All Forums > General Discussion > Non-Sports > Who would do a better job of running the USA?
10/18/2013 11:30 AM
Posted by burnsy483 on 10/18/2013 10:06:00 AM (view original):
This ties in with why a ended up voting Obama in 2012.  I wasn't thrilled with what Obama did his first term, and I was looking for a reason to vote Romney.  Aside from leaning left on social issues (which I would guess Romney did as well, honestly, he just couldn't say it) Obama had outlined a plan for the economy.  Unless I just missed something, it seemed that Romney kept saying the same line or two over and over and didn't seem to have anything concrete, and as much as I'm dissatisfied with where we are now, I'm not sure Romney would have done better.  From here we can get into "if Romney did this and didn't do this, we'd be here, etc" which is all good, but we don't know for sure. 

Compared to a lot of you guys, I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to economics.  And to be honest, the more I learn, the more I'm drifting in my thinking to the right.  There's a decent chance I'm voting republican in 2016, as long as the candidate doesn't come across as your stereotypical right-wing jackass.
Take a look at this interview with Josh Barro, a Republican politics editor at Business Insider. It's not technical at all but it covers a lot of basic economic ideas.

http://www.salon.com/2013/10/17/gop_is_crazy_and_awful_the_josh_barro_republicans_are_displeased/singleton/
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10/18/2013 12:43 PM
Like I said, I've voted for Republicans at the state and local level plenty of times. It's easy for a local politician to appeal to a broad base of voters in both parties. They don't face pressure from other members of the party to do retarded things like shut down the government. They also work within much narrower parameters. It doesn't matter what the mayor thinks of Medicare or abortion or a stimulus package or gay marriage.

But, at the Federal level, politicians' views on those (and plenty of other things) matter. It's rare that a Republican presidential candidate would fall closer to my feelings on those issues than the candidate from the Democrats.
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10/18/2013 1:20 PM
Nope. I'm saying that I consider the positions of both candidates before voting.
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10/18/2013 4:43 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 10/18/2013 1:32:00 PM (view original):
"It's rare that a Republican presidential candidate would fall closer to my feelings on those issues than the candidate from the Democrats" sounds an awful lot like a pre-determined opinion.

I'm not being critical.   I think most of America has decided before they know the candidates.   I proudly declare that I voted for Clinton both times but the fact of the matter is my situation is much different now.  Without my complete disgust with Washington gridlock, I'd be hard-pressed to vote Dem again.   I can be honest with myself on the matter.  Try it.  You'll feel better.
It's not predetermined. Once in a while, a Republican candidate for national office holds positions closer to mine than the candidate from the Democrats. In that case, I vote for the Republican. 
10/18/2013 6:41 PM
Example?
10/19/2013 1:16 AM
Theodore Roosevelt
10/19/2013 6:39 AM
ABE LINCOLN
10/19/2013 7:25 AM
Posted by burnsy483 on 10/18/2013 10:06:00 AM (view original):
This ties in with why a ended up voting Obama in 2012.  I wasn't thrilled with what Obama did his first term, and I was looking for a reason to vote Romney.  Aside from leaning left on social issues (which I would guess Romney did as well, honestly, he just couldn't say it) Obama had outlined a plan for the economy.  Unless I just missed something, it seemed that Romney kept saying the same line or two over and over and didn't seem to have anything concrete, and as much as I'm dissatisfied with where we are now, I'm not sure Romney would have done better.  From here we can get into "if Romney did this and didn't do this, we'd be here, etc" which is all good, but we don't know for sure. 

Compared to a lot of you guys, I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to economics.  And to be honest, the more I learn, the more I'm drifting in my thinking to the right.  There's a decent chance I'm voting republican in 2016, as long as the candidate doesn't come across as your stereotypical right-wing jackass.
I too am quite liberal socially (pro-choice and i have an awesomely gay brother-in-law) but I always vote with my wallet as a staunch fiscal conservative so I almost always vote R. I don't read a lot of sensationalized views from journalists which tend to be scare tactics for readership but rather I read my firms daily market reports for my news. That said I like to look at real data and from a quick glance red states (Texas,Alaska,North Dakota,Indiana) are run much more efficient while taxing residents much less than blue states (nj, Illinois, California) which to me says a lot. I also look at the financial success of others (because I work at a financial institution) and I've observed that the majority of wealthy people lean republican or fiscally conservative in their views. I think its largely to do with the fact that the core belief of a republican is to succeed on your own and never rely on the government (or anyone else) to succeed. Anyway for me it seems I stand a better chance of providing for my family (at the level I want to provide for them) by following the path set by republican fiscal views. Sounds harsh and maybe a little crude but I have 2 choices... I can either complain about the 1% or I can go out and try to be one of the 1%. I'll take the latter path ;)
10/19/2013 10:40 AM
Posted by moy23 on 10/19/2013 7:26:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 10/18/2013 10:06:00 AM (view original):
This ties in with why a ended up voting Obama in 2012.  I wasn't thrilled with what Obama did his first term, and I was looking for a reason to vote Romney.  Aside from leaning left on social issues (which I would guess Romney did as well, honestly, he just couldn't say it) Obama had outlined a plan for the economy.  Unless I just missed something, it seemed that Romney kept saying the same line or two over and over and didn't seem to have anything concrete, and as much as I'm dissatisfied with where we are now, I'm not sure Romney would have done better.  From here we can get into "if Romney did this and didn't do this, we'd be here, etc" which is all good, but we don't know for sure. 

