All Forums > SimLeague Baseball > MLB > Ichiro's 3000th Hit - 253 to go! First Ballot HOF!
8/23/2013 10:06 AM
I wonder what Ichiro's rate stats will look like after he's been a part time player for a few seasons.
8/23/2013 10:08 AM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 9:49:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, I was just making fun of statnerds.     Honestly, I've never been a fan of Ichiro but the whole walk/hit thing annoys me a bit.    Some hitters are called selfish for walking("You gotta put the ball in play and drive in the run in that situation!!") and others are called selfish for not walking("You gotta work the pitcher and get on base in that situation!!!") so the "value" probably flucuates from AB to AB.   

I'm not sure, based on his stats, that Ichiro is a HOFER.  But, as I said earlier, the FAME parts puts him in.   It's not an exact Jackie Robinson situation but he changed the way we viewed Japanese players.   He was the first position player to make an impact.   And he was a star.     Not so much with Raines.
I actually like the "fame" argument with Ichiro.  It wouldn't bother me too much if he gets in, because the stats make him borderline in the first place.  

That said, Raines was a better player.  If there was no Rickey, he's already in for being the greatest leadoff hitter of all-time.
8/23/2013 2:15 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/22/2013 1:07:00 PM (view original):
Ichiro is a HOF lock if only for the Fame part of it. 

Jeter's hit totals are doubled due to all the hot ***** banging.
**** gets lost in all the squabbling but I said this early yesterday before WAR started.
8/23/2013 2:29 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 2:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/22/2013 1:07:00 PM (view original):
Ichiro is a HOF lock if only for the Fame part of it. 

Jeter's hit totals are doubled due to all the hot ***** banging.
**** gets lost in all the squabbling but I said this early yesterday before WAR started.
You want a ribbon?
8/23/2013 3:12 PM
Nope.  Just pointing out two things:

1.  **** gets lost amidst your verbal diarhhea.

2.  The HOF doesn't have to be the best of the best but they better be groundbreakers and pretty ******* good.    Ichiro was a pop star.   Raines wasn't.   Whether or not one was slightly better than the other is irrelevant. 
8/23/2013 3:35 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 3:12:00 PM (view original):
Nope.  Just pointing out two things:

1.  **** gets lost amidst your verbal diarhhea.

2.  The HOF doesn't have to be the best of the best but they better be groundbreakers and pretty ******* good.    Ichiro was a pop star.   Raines wasn't.   Whether or not one was slightly better than the other is irrelevant. 
I'd argue more than slightly.  
8/23/2013 3:54 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 8/23/2013 3:35:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 3:12:00 PM (view original):
Nope.  Just pointing out two things:

1.  **** gets lost amidst your verbal diarhhea.

2.  The HOF doesn't have to be the best of the best but they better be groundbreakers and pretty ******* good.    Ichiro was a pop star.   Raines wasn't.   Whether or not one was slightly better than the other is irrelevant. 
I'd argue more than slightly.  
That, really the hall should be for the best players. Raines was significantly better than Ichiro. No way you can put Ichiro in and not Raines.
8/23/2013 5:20 PM
Posted by burnsy483 on 8/23/2013 3:35:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 3:12:00 PM (view original):
Nope.  Just pointing out two things:

1.  **** gets lost amidst your verbal diarhhea.

2.  The HOF doesn't have to be the best of the best but they better be groundbreakers and pretty ******* good.    Ichiro was a pop star.   Raines wasn't.   Whether or not one was slightly better than the other is irrelevant. 
I'd argue more than slightly.  
I wouldn't.    Raines compiled a lot of numbers by playing until they outlawed walkers in the OF.    His peak and Ichiro's peak were different but it could be argued that neither was more valuable.

As I've already said, I've never been an Ichiro fan.    I loved Tim Raines.   I thought Cromartie, Raines and Dawson had to be one of the best OF ever back in the day.  But Raines is Don Mattingly, replacing speed with power, if Mattingly had hung around 10 more years.
8/23/2013 5:22 PM
IOW, I'd take a shining star that burned bright and quickly flamed out over one that burned bright then hung around like a decaying dog turd in the corner of the backyard. 
8/23/2013 5:29 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/23/2013 5:22:00 PM (view original):
IOW, I'd take a shining star that burned bright and quickly flamed out over one that burned bright then hung around like a decaying dog turd in the corner of the backyard. 
A decaying dog that hit .279/.379/.411 with a 107 OPS+ over 2300+ plate appearances.

Fuckin' facts, man. Always a pain in the ***.
8/23/2013 5:34 PM
Raines had a career .385 OBP with 808 stolen bases.
Mattingly had a career .358 OBP with 14 stolen bases.

Raines was massively more valuable than Mattingly.
8/23/2013 5:34 PM
Fido dropping a Raines:

8/23/2013 5:36 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 8/23/2013 5:34:00 PM (view original):
Raines had a career .385 OBP with 808 stolen bases.
Mattingly had a career .358 OBP with 14 stolen bases.

Raines was massively more valuable than Mattingly.
You, sir, are massively retarded.
8/23/2013 5:36 PM
If Raines is ****, what the **** is Mattingly? What's waaaaaay worse than ****?

Maybe that dog ate the **** and then vomitted it back up??? Can we call that a Mattingly?
8/23/2013 5:39 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 8/23/2013 5:36:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 8/23/2013 5:34:00 PM (view original):
Raines had a career .385 OBP with 808 stolen bases.
Mattingly had a career .358 OBP with 14 stolen bases.

Raines was massively more valuable than Mattingly.
You, sir, are massively retarded.
What?   You didn't know that OBP and SB are the two single most important stats?   Well, not counting JAWS.
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