All Forums > SimLeague Football > NFL > Patriots 9.5 points favorites over Ravens
2/20/2013 2:38 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 2/20/2013 2:32:00 PM (view original):
Did badluck declare victory again?
Did I?
2/20/2013 2:39 PM
biz,

I decided to pick a random page in this thread and look at the first post on that page you had.  I went to page 23.  I didn't reply to it because it's just too long.  The post was incredibly wordy and with no substance.  THIS is why people become frustrated.  You say a lot but give no evidence.  There's no meat on your bone.  I've given loads of statistical evidence to show how good Brady is, and you've given very little to deny it.  Being at the end of a debate going "I'm still here!" isn't winning.
2/20/2013 2:40 PM
Career stats

Game winning drives: 5th
Completion Percentage:  9th
Passer Rating:  3rd
Touchdowns:  5th
Passing Yards:  9th
Yards Per attempt:  4th
Passes completed per game:4th
Interception Percentage:  2nd
Passes Intercepted:  80th
Most Super Bowl Wins:  3rd
Most Super Bowl Starts:  1st

But he doesn't pass the Biz eye test.  I feel dirty defending that masshole.
2/20/2013 2:46 PM
His team carried him to those numbers.  It was the system, or something. Yea.
2/20/2013 4:32 PM
Posted by The Taint on 2/20/2013 2:18:00 PM (view original):

I'm laughing....but that's brutal.
2/20/2013 4:34 PM
Posted by bistiza on 2/20/2013 2:23:00 PM (view original):
burnsy,

You have things backward. I repeat things because you and others ignore them.

I've addressed a lot of evidence in the Brady debate and none of it did anything against what I had to say.

People become frustrated and stop arguing with me because they want very badly to defeat my opinion since they disagree with it so much, but they have no valid way to get the job done. Eventually they simply give up because they know it can't be done, and as I said, it's often a wise move to give up when you can't win anyway.

This just wreaks of arrogance.

Again...get over yourself.
2/20/2013 4:35 PM
Posted by The Taint on 2/20/2013 2:40:00 PM (view original):
Career stats

Game winning drives: 5th
Completion Percentage:  9th
Passer Rating:  3rd
Touchdowns:  5th
Passing Yards:  9th
Yards Per attempt:  4th
Passes completed per game:4th
Interception Percentage:  2nd
Passes Intercepted:  80th
Most Super Bowl Wins:  3rd
Most Super Bowl Starts:  1st

But he doesn't pass the Biz eye test.  I feel dirty defending that masshole.
bis's response....

He had Randy Moss.  That's why his yards, tds, blah blah blah are higher.  He was surrounded by the greatest team ever assembled.  That is why he has the most super bowl starts.
2/20/2013 4:46 PM
Posted by 05nomar05 on 2/20/2013 4:32:00 PM (view original):
Posted by The Taint on 2/20/2013 2:18:00 PM (view original):

I'm laughing....but that's brutal.
Yea I laughed pretty hard at this...got some "whats so funny" looks from co-workers.
2/21/2013 9:32 AM
The post was incredibly wordy and with no substance.  THIS is why people become frustrated. 

This is nothing more than a terrible excuse to ignore what I have to say.

Everything I write on here is for a reason, and it all has substance to it. Your inability to see that substance - real or on purpose because it gives you this excuse to ignore it - doesn't mean it does not exist.

As I said, people become frustrated because I present very good defenses for my opinions, and they realize they can't convince me to back down no matter how hard they try.
I've given loads of statistical evidence to show how good Brady is, and you've given very little to deny it.
You've given "loads of statistical evidence" which essentially shows why you and others over rate Brady, but you THINK it shows how great he is. This makes sense because the difference between reality and perception is, in fact, what supports him being over rated in the first place.

Just so you can't keep up this "ignore and deny" bit like you've been doing, I'll summarize the things I've said which undeniably show Brady is over rated, yet you've failed to address:

1. Many people tend to over rate NFL QBs based upon winning in the post season or the Super Bowl, and this is especially true with Brady.  Three SB wins a decade ago means you forever think he's great no matter what he does from then on.

2. Many people tend to have forgotten (perhaps on purpose) all of Brady's failures. It's funny how many people will mention Peyton Manning's playoff losses and mistakes, but when I presented a list of just a few of Brady's playoff gaffes, neither you nor anyone else even addressed it - how convenient in the argument to show how great he is.