Compared to a lot of you guys, I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to economics.  And to be honest, the more I learn, the more I'm drifting in my thinking to the right.  There's a decent chance I'm voting republican in 2016, as long as the candidate doesn't come across as your stereotypical right-wing jackass.
I too am quite liberal socially (pro-choice and i have an awesomely gay brother-in-law) but I always vote with my wallet as a staunch fiscal conservative so I almost always vote R. I don't read a lot of sensationalized views from journalists which tend to be scare tactics for readership but rather I read my firms daily market reports for my news. That said I like to look at real data and from a quick glance red states (Texas,Alaska,North Dakota,Indiana) are run much more efficient while taxing residents much less than blue states (nj, Illinois, California) which to me says a lot. I also look at the financial success of others (because I work at a financial institution) and I've observed that the majority of wealthy people lean republican or fiscally conservative in their views. I think its largely to do with the fact that the core belief of a republican is to succeed on your own and never rely on the government (or anyone else) to succeed. Anyway for me it seems I stand a better chance of providing for my family (at the level I want to provide for them) by following the path set by republican fiscal views. Sounds harsh and maybe a little crude but I have 2 choices... I can either complain about the 1% or I can go out and try to be one of the 1%. I'll take the latter path ;)
Super post!
10/19/2013 12:39 PM
That's me as well - socially quite a ways left of center, fiscally quite a ways right of center.  I think universal healthcare is a wonderful idea.  I also think it's batsh*t crazy to create new taxes to pay for it when we have all kinds of potential revenue sitting on the table.  Tax loopholes that can be closed, inefficient government spending (I'm talking about the $200 hammer, not necessarily spending on programs I don't agree with as a whole) and the like.

The difference is in the messaging.  I'm willing to bet that if you asked conservatives "Do you support the general idea that all Americans should have access to affordable healthcare?" the vast majority would say that they do.  They just want to find a reasonable way to pay for it, outside of "take some more from those who have to give to those who don't".  But liberals have done a fantastic job of convincing Americans that conservatives want to deny coverage to Americans.  Hell, the Hillary Clinton for President 2016 Facebook page had a post about all the things the Republicans asked for (and didn't get) during the shutdown.  Three of the items were "deny heathcare coverage to the president and staff, deny healthcare coverage to the cabinet and staff, deny healthcare coverage to congress and staff."  Nobody wanted to deny coverage - they wanted to get rid of the government subsidy.  It would seem that the liberal mindset then is that, if the government isn't providing something (or paying for a chunk of it), that thing isn't available.  The government isn't giving me a subsidy to buy healthcare - they must be denying me access to healthcare as well.
10/19/2013 10:12 PM
Posted by moy23 on 10/19/2013 7:26:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 10/18/2013 10:06:00 AM (view original):
This ties in with why a ended up voting Obama in 2012.  I wasn't thrilled with what Obama did his first term, and I was looking for a reason to vote Romney.  Aside from leaning left on social issues (which I would guess Romney did as well, honestly, he just couldn't say it) Obama had outlined a plan for the economy.  Unless I just missed something, it seemed that Romney kept saying the same line or two over and over and didn't seem to have anything concrete, and as much as I'm dissatisfied with where we are now, I'm not sure Romney would have done better.  From here we can get into "if Romney did this and didn't do this, we'd be here, etc" which is all good, but we don't know for sure. 

Compared to a lot of you guys, I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to economics.  And to be honest, the more I learn, the more I'm drifting in my thinking to the right.  There's a decent chance I'm voting republican in 2016, as long as the candidate doesn't come across as your stereotypical right-wing jackass.
I too am quite liberal socially (pro-choice and i have an awesomely gay brother-in-law) but I always vote with my wallet as a staunch fiscal conservative so I almost always vote R. I don't read a lot of sensationalized views from journalists which tend to be scare tactics for readership but rather I read my firms daily market reports for my news. That said I like to look at real data and from a quick glance red states (Texas,Alaska,North Dakota,Indiana) are run much more efficient while taxing residents much less than blue states (nj, Illinois, California) which to me says a lot. I also look at the financial success of others (because I work at a financial institution) and I've observed that the majority of wealthy people lean republican or fiscally conservative in their views. I think its largely to do with the fact that the core belief of a republican is to succeed on your own and never rely on the government (or anyone else) to succeed. Anyway for me it seems I stand a better chance of providing for my family (at the level I want to provide for them) by following the path set by republican fiscal views. Sounds harsh and maybe a little crude but I have 2 choices... I can either complain about the 1% or I can go out and try to be one of the 1%. I'll take the latter path ;)
“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”
10/20/2013 9:17 AM
Awesome quote. 
Kind of goes hand in hand with Marxism.
According to Marxism, capitalism is a system based on the exploitation of the proletariat by the bourgeoisie.

Most libs will deny their socialist/communist leanings. At least you've got the balls to admit it. 
Kudos!?!
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All Forums > General Discussion > Non-Sports > Who would do a better job of running the USA?

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