Prestige multipliers in recruiting for all levels Topic

I was looking for some information the other day and I either had poor search terms or there just isnt much information on this subject.  I have seen a lot of information about prestige multipliers at D1 but not so much at other levels.  A few questions I have:
1) Are these prestige multipliers progressively larger?  I.e. Does a A+ school have more of an advantage over a B+ school than a B+ school has over  a C+ school? 
2) Are there prestige multipliers at D2 and D3 at all?  (might sound like a dumb question but ive struggled to find any information on the subject)
3) What is the value of prestige?  So say D3 D- has a multiplier of 1.  What is the multiplier for D3 D, D3 B+, D2 D-, etc...?
7/1/2015 10:03 AM
I'm not an expert, but my 2 cents as I understand it:

1.  I don't believe so.  But keep in mind that A+ in unlimited.  A super super high A+ has more advantage than a just barely A+.  I believe it was cbg that has posted about it being a scale (I'm sure others have, but he comes to mind), so an A- might be a 90.1, whereas a B+ might be an 89.8 for example.  I've understood it as figuring the difference between letter greades and applying them using whatever formula from number 3 below, but keeping in mind that the letter grade isn't necessarily exact since there will be high C+, low A+, etc.

2.  From everything I've seen, no.  At the very least not at D3.  The biggest advantage for prestige at those levels is the recruits available immediately, and those that can be pulled down.  An A+ prestige school at D3 has much better recruits available to them than a C+ team, even if there's not necessarily a multiplier to it like D1.

3.  There are formulas that some coaches have published with some wriggle room, but this is one of those closely guarded secrets.  I found an older thread that had lostmyth's guide where he says 70% per letter grade.  some people assign other multipliers.

You may know all of this, I'm far from an expert, but that's what I understand now and hopefully other, better coaches will pipe up now :)
7/1/2015 10:34 AM
Thanks for the response.  So if prestige doesnt matter in d2 or d3 battles does it matter when say a D2 school goes against a D1 school.  Say a B+D2 and a A+D2 put the same effort into a player being recruited by D-D1.  Does the A+ school have a better shot of beating a D- D1 school in that scenario or is it equal?
7/1/2015 11:33 AM
There is a difference in prestige at D2 and D3...it's small but it is there....I suspect it is close to 3% per partial grade (B- to B)
7/1/2015 11:43 AM
I'd defer to Trentonjoe on the prestige in D2/3.  To me battling for recruits at D3 and D2 are much more about cash available to spend than in D1.  Obviously cash is a factor there, but at a certain level the cash gets so out of hand at D1 that the differences mostly come down to how effective that cash is spent there.

I've read that, again, in theory, a D- D1 at a certain point starts to look like an A+ D2, but to me the biggest hurdle in knocking off a D1 school in that situation would be the WOTS (if the D1 is *very* tight it will always take more cash to knock them off).  But also keep in mind that the D1 has 20k/scholarship and the D2 only has 5k per.  all things equal, if the B+ and A+ D2's both had the same amount to spend on the D1 kid I'd guess that the A+ has to put in slightly less effort to win than the B+ would.
7/1/2015 11:54 AM
It's so small and matters so infrequently it really isn't very important.
7/1/2015 12:35 PM
Posted by guyo26 on 7/1/2015 11:54:00 AM (view original):
I'd defer to Trentonjoe on the prestige in D2/3.  To me battling for recruits at D3 and D2 are much more about cash available to spend than in D1.  Obviously cash is a factor there, but at a certain level the cash gets so out of hand at D1 that the differences mostly come down to how effective that cash is spent there.

I've read that, again, in theory, a D- D1 at a certain point starts to look like an A+ D2, but to me the biggest hurdle in knocking off a D1 school in that situation would be the WOTS (if the D1 is *very* tight it will always take more cash to knock them off).  But also keep in mind that the D1 has 20k/scholarship and the D2 only has 5k per.  all things equal, if the B+ and A+ D2's both had the same amount to spend on the D1 kid I'd guess that the A+ has to put in slightly less effort to win than the B+ would.
One note, D1 scholarships are $15k per. It is $20k per NT game the conference plays, divided by the 12 teams.
7/1/2015 12:43 PM
I thought it was about 40% per letter grade.
7/1/2015 12:58 PM
Posted by Trentonjoe on 7/1/2015 11:43:00 AM (view original):
There is a difference in prestige at D2 and D3...it's small but it is there....I suspect it is close to 3% per partial grade (B- to B)
Very interesting thanks.  Could be a factor to take into consideration if you are trying to decide if it is wise to try and steal a late recruit.  Or if you are in a a battle with a higher or lower prestige school it would factor into how much to spend.  3% doesnt sound like much put if someone is a full letter grade off it becomes something worth considering.  
7/1/2015 1:02 PM
Posted by acn24 on 7/1/2015 12:43:00 PM (view original):
Posted by guyo26 on 7/1/2015 11:54:00 AM (view original):
I'd defer to Trentonjoe on the prestige in D2/3.  To me battling for recruits at D3 and D2 are much more about cash available to spend than in D1.  Obviously cash is a factor there, but at a certain level the cash gets so out of hand at D1 that the differences mostly come down to how effective that cash is spent there.

