All Forums > Hoops Dynasty Basketball > Hoops Dynasty > NBA Draft Logic Case Study- Knight
5/7/2013 1:30 AM
I was thinking about some of my mid-major draft picks and where they went in the draft and decided to look over the recent drafts to see where the best mid-major guys are going.  To my surprise, I found that there have been ZERO first round picks from non-BCS schools in the past 10 seasons.  Something clearly changed, though, because 11 seasons ago a player from Wyoming went in the top 5 and the year before that Loyola University and Tulsa produced the top 2 selections.  Going back through the Dev Blog, there were changes made in the Draft Logic that was supposedly to fix the overvaluing of big men, but it seems it has also completely devalued mid-major players for some reason.  I find it highly unlikely that the best 30 players coming out over the past 10 seasons have all been BCS players.  

Why is this important?  It probably isn't in the grand scheme of things, but mid-majors getting guys drafted in a more normal spot may help to bump their prestige and create more power mid-majors.  

More anecdotal things to do with the draft: I think the draft, unlike the game, values height.  I've had a big man who had the ratings to go, but he was a 6'7" C and surprisingly went undrafted.  I also, a long time ago, had a guard who was worth ratings-wise, but was a 5'10" SG.  Those ar my only examples for now, but I'll try to gather more evidence in the future.  
5/7/2013 2:26 PM
Answer from CS: Prestige is a factor that goes into where a player gets drafted.  
5/7/2013 4:29 PM
Prestige also matters tremendously for EE. The change was put into place so midmajors with C prestige and a 900 rated JR doesn't leave early. 
5/7/2013 4:54 PM
It was a bit different than you recall. Midmajors were losing 750+ rated players after a 2nd round NT.

Looking at Knight, there are 42 teams with a B+ or higher prestige, 1 is a mid-major (mm_harmon at St. Joes).
5/7/2013 5:09 PM
Posted by stinenavy on 5/7/2013 4:54:00 PM (view original):
It was a bit different than you recall. Midmajors were losing 750+ rated players after a 2nd round NT.

Looking at Knight, there are 42 teams with a B+ or higher prestige, 1 is a mid-major (mm_harmon at St. Joes).
Yep, I lost a 720 C as B-, although he was 95+ in ath/reb/def/blk/lp
5/8/2013 12:01 AM
Prestige is too large a factor in who gets drafted.

(Mind you, I think the EE change referenced above was a good one; I'm talking about seniors.)

5/8/2013 12:07 AM
I guess that's what my point was girt- it's a fine EE change, but their logic applies to who gets drafted and where they get drafted, which is my issue.

Note: this is not a huge issue by any means, in fact, it is very very very very small, just something I think could be looked into further.  
5/8/2013 8:33 AM
Usually the mid-major prospects that get drafted in RL are EE's. I don't know that mid-majors want more EE's.
5/8/2013 11:17 AM
School prestige should have no bearing on where a player is drafted, because it doesn't in real life or at least is very minimal. 
5/8/2013 11:48 AM (edited)
Last 11 seasons I have had, I believe, 8 first round draft picks from Zaga, 2 were drafted #1 overall. Prestige plays a role... but you have to be able to recruit first round draftable talent to have one taken in the first round.
Much bigger issue is the lack of Mid-Majors who are good enough to take top-20 type players away from the Big-6 schools than some unforseen logic keeping short guys from small schools on a "Black List".

*Edit*
to clairify what I am trying to say:
In the current game it is VERY hard for a mid major, (with limited funds and prestige), to recruit a 1st round draftable player. Most of those guys will be swept up by the bigger, more powerful, (and richer), programs. Therefore you won't see alot of 1st round picks coming from Missouri State, or UNLV, etc, unless a group of coaches come together... fill a mid-major conference.... raise their individual prestiges to the level (B+ to A+), where they can recruit a top-20 overall player. (this can take 10-15 seasons to do from scratch).
I can be done, and in some places... ie: ( Zaga in Allen, the C-USA in Rupp), players are actually being drafted in the 1st round pretty regularly.
5/8/2013 12:27 PM
One thing about Knight, as stinenavy pointed out, is only one mid-major is at or above B+, and that's St. Joe's.  One of the reasons for this may be that most of the higher baseline mid-majors are sims right now.  Only 4 of 9 the B baselines are filled, and only 3 have consistent coaches.  Once those programs have committed coaches, I think we'll see better mid-major programs.  
5/8/2013 2:50 PM
Posted by teamrc on 5/8/2013 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Last 11 seasons I have had, I believe, 8 first round draft picks from Zaga, 2 were drafted #1 overall. Prestige plays a role... but you have to be able to recruit first round draftable talent to have one taken in the first round.
Much bigger issue is the lack of Mid-Majors who are good enough to take top-20 type players away from the Big-6 schools than some unforseen logic keeping short guys from small schools on a "Black List".

*Edit*
to clairify what I am trying to say:
In the current game it is VERY hard for a mid major, (with limited funds and prestige), to recruit a 1st round draftable player. Most of those guys will be swept up by the bigger, more powerful, (and richer), programs. Therefore you won't see alot of 1st round picks coming from Missouri State, or UNLV, etc, unless a group of coaches come together... fill a mid-major conference.... raise their individual prestiges to the level (B+ to A+), where they can recruit a top-20 overall player. (this can take 10-15 seasons to do from scratch).
I can be done, and in some places... ie: ( Zaga in Allen, the C-USA in Rupp), players are actually being drafted in the 1st round pretty regularly.
team success impacts where a player is drafted, too, if i'm not mistaken. It's not just your ability to recruit a single top-20 player, it's your ability to surround him with a team that makes a run in the tournament.
5/10/2013 8:39 AM
I'm trying to get 1 more year out of Manual Chan, so I've got him 'throttled back' a bit, but he should be a 1st rd pick.
5/10/2013 1:34 PM
I hear he's not nearly as fluid as Automatic Chan. 
But he's way better in the clutch.
5/10/2013 1:34 PM
That's a throttling joke, BTW.
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