3. Record breaking season statistics and wins that were clearly more to do with additions of other players (i.e. Moss) than Brady himself, lest he would have always been challenging those records.

The only thing you actually addressed was when I pointed out how other players helped Brady (offensive line giving time, receivers talented and getting open) and when I said the system helped Brady have more success and pointed out how Cassel was able to be successful in it as well. Some of what you said makes sense, but most of it doesn't do anything to dispel my arguments, meaning we're on equal ground - leaving at least the above three points as in my favor.
Being at the end of a debate going "I'm still here!" isn't winning.
No, but the above three points and no one addressing them means I'm winning.

Career stats

Game winning drives: 5th
Completion Percentage:  9th
Passer Rating:  3rd
Touchdowns:  5th
Passing Yards:  9th
Yards Per attempt:  4th
Passes completed per game:4th
Interception Percentage:  2nd
Passes Intercepted:  80th
Most Super Bowl Wins:  3rd
Most Super Bowl Starts:  1st
 
Most of these rankings are based on the fact that he has played in more games than most QBs ever do. That alone will bring you up the ranks on many things. The rest of them are due to Brady's conservative play within a system designed to support it. None of it means he's as great as many of you claim.

Way to ignore all of Brady's failures, by the way.
This just wreaks of arrogance. Again...get over yourself.
First, you meant to say "reeks", not "wreaks".

Second, arrogance implies someone exaggerated the situation.

The only reason you think it's arrogant is because you disagree with what I had to say, i.e. you think what I said isn't true so I must be exaggerating it.

By that same standard, you are also arrogant.

So now that we've wasted time calling each other arrogant and the net effect is a complete wash, do you feel better about yourself?
2/21/2013 10:12 AM
The post was incredibly wordy and with no substance.  THIS is why people become frustrated. 

This is nothing more than a terrible excuse to ignore what I have to say.


No, it's not.  And I stopped at this point because I have no desire to continue this conversation and don't feel like dealing with your long-windedness. You give little evidence to back your claims, aside from what you "see."  Giving your opinions on why he's overrated without giving evidence to back your claims does little to help your argument.  In that particular post, you give nothing to try to sway the opinions of anyone here, and it's very similar to other posts you've made throughout this discussion.
2/21/2013 10:25 AM
And I stopped at this point because I have no desire to continue this conversation and don't feel like dealing with your long-windedness.

No. You stopped because you want an excuse for not addressing my points which you can't refute.

You have ZERO right to claim I have no points or evidence when you REFUSE to address them. ZERO.

Address the points I've made or admit you can't.

2/21/2013 10:31 AM
I've address your points for 60 pages.  Did you need me to repeat myself?

This is my point, BTW, when I say that you ignore evidence given by others, and you just simply repeat yourself.  

2/21/2013 10:35 AM
Took the time to read your whole post.  Again, no new evidence.  As for 1 and 2, I really haven't argued against you, although a team is only successful for a long period of time only if they have a great QB.  But we really haven't been discussing that.  I've addressed 3 at length.  The fact the you need me to address it again shows that you, whether you know it or not, ignore the evidence presented against your argument.
2/21/2013 10:55 AM
I put forth three points you have NEVER addressed.

Points one and two you still haven't dealt with these properly except to say you "haven't argued against you". That's not very clear. Either you are arguing against the points or you aren't because you essentially agree with them, in which case you must concede that Brady is over rated.

You addressed three by basically dismissing it out of hand when the facts say it all - Brady's numbers dramatically increased when Moss joined the team.

2/21/2013 11:04 AM
Did you ever think it was Brady that turned Moss back into the player he once was?  Looked like he was on the downside of his career and Brady resurrected it myself.  Having watched him play in Oakland, he looked done.  Three so/so seasons in a row in your prime playing years, followed by a giant rebound?  Not sure why you don't give Brady some credit in helping Moss out.


2004 27 MIN WR 84 13 13 49 767 15.7 13 82 3.8 59.0               767 13 1 8
2005 28 OAK WR 18 16 15 60 1005 16.8 8 79 3.8 62.8               1005 8 0 8
2006 29 OAK WR 18 13 13 42 553 13.2 3 51 3.2 42.5               553 3 0 3
2007*+ 30 NWE WR 81 16 16 98 1493 15.2 23 65 6.1 93.3  


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