All Forums > Hardball Dynasty Baseball > Hardball Dynasty > Free Agency and Franchise Players
6/29/2010 9:37 PM
thanks soxfan, Beckett is the guy and that's the answer. so low patience ratings =  more likely to fo fa. I'm not whining about him not spending his entire career with me, just that I'll never get fair value because we can't trade someone who will then sign with the new team, like, ahem iain, Halladay and Santana.

 
6/29/2010 9:46 PM
Posted by jmercer77 on 6/29/2010 5:13:00 PM (view original):
So you have your cornerstone franchise player, annual Cy Young candidate that you have groomed since you traded the farm for him. He burns his minimum salary years, you take him to arbitration once (I know I should have taken him twice but the rules have changed), and then sign him to a maximum 5 year deal. At the end of the deal, he is 31 years old and has been with your BL squad for 10 seasons.

Now, he refuses to re-sign with you and will hit the open market no matter what, a decision that I assume is generated at random by WIS. You'll never get true value in the open market bacause he is a rent-a-player and the best that you can hope for is two draft picks for one of the best players in the World. 

Someone will sign him to a max contrat for max years, a contract that someone else will most likely have to deal with four seasons later when he will be declining rapidly.

Now, I know this makes it more realistic, but it makes the game less enjoyable. Shouldn't there be a better alternative? A sign and trade option? A page out of NFL and have Franchise Players? Knowing a season earlier that he won't sign with you so that you can get more value? is there any way to avoid this in the future?



it appears half these guys didn't read what you said bro. "Now, I know this makes it more realistic, but it makes the game less enjoyable."

I agree 100%. I'm going with the marlins strategy now, dont get attached to any player and trade them when they have 2 or 3 years left on their arb contract and hope for a magical year where somehow I win a ring.
6/29/2010 9:57 PM
Posted by jmercer77 on 6/29/2010 9:37:00 PM (view original):
thanks soxfan, Beckett is the guy and that's the answer. so low patience ratings =  more likely to fo fa. I'm not whining about him not spending his entire career with me, just that I'll never get fair value because we can't trade someone who will then sign with the new team, like, ahem iain, Halladay and Santana.

 
its not just low patience. If they are rated overall over an 80 or so they will leave no matter what from what I've seen. not sure I've seen a 99 patience leave but I'm not sure I've seen a guy with a 'star' with over an 80 overall not leave, thats for a bigger nerd than i to figure out.
6/29/2010 11:57 PM
A couple seasons ago I saw an elite SP in my world get traded at the deadline when everybody knew he'd be a rent-a-player.  The team that traded him fetched a couple pretty good prospects.  He got more than I would have given up.  The pitcher went for approx $16M per season on the open market, which isn't outrageous, so he could have been resigned by his original franchise. 

I agree that it is more realistic, but also less fun.

I've long thought that a certain percentage of these types of players should be willing to resign with their original team before FA but yet NOT be willing to take a home town discount.  Maybe 1.5x their normal asking price.
6/30/2010 6:55 AM
It's not less fun for the team that gets a Cy Young candidate.
6/30/2010 7:10 AM
Another owner in Griffey just made this posting overnight:

"We're happy to announce Clint Ramirez has signed an extension that will ensure he ends his career in Washington."

He signed Ramirez to a five-year deal in his second arbitration season, and then locked him up for another five before that deal expired. His OVR is 86, which is very high for a 1B, but his patience is 67, which seems to be the key difference between Ramirez and jmercer77's guy.
6/30/2010 7:18 AM (edited)
Posted by kingjohndevi on 6/29/2010 9:57:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jmercer77 on 6/29/2010 9:37:00 PM (view original):
thanks soxfan, Beckett is the guy and that's the answer. so low patience ratings =  more likely to fo fa. I'm not whining about him not spending his entire career with me, just that I'll never get fair value because we can't trade someone who will then sign with the new team, like, ahem iain, Halladay and Santana.

 
its not just low patience. If they are rated overall over an 80 or so they will leave no matter what from what I've seen. not sure I've seen a 99 patience leave but I'm not sure I've seen a guy with a 'star' with over an 80 overall not leave, thats for a bigger nerd than i to figure out.
Vincenzo Wakeland proves the above post is wrong. 

