All Forums > SimLeague Football > NFL > Patriots 9.5 points favorites over Ravens
2/14/2013 2:41 PM
I got to here and stopped reading.  I had forgotten that you ignore everything I say that hurts your argument. 


If you only read a portion of what I have to say, there is no way you can ever argue against it. Maybe that's been your problem all along - you've only been reading a part of what I've said. That would explain why you think you've somehow "hurt" my argument - you never understood it to begin with.

Perhaps if you read the rest of what I have to say, you'll realize McNabb and Brady are very similar.



2/14/2013 2:44 PM
"If you only read a portion of what I have to say, there is no way you can ever argue against it."

I know, I'm done arguing.  You ignore/don't remember my points to begin with, so there's no point.
2/14/2013 3:06 PM (edited)
In Brady's profootball reference similiar players section, the names Montana, Elway, Marino, Favre, Aikman, Brees, and Staubach show up multiple times. Along with McNabb. If anything, I think you're underrating how good McNabb really was.

fixed link
2/14/2013 2:55 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 2/14/2013 2:28:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 2:24:00 PM (view original):
Steve Young put up amazing numbers, won passing titles, and won MVP awards.  And wasn't worth a **** until he won a Super Bowl.  At least in the Bay Area...

And Marino isn't a top 5 QB.  He's a stat monster, and a fantasy football icon, but honestly, I'd put Jim Kelly ahead of him.
The fact that Young played in the shadow of Montana hurts him.  He was a BEAST.

Marino > Kelly.  Come on.  I'll let you take it back if you want.
Drafted the same year, and played in the SAME DIVISION, Kelly went to FOUR Super Bowls, Marino went to ONE

Kelly even gave him a head start by playing in the USFL.  If you wanna play the coach card, Marino had Don Shula, by most accounts, a top-5 head coach.  Kelly had Marv Levy (SJSU!).  If they played in different conferences, you could claim apples to oranges, but come on, THEY WERE IN THE SAME DIVISION FOR THEIR ENTIRE NFL CAREERS.
2/14/2013 2:55 PM
Bad link, BL.

I actually do think that McNabb was underrated some.  I think some of the problem was him choking (on his own vomit?) in the last 2 minutes of his Super Bowl.  
2/14/2013 3:04 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 2:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 2/14/2013 2:28:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 2:24:00 PM (view original):
Steve Young put up amazing numbers, won passing titles, and won MVP awards.  And wasn't worth a **** until he won a Super Bowl.  At least in the Bay Area...

And Marino isn't a top 5 QB.  He's a stat monster, and a fantasy football icon, but honestly, I'd put Jim Kelly ahead of him.
The fact that Young played in the shadow of Montana hurts him.  He was a BEAST.

Marino > Kelly.  Come on.  I'll let you take it back if you want.
Drafted the same year, and played in the SAME DIVISION, Kelly went to FOUR Super Bowls, Marino went to ONE

Kelly even gave him a head start by playing in the USFL.  If you wanna play the coach card, Marino had Don Shula, by most accounts, a top-5 head coach.  Kelly had Marv Levy (SJSU!).  If they played in different conferences, you could claim apples to oranges, but come on, THEY WERE IN THE SAME DIVISION FOR THEIR ENTIRE NFL CAREERS.
I thought Marv Levy was a great coach.

THEY WERE IN THE SAME DIVISION FOR THEIR ENTIRE NFL CAREERS and Marino played like a much better quarterback.
2/14/2013 3:06 PM
Hello?  YOU PLAY.  TO WIN.  THE GAME!
2/14/2013 3:07 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 2/14/2013 3:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 2:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 2/14/2013 2:28:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 2:24:00 PM (view original):
Steve Young put up amazing numbers, won passing titles, and won MVP awards.  And wasn't worth a **** until he won a Super Bowl.  At least in the Bay Area...

And Marino isn't a top 5 QB.  He's a stat monster, and a fantasy football icon, but honestly, I'd put Jim Kelly ahead of him.
The fact that Young played in the shadow of Montana hurts him.  He was a BEAST.

