I just redshirted this guy:

http://www.whatifsports.com/hd/PlayerProfile/Ratings.aspx?tid=0&pid=2853907

Obviously, he took a 6-point WE hit.  Ordinarily I wouldn't think twice about leaving a redshirt on over 6 points.  The guy has a good deal of potential, but right now he isn't going to do me any good on the court.  That being said, the region of the WE curve he finds himself on makes it tough.  With a new rating of 17, he'll take quite a while to get those 6 points back, and of course improvement from that point isn't going to be fast.  Is it worth getting the extra season's worth of improvement, which in this case will probably be in the 26-30 points overall range, and sacrificing a season's worth of WE growth?

Would not be worth it to me. If it went from 50 to 44 or something like that it would be. The only way I MIGHT do it is if I planned to start him after the redshirt year.

23 to 17 isn't huge.<br />
<br />
In the mid to high teens you can still get 10+ growth in non-lp/per blues. &#160; You'll get 6-8 during the RS season but after that you'll see growth approach and exceed double digits.<br />
<br />
There is a big drop off under 15 (13ish) and then again around 5.

You really think so?  I never noticed anything I would consider non-linear, or at least non-continuous, in the effect of WE.

Posted by dahsdebater on 9/14/2014 12:29:00 PM (view original):
You really think so?  I never noticed anything I would consider non-linear, or at least non-continuous, in the effect of WE.

i am not sure about this topic, but if i was asked, i'd say, non-linear, yes, non-continuous, no. im pretty confident about the first but not very confident on the second. even players with 1 we show some improvement, seems like its a fairly gradual improvement from total crap to not very much improvement from 1-20, but i also don't have enough experience with those players to be very confident. part of my confidence comes from the fact that having non continuous functions on things like this is inherently something a developer would want to avoid. most would consider it at least somewhat unorthodox, many would consider it a very ugly hack, and some would go as far as to call it an affront to god and all that is holy :) well, maybe not quite that bad, but pretty close, seriously, its morally reprehensible. anyway, because its not particularly hard to keep the improvement over work ethic function continuous, i have to imagine it was done that way, but im obviously somewhat biased/blinded being a programmer myself, because it is comforting to assume fellow programmers would not behave so recklessly. basically, what im trying to say is, if its non continuous, old admin should be killed.

So, uh, Gill, how do you REALLY feel about it?

"Jim, I'm a doctor, not a programmer."  I can't speak to the technical jargon, but based on my experience, it's probably not worth keeping the redshirt one.  I think it will materially affect WE growth over the next 3 years.

There's no doubt it will affect his WE growth.  I have little doubt that he will end up with a lower WE after 5 years if I keep the RS on than he will after 4 years if I take it off.  The question is whether his other ratings - the ones that actually matter - will be better or worse.  How can I max his functional ratings by the end of his senior year.

One additional wrench in this is that in spite of his suckiness, he will get some minutes next year with Lloyd and Walter Walter having graduated.  I can take the RS off, but I really won't get him meaningful PT this season.  So his WE will at best stagnate anyway.

With a 17, you can still expect 20+ points growth over 4 years on skills you put 20 minutes into.

It's certainly helpful if you start him as early and often as possible.

Check out some of my low WE threads for data.

Here's a guy with a 16

Season	Type	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	OVR
95	Season Start	55	67	6	59	3	44	76	48	60	18	81	76	C+	593
95	Current	56	68	6	61	3	44	77	48	61	18	81	78	C+	601
94	Season Start	51	61	7	53	2	43	75	48	55	16	85	70	C+	566
94	Season End	55	67	6	59	3	43	76	48	59	18	85	77	C+	596
93	Season Start	47	56	8	46	1	43	76	49	51	16	87	62	C+	542
93	Season End	51	61	7	53	2	43	77	49	55	16	87	69	C+	570
92	Season Start	42	50	10	41	1	45	79	50	46	16	89	55	C+	524
92	Season End	46	56	9	48	1	45	78	49	51	16	89	62	B-	550

I don't know why the order of the season are switched.  The end and starts are flip flopped.

+20 DEF
+14 ATH
+18 SPEED
+15 Pass

Posted by Trentonjoe on 9/15/2014 4:53:00 PM (view original):
Here's a guy with a 16

Season	Type	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	OVR
95	Season Start	55	67	6	59	3	44	76	48	60	18	81	76	C+	593
95	Current	56	68	6	61	3	44	77	48	61	18	81	78	C+	601
94	Season Start	51	61	7	53	2	43	75	48	55	16	85	70	C+	566
94	Season End	55	67	6	59	3	43	76	48	59	18	85	77	C+	596
93	Season Start	47	56	8	46	1	43	76	49	51	16	87	62	C+	542
93	Season End	51	61	7	53	2	43	77	49	55	16	87	69	C+	570
92	Season Start	42	50	10	41	1	45	79	50	46	16	89	55	C+	524
92	Season End	46	56	9	48	1	45	78	49	51	16	89	62	B-	550

No offense...but why bother?

Posted by dahsdebater on 9/14/2014 12:29:00 PM (view original):
You really think so?  I never noticed anything I would consider non-linear, or at least non-continuous, in the effect of WE.

haven't you realized by now that TJ is the master of low work ethic strategy?

By the end of his SR. Year he'll be 60+ ATH, 70+ Speed, with PER in the low 80's and DEF near or above 70. &#160; He will be the scorer off the bench for a NT quality D2 team.<br />
<br />
It's a long investment but I am sure I got him cheap.