I would like to point out that all my trash talking here has all but guaranteed an early exit for me.

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 3:16:00 PM (view original):
(D3): kbates1948 & ldhmnh got humped in the *** pretty good in this debacle. Now they have to run through the Tournamet twice??? Clearly, they were the best teams this season. But to retract the games and make them do it over is just wrong. I "get" the game-planning debate, but it wasn't clear and circumstantial that they would have lost regardless of moving your defense out or in a couple notches. I can't imagine a change in outcome would be justified.

to some folks, game planning is a lot more than "moving your defense out or in a couple notches".

im surprised seble rolled the games back, because it was not the lazy way to approach this problem, which is traditionally how WIS, at least pre-seble, has approached these problems. once they screwed it up, there really was no great solution, i think what he's doing is a pretty reasonable way of handling it, although i don't think its a foregone conclusion that he should have rolled it back. 

i was going to start a thread to poll on the odds of a significant screw up following the day off... but i figured that would be in bad form, especially if it never happened. to me, the whole thing is humorous, not upsetting, even though i co-coach one of the teams who got screwed (my co-coach was fairly upset, however). i suppose that just comes with years of watching the WIS show. its funny, i saw them post about the dates being off with the timeline, and noticed the schedule dates were also off, but i figured it was probably window dressing. i should have known the WIS system was more convoluted than that :)

anyway, thanks to seble for responding to this in one of the two reasonable ways to respond (roll back and reward those who get screwed from the first sim to the second, or don't roll back and reward those who lost in the first sim), in a quick and hopefully efficient manner (the hopefully is pending these games actually being executed. will be hilarious if when the s16 goes, the whole NT finishes as well ;)

Wow, we come together in a civilized manner to address our opinions and you call my opinion "horse-s#*t" Joe? Really? That's just my opinion Dude. Do we live in North Korea? My opinion isn't "horse-fecal-matter," it's just an OPINION... Dang dude, chill out...

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 4:49:00 PM (view original):
"Should reward accidents." ( Jtt) Flawed statement already. The games were sim'd already. Was this an "accident?" The engine already "knows" which team is going to win, regardless of game-planning, which some think isn't that important anyhow. Is this/was this an accident? And, if you want to call the previously sim'd games in this tournament "accidents," how many other games can be called "accidents?" I'm not here to bash on Seble, I love HD, but the simulations should have stood, regardless of game-planning. Name me a sport where they deem a "do-over" appropriate... Can't include playing wiffle ball in the back yard - or the like.

The engine does not KNOW who is going to win the games.  Every single play that happens has a Random Number Generator that does a look up against a table of probability. and a result is picked.  If you play a game 100 times in a row, the outcomes will be very different where teams are close in ability.

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 4:49:00 PM (view original):
"Should reward accidents." ( Jtt) Flawed statement already. The games were sim'd already. Was this an "accident?" The engine already "knows" which team is going to win, regardless of game-planning, which some think isn't that important anyhow. Is this/was this an accident? And, if you want to call the previously sim'd games in this tournament "accidents," how many other games can be called "accidents?" I'm not here to bash on Seble, I love HD, but the simulations should have stood, regardless of game-planning. Name me a sport where they deem a "do-over" appropriate... Can't include playing wiffle ball in the back yard - or the like.

you don't understand the context of the term accident. the simmed games were done so unintentionally, so no one had the opportunity to gameplan for them, taking out whatever skill is necessary and appropriate to make the game subjective based on the coach. 

a do-over is never appropriate in real life (golf mulligans notwithstanding) because the situation that happened here could never happen in real life. thank you for this perspective which serves to strengthen the point that this accident should be undone to allow those coaches the opportunity to adjust their settings in the manner they deem best, notwithstanding how it might play out. 


EDIT: i was wrong. there was a do-over in professional sports to correct an error: www.foxsports.com/nba/story/philadelphia-76ers-minnesota-timberwolves-game-started-over-because-of-referees-error-120314

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 5:26:00 PM (view original):
Wow, we come together in a civilized manner to address our opinions and you call my opinion "horse-s#*t" Joe? Really? That's just my opinion Dude. Do we live in North Korea? My opinion isn't "horse-fecal-matter," it's just an OPINION... Dang dude, chill out...

Sorry if I offended you. Let me try again.

Dear sir, I think you are tremendously wrong in your statement. You vastly underestimate the remaining teams and your analysis is incomplete and sloppy.

Kindest regards,
Trenton Joe

Well-stated! And I disagree with your benign attempts at explanation, but who cares?

Of course this is the right thing to do.  If games sim 9-10 hours before they're supposed to, you just have to rerun them.  "But... but... I won the first time!" isn't an argument.  "But... but... they saw how I gameplanned!" isn't a worthwhile argument either.  First of all, why tell everyone that you gameplanned?  Your opponent can't know unless you say it.  Second of all, how about the "advantage" you get from seeing your opponent's gameplan?  Oh, you're at a disadvantage because they didn't tip their hand about whether or not they tipped their hand?  Jesus.

This line of argument is a big pile of dumb.

You forgot, " I am taking my ball and going home."

Someone making that case has no balls.  BOOM!  Sigh.  Burp.  Fart.  BOOM!

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 3:16:00 PM (view original):
(D3): kbates1948 & ldhmnh got humped in the *** pretty good in this debacle. Now they have to run through the Tournamet twice??? Clearly, they were the best teams this season. But to retract the games and make them do it over is just wrong. I "get" the game-planning debate, but it wasn't clear and circumstantial that they would have lost regardless of moving your defense out or in a couple notches. I can't imagine a change in outcome would be justified.

Because I am ignoring the "do the right thing button" and focusing on being right.......I would like to point out the civilized manner of conversation included the phrase getting humped in the ***....

AND, my NYU team all ready BEAT ldmnh's Colorado team this season!.......hump that Colorado!

wait your also TJ? did not know that, this is an interesting thread.  either way noone is going to be happy

Scaturo is Trentonjoe

Posted by jtt8355 on 3/26/2015 6:06:00 PM (view original):

Posted by anavrin on 3/26/2015 4:49:00 PM (view original):
"Should reward accidents." ( Jtt) Flawed statement already. The games were sim'd already. Was this an "accident?" The engine already "knows" which team is going to win, regardless of game-planning, which some think isn't that important anyhow. Is this/was this an accident? And, if you want to call the previously sim'd games in this tournament "accidents," how many other games can be called "accidents?" I'm not here to bash on Seble, I love HD, but the simulations should have stood, regardless of game-planning. Name me a sport where they deem a "do-over" appropriate... Can't include playing wiffle ball in the back yard - or the like.

you don't understand the context of the term accident. the simmed games were done so unintentionally, so no one had the opportunity to gameplan for them, taking out whatever skill is necessary and appropriate to make the game subjective based on the coach. 

a do-over is never appropriate in real life (golf mulligans notwithstanding) because the situation that happened here could never happen in real life. thank you for this perspective which serves to strengthen the point that this accident should be undone to allow those coaches the opportunity to adjust their settings in the manner they deem best, notwithstanding how it might play out. 


EDIT: i was wrong. there was a do-over in professional sports to correct an error: www.foxsports.com/nba/story/philadelphia-76ers-minnesota-timberwolves-game-started-over-because-of-referees-error-120314

I referee wrestling for 12 years and yes there is bad time where referee starts wrestlers in wrong position or clock doesn't start. No matter how long they wrestle they revert back to the correct time and period before error happened. Just food for thought. I suck so I would be happy with just getting that far.