All Forums > SimLeague Baseball > SimLeague Baseball > Pitcher 8th - Speedster 9th
6/10/2014 8:54 AM
Curious if anyone has ever pulled the Tony LaRussa batting line-up - putting the pitcher in the 8-hole and a hitter in the 9-hole?

I have Joe Morgan batting lead-off with Pete Rose batting 2nd. I have Bert Campeneris, who is not a 1 or a 2 hitter; however, I feel his speed is being wasted in the 8 hole.

Playing in a theme league.

Thoughts?
6/10/2014 9:17 AM
I do this often, especially if the 9th hitter has less than 600 PA/162.

Couldn't give you any data to suggest that it leads to more runs, etc.  My strategy is mostly to reduce fatigue, and it saves the 9th place hitter about 20 PA across the season.
6/10/2014 3:15 PM (edited)
I often do it with some decent success.

This is a little too basic, and doesn't account for speed, but it's a way to see how your Runs/Game could be optimized with different lineups: http://baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py


6/10/2014 10:58 AM
If I have a terrible hitter (pitcher or otherwise) and a high OBP high speed guy, I often do this. I don't have any data, but it makes a lot of sense.
6/13/2014 1:10 AM
I'll do it when I'm worried about fatigue. I don't even look for a speed guy, typically #9 is a good fielder with low PA and I want to keep his glove in the field. Of course that's a different reason than the LaRussa strategy, which I don't agree with. Tony first did it simply to pad McGwire's stats by getting him more baserunners, then when challenged he claimed it made strategic sense.
If my pitcher is a half-decent hitter then I don't mind batting him 8th.
6/13/2014 2:46 PM
I almost always bat the pitcher (or worst hitter in a DH league) 8th, and use a low PA who I want to preserve in the 9 slot, preferably one who is also a high OBP.  1899 John McGraw is my quintessential number 9 hitter.  The link hersheybear provided is the same that I use.
6/13/2014 4:56 PM
I've seen guys lead off there pitcher just to save pa's.  Crazy was it you??
6/16/2014 1:27 PM
Grizzly did it all the time...hit pitcher 1st I mean
6/17/2014 7:19 AM
The NY Mets just batted their starting pitcher in the no.8 spot yesterday against the Cards.
6/19/2014 8:01 AM
I don't have any hard data on this, but I've tried doing this a few times.  I find that I'd rather have the hitter bat 8th to knock in runs from the guys in front of him who get on base.  You can get some good RBIs out of your 8th hitter in SIM.  Furthermore, the pitcher who is typically batting 9th can sac bunt if the number 8 hitter gets on base so that runner is now in a better scoring position for the top of the lineup.  Just my 2 cents--I do think it's wise for you to experiment yourself. 
6/19/2014 1:15 PM
I do it frequently, especially with lower PA, speed guys with .350 OBP (i.e. the 60 steal Dave Collins)
6/19/2014 4:05 PM
Posted by hersheybear on 6/10/2014 3:15:00 PM (view original):
I often do it with some decent success.

This is a little too basic, and doesn't account for speed, but it's a way to see how your Runs/Game could be optimized with different lineups: http://baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py


That site is crap. An optimal lineup will not have the worst hitter anywhere except 9th in the order.
6/20/2014 8:08 PM
Posted by ncmusician_7 on 6/19/2014 4:06:00 PM (view original):
Posted by hersheybear on 6/10/2014 3:15:00 PM (view original):
I often do it with some decent success.

This is a little too basic, and doesn't account for speed, but it's a way to see how your Runs/Game could be optimized with different lineups: http://baseballmusings.com/cgi-bin/LineupAnalysis.py


That site is crap. An optimal lineup will not have the worst hitter anywhere except 9th in the order.
Yeah, trial and error has convinced me of that. Trust the Internet at your own risk!
6/20/2014 11:17 PM
pitcher bat 8th all the time low pa high bop speed man 9th

6/23/2014 12:37 AM
I do it often. I've had some good success using good fielding, high OBP, decent speed, low plate appearance players. 
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