All Forums > SimLeague Football > NFL > Vote for best group of drafted QBs
2/28/2013 5:45 PM
While I agree with you, I have to add...

Sez the guy who thought the fact that the Tigers made the playoffs and the Angels didn't had bearing on the MVP debate...

2/28/2013 5:49 PM
Posted by dahsdebater on 2/28/2013 5:45:00 PM (view original):
While I agree with you, I have to add...

Sez the guy who thought the fact that the Tigers made the playoffs and the Angels didn't had bearing on the MVP debate...

burn
2/28/2013 9:12 PM
Posted by dahsdebater on 2/28/2013 5:45:00 PM (view original):
While I agree with you, I have to add...

Sez the guy who thought the fact that the Tigers made the playoffs and the Angels didn't had bearing on the MVP debate...

You do understand that there's a difference between a single season award and the tag of "all-time great", don't you badluckv2?
2/28/2013 10:32 PM
Everyone valuing championships, take a look at the final four teams the last 20 years. If you had to pick 1 one of the 4 QBs each year to lead your team into the next season, I'm willing to bet you'd pick the Superbowl winning QB less than 10 times.

Off the top of my head, Superbowl winning QBs I wouldn't take over the other 3 - Flacco, Eli, Dilfer, Brad Johnson, Rypien, Aikman, etc.

Some of those guys are obviously good, but the point is, the best QB doesn't always win the Superbowl. It's a team game.
2/28/2013 10:53 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 2/28/2013 3:36:00 PM (view original):
Unfortunately, I don't think a career is built, or destroyed, in 4 games.   If Montana played fantastic but his D just gave up 45 in each Super Bowl, is he less of a QB?
Ask Jim Kelly about that.
2/28/2013 10:55 PM

All these hypotheticals about swapping QBs, and maybe Dilfer wins more SBs, and all this other ****.

Idiotic.

The fact is the object of professional football is to WIN THE SUPER BOWL.  Not throw 50 times a game and accumulate stats.  Not throw a ton of TD passes in blowout wins over overmatched opponents.  WIN THE ******* SUPER BOWL.

All your maybes and couldbes and shouldbes are retarded.  If the object of a sport is to win a team championship, and the most important, most impactful position is quarterback, then some weight needs to be given to the number of championships the quarterback has led his team to.  You can't discard it and say that Marino is the best... because he NEVER ACCOMPLISHED THE FUNDAMENTAL GOAL OF PROFESSIONAL SPORTS.  EVER.

2/28/2013 11:03 PM
You also can't measure individual merit by team accomplishments.

As Taint said in the other thread, no fan is saying "Gee, I hope my QB shreds the league this year, leads in TDs and yards, and we miss the playoffs!". I'd take Dilfer over Manning in a heartbeat if it was the difference between my team winning the Superbowl or not.

But when measuring the best invididual player at a position, rings are a mere part of the equation. Hell, Kaepernick would have "won" the Superbowl this year despite not playing in his teams first 10-12 games (can't remember exactly how many it was). I think the 49ers are a great example - same team pretty much the last two years. Changed QBs this year, still got ultimately the same result. Does that mean Smith is equal to Kap? No - it means its a team game.

2/28/2013 11:06 PM
If you voted the Otto GRaham group the worst group, please quit posting on these forums.
2/28/2013 11:10 PM
I'd like to do a redraft with a different order. I think the best groups aren't as much a result of the guy drafting as they were draft position.
3/1/2013 7:10 AM
Posted by toddcommish on 2/28/2013 10:55:00 PM (view original):

All these hypotheticals about swapping QBs, and maybe Dilfer wins more SBs, and all this other ****.

Idiotic.

The fact is the object of professional football is to WIN THE SUPER BOWL.  Not throw 50 times a game and accumulate stats.  Not throw a ton of TD passes in blowout wins over overmatched opponents.  WIN THE ******* SUPER BOWL.

All your maybes and couldbes and shouldbes are retarded.  If the object of a sport is to win a team championship, and the most important, most impactful position is quarterback, then some weight needs to be given to the number of championships the quarterback has led his team to.  You can't discard it and say that Marino is the best... because he NEVER ACCOMPLISHED THE FUNDAMENTAL GOAL OF PROFESSIONAL SPORTS.  EVER.

The job of the quarterback is to play as best as he can. If he plays well, he puts up great stats. HIS job isn't to win, that's the team goal. By playing well, it puts the team in the best situation to win.
3/1/2013 8:44 AM
Why isn't Tebow a starting QB?   He won games, right?

No, wait, he didn't win games.   The defense did.  At least that's how I recall it being said.

STFU with the "WIN SUPER BOWLS" nonsense.   One team wins every year.  That does NOT mean they have the best QB.
3/1/2013 10:41 AM
Posted by The Taint on 2/28/2013 11:06:00 PM (view original):
If you voted the Otto GRaham group the worst group, please quit posting on these forums.
+1
3/1/2013 10:43 AM
Re: the Otto Graham group, I'll bring this up again:

If I told you that there was a group of 4 that, combined, led the league in passing yards 11 times, completion percentage 21 times, TDs 9 times, and QB rating 18 times, would you want to pick that team?  

Would you want that group more than the group that led the league in passing yards a combined 0 times, completion percentage 6 times, TDs 4 times, and QB rating 3 times?

3/1/2013 12:39 PM
This has become like the Sabermetrics arguments.  The object of the game is to WIN.  You can't do it by simply having the highest completion percentage or the best QB rating.  Put it this way, Tony Romo is in the top ten ALL TIME in quarterback rating, but isn't in the top-32 (rightfully) according to you guys.

QB rating obviously isn't important to being great.  Except when it's someone you drafted.

Dumbasses.
3/1/2013 12:47 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 3/1/2013 12:39:00 PM (view original):
This has become like the Sabermetrics arguments.  The object of the game is to WIN.  You can't do it by simply having the highest completion percentage or the best QB rating.  Put it this way, Tony Romo is in the top ten ALL TIME in quarterback rating, but isn't in the top-32 (rightfully) according to you guys.

QB rating obviously isn't important to being great.  Except when it's someone you drafted.

Dumbasses.
In order to figure out which QB was better at helping his team win, you need to separate team performance from QB performance.
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