team to a 162 game season.  Yay.
The Angels won more games than the Tigers.
The Angels failed to make the post-season.     Do you need a link?
Then you said this.
8/9/2013 1:58 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 8/8/2013 6:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 6:51:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 8/8/2013 6:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 6:37:00 PM (view original):
I think some people define "valuable" differently.

Again, the objective of the game is to win.   If you win enough, you get to play more than 162.   Trout led his team to a 162 game season.  Yay.
The Angels won more games than the Tigers.
The Angels failed to make the post-season.     Do you need a link?
Do you need a brain?

The Angels won more games than the Tigers. Not only are you saying player X is individually better than player Y because of the performances of their respective teammates, you're going a step further and saying that player X is individually better than player Y because of the performances of the players on the teams in each of their divisions.

The stupidest pro-Cabrera argument available.
And then I said this.
8/9/2013 2:01 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/8/2013 7:14:00 PM (view original):
I don't even know what you're getting at.  Therefore, I'll tell you what I'm getting at.    Have you ever noticed that teams in the playoffs, who can't improve their position, tend to play a bunch of call-ups? 

Do you even watch baseball?   Or does DWAR and FIP tell you everything you need to know?
and then you said this.

You still haven't clarified.

8/9/2013 2:01 PM
Instead of going for some sort of gotcha moment, why don't you just make your point?
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