Patience is the key attribute in determining whether a guy will consider re-signing at the end of his contract. 
6/30/2010 7:21 AM
Examining further, I have a guy I selected first overall awaaaaay back in the year 2007, took to arbitration once, and locked him up in a five-year deal in the following season. He refused to sign an extension and hit the open market, but I budgeted enough to offer him a max deal, which he accepted (there were a couple of very attractive fallback options available that year in case someone overtook me).

This guy has an 83 OVR, which is very good but not incredible for a SP, but only a 55 patience.
6/30/2010 7:22 AM
I don't get your post, soxfan. Did Wakeland change franchises or not? There are different cities and owners listed.
6/30/2010 7:29 AM

I disagree with the premise of this thread.  Sure, it stinks to see your cy young candidate bolt for FA.   But, FA is much more interesting when marque players actually hit the market.  Also, its a lot harder to maintain a dynasty when you dont have the option of resigning any of your FA for way below market value. 

6/30/2010 7:54 AM
That's pretty much how the game was up until 4-5 seasons ago.  You had players for their entire careers.  People didn't like that either.
6/30/2010 8:06 AM
Here's a player I just traded for (or am in the process of having the trade approved)  He was an impending free agent, so I was only going to trade for him (or at least give up the top shelf pitching prospect for him) if he would agree to a LTC w/ his prior team prior to the deal.  85 overall,  CY Young a couple seasons ago, 3 all star games, 92 patience:

http://whatifsports.com/HBD/Pages/Popups/PlayerProfile.aspx?pid=914289

The guy is 30 this year, so he's right in the middle of his prime.  I've also traded for another cy-young contender in another world (should win it this season) who had a high patience in his contract year.  He was making 20 mil a year on the last year of his contract, the year I traded for him, but he agreed to a 3 year deal at 8 mil or so prior to the trade going thru.

http://whatifsports.com/HBD/Pages/Popups/PlayerProfile.aspx?pid=1808060

That guy is a 98 patience, 84 overall right hander with lots of sink.

so guys over 80 overall w/ enough patience will be willing to resign.
6/30/2010 8:28 AM
Posted by travisg on 6/30/2010 7:22:00 AM (view original):
I don't get your post, soxfan. Did Wakeland change franchises or not? There are different cities and owners listed.
He stayed. Signed a five year ~$10M extension at age 30. Sorry, forgot about the weirdness on his contract page.
6/30/2010 10:05 AM
Beckett is not just a star, he is the world career leader in WHIP, ERA, and OBP and OAV allowed, all while playing in a hitter friendly park his entire career. He'll be 31 when he walks, and there is absolutely no way that I will get fair value for him. WIS should be a mechanism that allows you to trade your star player that is going to walk no matter what while at the same time allowing for the team that acquires that player to sign him to a long-term deal at a premium, even if it's close to a max deal. Why not?
6/30/2010 10:07 AM
Posted by kingjohndevi on 6/29/2010 9:57:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jmercer77 on 6/29/2010 9:37:00 PM (view original):
thanks soxfan, Beckett is the guy and that's the answer. so low patience ratings =  more likely to fo fa. I'm not whining about him not spending his entire career with me, just that I'll never get fair value because we can't trade someone who will then sign with the new team, like, ahem iain, Halladay and Santana.

 
its not just low patience. If they are rated overall over an 80 or so they will leave no matter what from what I've seen. not sure I've seen a 99 patience leave but I'm not sure I've seen a guy with a 'star' with over an 80 overall not leave, thats for a bigger nerd than i to figure out.

Javier Henriquez should help disspell that "anyone rated over an 80 won't re-sign" notion. A 91 overall who was more than happy to re-sign with me for far less than what he would have gotten on the open market.

I think someone, somewhere, at some point said team sucess plays a factor in a player's decision on whether or not to re-sign with their team. I could be completely making this up, but I don't think I am. I just don't have a clue where I heard it from.

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