Marino > Kelly.  Come on.  I'll let you take it back if you want.
Drafted the same year, and played in the SAME DIVISION, Kelly went to FOUR Super Bowls, Marino went to ONE

Kelly even gave him a head start by playing in the USFL.  If you wanna play the coach card, Marino had Don Shula, by most accounts, a top-5 head coach.  Kelly had Marv Levy (SJSU!).  If they played in different conferences, you could claim apples to oranges, but come on, THEY WERE IN THE SAME DIVISION FOR THEIR ENTIRE NFL CAREERS.
I thought Marv Levy was a great coach.

THEY WERE IN THE SAME DIVISION FOR THEIR ENTIRE NFL CAREERS and Marino played like a much better quarterback.
This. Marino couldn't play defense for the Dolphins. That's why they only went one super bowl. Not because Kelly was a better QB.
2/14/2013 3:09 PM

The job of an NFL quarterback is to either put your team in position to win, or NOT do things to cause them to lose.  In the biggest games (postseason), Marino FAILED almost every time.  He piled up stats against the weak sisters but couldn't elevate his game during the playoffs.  That's NOT a "much better quarterback".  That's Karl Malone.

2/14/2013 3:12 PM
It wasn't about Miami's defense.  Hell, the "Killer B's" were the talk of the league in the early 80's.  David Freakin' Woodley got them to a Super Bowl (still the worst QB in Super Bowl history).  Miami didn't OUTSCORE the other teams in the playoffs, so they LOST.  Why is the defense to blame that Marino couldn't put up as many points?  THAT'S HIS ******* JOB.
2/14/2013 3:13 PM
Jim Kelly threw 21 TDs and 28 INTs, with a 72.3 passer rating in the playoffs.

Dan Marino threw 32 TDs and 24 INTs, with a 77.1 passer rating in the playoffs.
2/14/2013 3:14 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 3:12:00 PM (view original):
It wasn't about Miami's defense.  Hell, the "Killer B's" were the talk of the league in the early 80's.  David Freakin' Woodley got them to a Super Bowl (still the worst QB in Super Bowl history).  Miami didn't OUTSCORE the other teams in the playoffs, so they LOST.  Why is the defense to blame that Marino couldn't put up as many points?  THAT'S HIS ******* JOB.
I will agree that early on in his career, he had a great defense and a very good running game.  After the first few years, this wasn't consistently true.
2/14/2013 3:14 PM
And who won more often?  If Jim Kelly had Adam Vinatieri instead of Scott Norwood, he'd be ranked in the top ten.
2/14/2013 3:17 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 3:14:00 PM (view original):
And who won more often?  If Jim Kelly had Adam Vinatieri instead of Scott Norwood, he'd be ranked in the top ten.
Kelly went 9-8, Marino went 8-10.  The Bills did by a little.

He would not be ranked in the Top 10 based on 1 Super Bowl win.  He was 1st team all-pro once, ever.  No.
2/14/2013 3:18 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 2/14/2013 3:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by toddcommish on 2/14/2013 3:12:00 PM (view original):
It wasn't about Miami's defense.  Hell, the "Killer B's" were the talk of the league in the early 80's.  David Freakin' Woodley got them to a Super Bowl (still the worst QB in Super Bowl history).  Miami didn't OUTSCORE the other teams in the playoffs, so they LOST.  Why is the defense to blame that Marino couldn't put up as many points?  THAT'S HIS ******* JOB.
I will agree that early on in his career, he had a great defense and a very good running game.  After the first few years, this wasn't consistently true.
Why are you guys making excuses for Marino?  WE'VE ALL WON AS MANY SUPER BOWLS AS HE HAS!  And he's only played in one more than us.

I think you guys are too enamored of his big numbers, and forget that the object every year should be to play/win the Super Bowl.

Not throw for 4000 yards and 30 tds.  Those are useless if you don't WIN THE GAME.
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