All Forums > SimLeague Football > NFL > Broncos - Ware's the defense?
1/24/2012 12:18 PM
Posted by Jtpsops on 1/24/2012 12:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by eschwartz67 on 1/24/2012 12:03:00 PM (view original):
Let me get this straight....  John Elway is potentially a good GM because he is a HOF QB with a history of going to Super Bowls.  OK.  I then hope that the Jets get Jim Kelly to be our next GM.  That would be SO AWESOME
Dammit E, for the 500th time, read the whole effin post/conversation.

Taint said that the Browns were trying to win because they took a coach with lots of Super Bowl experience and named him president. And yet all I hear about Elway is how he has to prove himself because his on-field accolades mean nothing. So which is it? If Elway's accolades mean nothing (which is fair, he has to prove himself as VP), then Holmgren's coaching accolades mean nothing as well.
Holmgren was a coach and GM with a history of going to Super Bowls.  Holmgren was hired to be a GM.  Not a QB.   
Elway was a QB with a history of going to Super Bowls.  He wasn't hired to be a QB.  He had no coaching or GM experience. 

I think he will be successful due to his business acumen.  He has shown success everywhere he has ever been in charge.  Not like Isiah Thomas, who was a point guard with a history of winning championships.  He too was hired to be a GM hoping he could parlay his on the court success into success in the GM's office.  He was a terrible GM.  But his track record was abysmal everywhere he went in any business venture.
1/24/2012 12:20 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 1/24/2012 12:17:00 PM (view original):
I'm not sure slapping your name on a steak house makes you a good football man.
No.  but he made most of the marketing decisions for the restaurant (which turned into restaurants) for the first 20 months.  I read up on him in a business magazine and was VERY impressed with what he did with any business he touched.  Remember....  he did go to Stanford.  Top 3 university in the USA
1/24/2012 12:21 PM
Let's get back to arguing football:

After watching him Sunday, I've got to ask, do you think Alex Smith would be an upgrade over Tim Tebow?

I'm not so sure.
1/24/2012 12:23 PM
I refuse to listen to anymore comments on what Tebow will/won't be. I've heard enough knowledgeable football people say he won't amount to anything, and other knowledgeable football people say he will be a successful NFL QB. I think he's more than capable of getting there, but he has to fix some glaring holes and become more consistent. There's not even any point debating it anymore. In a year or two, we will find out who is right and who is wrong RE: Tebow.
1/24/2012 12:23 PM
Posted by all3 on 1/24/2012 12:21:00 PM (view original):
Let's get back to arguing football:

After watching him Sunday, I've got to ask, do you think Alex Smith would be an upgrade over Tim Tebow?

I'm not so sure.
Better question - could the right coach (like Harbaugh) do with Tebow what he did with Smith.
1/24/2012 12:24 PM
Posted by eschwartz67 on 1/24/2012 12:18:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Jtpsops on 1/24/2012 12:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by eschwartz67 on 1/24/2012 12:03:00 PM (view original):
Let me get this straight....  John Elway is potentially a good GM because he is a HOF QB with a history of going to Super Bowls.  OK.  I then hope that the Jets get Jim Kelly to be our next GM.  That would be SO AWESOME
Dammit E, for the 500th time, read the whole effin post/conversation.

Taint said that the Browns were trying to win because they took a coach with lots of Super Bowl experience and named him president. And yet all I hear about Elway is how he has to prove himself because his on-field accolades mean nothing. So which is it? If Elway's accolades mean nothing (which is fair, he has to prove himself as VP), then Holmgren's coaching accolades mean nothing as well.
Holmgren was a coach and GM with a history of going to Super Bowls.  Holmgren was hired to be a GM.  Not a QB.   
Elway was a QB with a history of going to Super Bowls.  He wasn't hired to be a QB.  He had no coaching or GM experience. 

