Maybe I am super efficient at scouting but Topic

"slogging through player after player, considering whether to scout to additional levels and then move on to next player is just drudgery"

I felt this same way. It is tedious to go through recruits with level 2 info and decide who I want to scout. Maybe filters will help a little more there. But it is a pain. I took the lazy way last time and just did some FSS states, did my own camp and then just ast coach scouting trips on already discovered players. This saved some time but if I'm building the best possible team I can, it's probably not the BEST way to do it.

Here are some my thoughts about this and what WIS is trying to do.

They're trying to make this game more involved. This is a game you pay for and the consumer wants to feel like they're getting their money's worth. So if recruiting took 15-20 minutes and even if you really enjoyed it, do you really want to spend money for that much enjoyment? A lot of us would say yes, but maybe a lot of people who have left would say no. So, you take a really fun aspect of the game and make it bigger. You make it longer. You make it ingrained in the entirety of the game by having it last all season (basically). Now, you need to also make this FUN or else smart folks won't fall for it. It's like in gaming in the old days of NES where you made games unreasonably difficult in order to artificially lengthen the game. Same type of idea here, I think. As long as it's fun, and not tedious, boring and annoying, the idea to me makes sense to making it more time consuming.

Here's another reason why I think this way. A lot of coaches are dropping teams already for various reasons but in the new HD, it's probably not going to be possible to have 10+ teams because of the time commitment. It's just too much. You'd probably think this is a huge issue to WIS and they're losing customers, right? Well I'm not sure. Who are they losing? They're losing teams from coaches are probably considered in the top 5-10% of best coaches. This means they're making deep tourney runs and racking up a lot of credits. They're extra teams are basically paying for themselves, no? So from a business standpoint, why do they want to scramble to keep having these coaches with so many teams? They're not making money from it. Or at least not very much. So, if they're able to actually attract new players to this game, I think you'd want to have folks that are average coaches who have just a couple teams.

My 2 cents on what I THINK they're trying to accomplish here.
7/26/2016 9:00 AM
Coaches who play for free are essentially as valuable as coaches that pay, because if they aren't getting the free seasons then someone else is - let alone the value to simply having more populated worlds in general. Also, if coaches are saying the heck with it and redeeming their rewards points for items like amazon gift cards, that also comes straight out of WIS' pocket. From a common sense perspective it also seems like a plan to actively root out your best players is an awful business strategy because those are also likely your most committed customers. I highly doubt this is intentionally part of Seble's plan.

But to the tedious nature of it, that's why I stopped playing beta after the first season. It was work not fun, and if I'm playing a game it's because it's supposed to be fun. Doesn't sound like this has changed any...
7/26/2016 9:12 AM
I think it's multiple things, but ultimately I'm not liking the updates and direction. It's been a fun game, and I just looked at past receipt emails, I'm over $500 in. Of course that's spread over time, but still, that's enough money I think. Most of those receipts were around 50% offset by credits, but that's still a lot of money for a game. I think it would be silly to discourage people having multiple times, at one point I was over 8 teams and clearly paying, but it's going to be hard when a person realizes that changing schools will take longer to rebuild, etc.

I'm not paying more for what I see. I'll use my credits until they run out and then just fade away.
7/26/2016 10:10 AM
Posted by npb7768 on 7/26/2016 1:20:00 AM (view original):
Posted by poncho0091 on 7/26/2016 1:06:00 AM (view original):
Posted by chapelhillne on 7/25/2016 10:23:00 PM (view original):
Yeah - it does take a little longer, depending on how in depth you want to get, but it is spread out over a much longer period. So, to me it is better.

Here's an example.

In the current system, for my Hawaii team, recruiting starts on Wednesday. I will not have a budget until tomorrow morning, so by the time I start to look at it at around 8 AM, I have 34 hours to research and come up with a game plan.

In Beta, we get our budget at 6 PM tomorrow. Scouting starts then. It is a 2 game a day world. Recruiting starts at 8 AM Saturday. If it was a one game a day world, it would start next Wednesday, I believe, so in a 2 day world, you have 4 days, and in a 1 day world you have 8 days to do scouting before recruiting even starts.

In addition, you can still scout during recruiting, and recruiting lasts longer as well. In a 2 day world, the first recruiting period starts Saturday at 8 AM and ends Thursday at 11 PM, which is 6 days. In a 1 day world, I am assuming it would be a 12 day period.

Signings start on Tuesday, which is 2 days after it begins, but I assume in a 1 day world, it is 4 days. Not that many recruits sign in the first cycle, maybe only 5% and it seems like 5% or 10% per cycle. Some recruits do not sign until the end of the first period and some do not sign until the second period, which is after the season ends.

In this game, if you miss the first cycle, you are kind of in a bad place. In Beta you are not. Also, the first cycle in this game is 2 hours. In Beta it is 9 hours, to get your first attention points out there.