I've read that, again, in theory, a D- D1 at a certain point starts to look like an A+ D2, but to me the biggest hurdle in knocking off a D1 school in that situation would be the WOTS (if the D1 is *very* tight it will always take more cash to knock them off).  But also keep in mind that the D1 has 20k/scholarship and the D2 only has 5k per.  all things equal, if the B+ and A+ D2's both had the same amount to spend on the D1 kid I'd guess that the A+ has to put in slightly less effort to win than the B+ would.
One note, D1 scholarships are $15k per. It is $20k per NT game the conference plays, divided by the 12 teams.
Oops, yes, $15k. Looking up from D3, or even D2, still a huge amount of money per open scholarship :)
7/1/2015 1:58 PM
At C+ D1 (and big 6) I found myself in battle with an A+ D2 school.  We compared notes afterwards, and it seems my CV (at D1) were worth slightly more than his were at D2.  After we had each sent 3 CVs, I had a "slightly ahead" scholarship message.  This surprised me, as I would have thought an A+ D2 would be more comparable to a D or D- D1.  
7/1/2015 2:23 PM
Frankly, I think everyone's estimates of the value of prestige are highly questionable, and there are a number of reasons for this.  The first and most obvious is that because of all the factors involved in recruiting (prestige, recruit preferences, exact relative values of recruiting actions, etc.) coupled with the fact that we don't see exact relative recruit preferences, we're just dealing with too many variables to nail numbers down precisely.  The second is that in D1, where the prestige multiplier is big enough to really, really matter, it also makes battles across wide prestige ranges extremely rare, as they become basically untenable for the low-prestige school.  Given the range associated with each prestige grading, the fact that most battles are within a few steps of each other on the prestige scale means there can be quite a bit of uncertainty about the relative prestige of the schools involved; in fact, I'd say battles without at least ~10-15% uncertainty in relative prestige are quite hard to find in D1.  The final reason would be more important if not for the fact that most battles take place over a (relatively) narrow prestige differential.

For some reason, perhaps human nature, perhaps just because lostmyth did it, everyone seems to be trying to find a prestige multiplier on an exponential scale but fit it to a linear scale.  Obviously that's not going to work perfectly.  I'm sure a few coaches have been smart enough to do it right, but many that I've talked to seem to be blissfully unaware of the mathematical impossibility of their calculations.  That is to say, you'll see someone throw out a number like "one letter grade = 70%," and then predict that that makes 1/3 of a letter grade about 23%, or two letter grades 140%.  That's just wrong.  If one letter grade is 70%, two letter grades is ~190%.  1/3 of a letter grade is 19%.  Those aren't huge corrections, but they're not insubstantial, either.  The only way this doesn't have to be true is if total effort, as perceived by a recruit, is not a constant, but rather calculated separately for each individual battle, which is highly, highly unlikely.  I haven't played enough D1 to ascertain for myself whether the scale is actually exponential, or if it's actually a linear multiplier scale, but I can tell you for sure that it's not "70% per letter grade."  Maybe 70% for one letter grade.
7/1/2015 3:36 PM (edited)
School A has A prestige, sends 10 CVs
School B has B prestige, sends 16 CVs
School C has C prestige, sends 25 CVs

If it's 70% per letter grade, school A is beating school B, and school C is beating school A, but school B is beating school C.  Engine blows up, servers get stuck.  Maybe this is why occasionally a cycle fails to complete on time...
7/1/2015 3:35 PM
Posted by dahsdebater on 7/1/2015 3:35:00 PM (view original):
School A has A prestige, sends 10 CVs
School B has B prestige, sends 16 CVs
School C has C prestige, sends 25 CVs

If it's 70% per letter grade, school A is beating school B, and school C is beating school A, but school B is beating school C.  Engine blows up, servers get stuck.  Maybe this is why occasionally a cycle fails to complete on time...
What? School A crushes school C if it's 70% per letter. They'd have a 190% advantage (1.7*1.7 = 2.89)
7/1/2015 3:43 PM
Again, if you're smart enough to make it exponential, then yes.  Read my prior post...

Lots (LOTS) of coaches seem to expect it to be x% per letter grade, linearly.  Which obviously doesn't make any sense.

7/1/2015 4:44 PM
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Prestige multipliers in recruiting for all levels Topic

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