I think he will be successful due to his business acumen.  He has shown success everywhere he has ever been in charge.  Not like Isiah Thomas, who was a point guard with a history of winning championships.  He too was hired to be a GM hoping he could parlay his on the court success into success in the GM's office.  He was a terrible GM.  But his track record was abysmal everywhere he went in any business venture.
To be fair, while Holmgren did start off as Coach/GM in Seattle, he lost the GM title several years before they went to the Super Bowl.   
1/24/2012 12:30 PM
Yes.  He did draft Shaun Alexander and Steve Hutchinson, and signed Matt Hasselbeck though.  All were instrumental in getting them there.
1/24/2012 12:33 PM
I'm curious as to what front office titles actually mean. Both the Browns and Broncos have GMs and they're not Holmgren and Elway.
1/24/2012 12:34 PM
Posted by eschwartz67 on 1/24/2012 12:20:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 1/24/2012 12:17:00 PM (view original):
I'm not sure slapping your name on a steak house makes you a good football man.
No.  but he made most of the marketing decisions for the restaurant (which turned into restaurants) for the first 20 months.  I read up on him in a business magazine and was VERY impressed with what he did with any business he touched.  Remember....  he did go to Stanford.  Top 3 university in the USA
His marketing decision was "Slap Elway on the sign in Denver."   Brilliant.

That said, running a successful bed and breakfast doesn't make you a good offensive co-ordinator any more than being a successful businessman/HOF QB makes you a good VP of Football Ops.
1/24/2012 12:35 PM
Fair enough, but I doubt it would be all that uncommon to find situations where one GM was dumped, then a new GM came in and won with some key contributors that the predecessor brought in.  My only point is that, while I disagree with JT's overall point on the Browns, I don't think Holmgren's GM credentials were such that he was a slam dunk type of hire. 
1/24/2012 12:38 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 1/24/2012 12:34:00 PM (view original):
Posted by eschwartz67 on 1/24/2012 12:20:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 1/24/2012 12:17:00 PM (view original):
I'm not sure slapping your name on a steak house makes you a good football man.
No.  but he made most of the marketing decisions for the restaurant (which turned into restaurants) for the first 20 months.  I read up on him in a business magazine and was VERY impressed with what he did with any business he touched.  Remember....  he did go to Stanford.  Top 3 university in the USA
His marketing decision was "Slap Elway on the sign in Denver."   Brilliant.

That said, running a successful bed and breakfast doesn't make you a good offensive co-ordinator any more than being a successful businessman/HOF QB makes you a good VP of Football Ops.
Post of the year. So many layers to this one that make it funny.
1/24/2012 12:56 PM
Posted by Jtpsops on 1/24/2012 12:33:00 PM (view original):
I'm curious as to what front office titles actually mean. Both the Browns and Broncos have GMs and they're not Holmgren and Elway.
Varies by organization and how they distribute power.  I think people generically use the term GM to refer to the guy who has the final say on personnel decisions within the day to day football operations, and that may or may not be the guy with the GM title. Holmgren is the President in Cleveland, sometimes it's an executive VP of football operations (a lot of GMs appear to have that title as well), etc.
1/24/2012 1:16 PM
Posted by Jtpsops on 1/24/2012 12:33:00 PM (view original):
I'm curious as to what front office titles actually mean. Both the Browns and Broncos have GMs and they're not Holmgren and Elway.

In December 2010, Elway expressed interest in working as the Broncos' top football executive, after having dinner with Broncos owner Pat Bowlen. However, he expressed no interest in being a head coach or general manager after Josh McDaniels' firing, saying, "I'm not interested in being a head coach. I'm not interested in being a general manager. I don't have that kind of experience to be able to pick those players day in and day out and such."[30]

On January 5, 2011, Elway was named executive vice president of football operations of the Denver Broncos. In this capacity, he reports to Joe Ellis (team president) and oversees both the General Manager (Brian Xanders) and head coach John Fox

There ya go.  He is the boss for the GM and coach, and reports what he sees to the team president who runs the team for the owner.  I believe Jerry Jones is his own team President.
1/24/2012 5:36 PM
Posted by Jtpsops on 1/24/2012 11:58:00 AM (view original):
Let's say you're making a solid income. You're content with it, but you want more - you want more comforts in your life, more opportunities, etc. You have two options:

1) Work your *** off and exhaust every opportunity to make as much as you can and make your "dreams" a reality

OR

2) Buy a lottery ticket.

Both produce results. Option 1 produces more results, Option 2 produces greater results with less frequency, but also less effort and expense. Some owners go for Option 2 - rather than dish out the money for that superstar player, put an average-to-decent team on the field every year and hope to hit the jackpot.
If you want more, you're not content.
1/24/2012 7:54 PM

He's Canadian.   He doesn't understand big words like "content".

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