So, it is a much more relaxed pace, and it gives me something to do during the season besides just setting my teams.
The problem is many of us want to scout and move on to recruiting and be done with scouting. I don't have the patience to set a little time aside each day to scout a little more. I'd rather spend my 30 minutes on the day before recruiting and be done with it.
I think you can scout that first day in gameslot #1, and then do no more scouting at all, and you'll still be fine.
Recruiting/Signing, which for Period #1 is from gameslot #21 thru gameslot #26 requires checking in every 6 hours for those days. So 4 times a day. Then things go on hold during the CT and NT and Job Opening Period, before Recruiting/Signing Period #2 opens. This is also every 6 hours for a handful of days.
Correct, but the issue is that now scouting takes longer, and I get tired of looking at it and honestly have no desire to come back to it. That raises it's own problem though. I end up putting scouting off until the last day, simply because I need to scout to find players to succeed, but I'm already burnt out on scouting from the first session. In all seriousness, the entire recruiting cycle in current HD is a little over an hour. In the beta, scouting alone takes over an hour. I'll say one nice addition is the ability to just push the button to recruit vs clicking the drop down for everything.

I'll also add, the idea to recruit everyone to level 4 in the way you are suggesting, is interesting and a time saver, although an inefficient use of resources. This imo is where more filters would help. I don't necessarily want to scout everyone in the state, but if I could filter is to guys who are say C or higher in defense categories, then scout all of them, I'd be more interested.
7/26/2016 7:20 PM (edited)
Posted by jsajsa on 7/26/2016 9:12:00 AM (view original):
Coaches who play for free are essentially as valuable as coaches that pay, because if they aren't getting the free seasons then someone else is - let alone the value to simply having more populated worlds in general. Also, if coaches are saying the heck with it and redeeming their rewards points for items like amazon gift cards, that also comes straight out of WIS' pocket. From a common sense perspective it also seems like a plan to actively root out your best players is an awful business strategy because those are also likely your most committed customers. I highly doubt this is intentionally part of Seble's plan.

But to the tedious nature of it, that's why I stopped playing beta after the first season. It was work not fun, and if I'm playing a game it's because it's supposed to be fun. Doesn't sound like this has changed any...
Same. I did 2 seasons of beta before being worn down by it. I'm not against complexity but it must be strategic complexity instead of button pushing complexity. I've said it 10 times before but I still don't understand how separating scouting and recruiting budgets improves strategy.
7/26/2016 7:48 PM

I still don't understand how separating scouting and recruiting budgets improves strategy.



If it wasn't clear making strategy a big part of the update wasn't a top priority let alone any priority at all, pretty much everything is hugely dependant on luck and how much time you spend clicking everyone to level 2 then level 4 because scouting levels are still a mess...
7/27/2016 4:39 PM
doctors reporting a malady similar to carpal tunnel

they are provisionally calling it "beta clicking syndrome" where the index finger develops fatigue and the brain simultaneously develops numbness as one clicks through recruit after recruit individually, and clicks from level to level of scouting on each recruit, trying to discover good and gettable recruits.
7/27/2016 4:49 PM
Spudtard woke up from his nap
7/28/2016 12:59 AM
Posted by CoachSpud on 7/27/2016 10:08:00 PM (view original):
Funny, isn't it, how these boards are sometimes so negative and the beta boards are nothing like that. That's cool. Keep it over here.
not a fair summary of the beta boards

but in any event, I am definitely gone once the beta launches. I cant read column headings in a lot of the data - seble's answer is that my browser version is old. Well, there is absolutely no site on the internet where I have a problem. Only in the WIS beta. And it isnt some fancy feature - it is reading column headings which display as white text on white background for me. No interest by WIS in a solution. Zero. And hence I am for sure gone.

And no doubt others who are not in the beta will have similar issues and with customer "support" like that will be gone.

Enjoy a game that rewards persistent clicking rather than analytic prowess. Out.
7/28/2016 6:56 AM
you see thats the thing spud wants to be rewarded for persistent clicking because unlike the longtime coaches who need protection, spud needs protection from coaches with talent which is why he enjoys a system that tries as much as possible to take out any strategy.
7/28/2016 7:23 AM
Dude (op), I am right there with you. I have time to play the game. I really didn't mind the recruiting update we it first came out and was talked about. Something new to change it up kind of thing...I started with two beta teams. A D1 and a D3. Beta is just too time consuming when compared to the way it is now. It isn't that I don't like Beta but it could be stream-lined some. Click. Click. Click.
7/28/2016 9:53 AM
Funny, isn't it, how these boards are sometimes so negative and the beta boards are nothing like that. That's cool. Keep it over here.
7/28/2016 12:09 PM
fd343ny -- I was going to start this same exact post, but you beat me to it. Scouting is agonizing. It may be more realistic -- but it's the miserable, painful part of realism that makes being a RL coach a job, rather than a fun diversion. The exact kind of realism I try very very very hard to avoid in my real life, let alone in my "fantasy" one. I'm arguably the most successful coach ever in Smith, but when the changes kick in, I'll dread the act of recruiting far too much to continue on. Life is hard enough without volunteering for extra drudgery in what little free time I have.
It's funny -- progress is literally the streamlining of a process to reach a desired goal more easily. WIS has created the exact opposite of progress.
7/28/2016 12:42 PM
Posted by CoachSpud on 7/28/2016 12:09:00 PM (view original):
Funny, isn't it, how these boards are sometimes so negative and the beta boards are nothing like that. That's cool. Keep it over here.
#YouAllGotSpudded!
7/28/2016 12:42 PM
Yeah all you guys not on the Beta forums miss out on gems from Spud like this-

"But if the perception is that you tinkered with the D1 candy in the D1 candy store ... you'll see a rampant sense of entitlement all over these pages, and you'll need to explain it again."
7/28/2016 12:54 PM
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