Cam Newton GOAT Thread Topic

Posted by Jtpsops on 11/11/2011 12:44:00 PM (view original):
It's just so hilarious that Cam's 2-6 record and all his INTs are the fault of his team, and yet Brady, Big Ben, et al. did well and went to Superbowls because of their defenses and running games.

I guess all Tebow's sacks are the fault of his offensive line, and his incompletions are because his WR just aren't doing enough to go up and get the ball.
Yeah, it's hilarious that the 44 other players on the roster had an impact on their respective team's success.  What a crazy ******* concept.  The Panthers' 2-6 record has nothing to do with Cam not being good and everything to do with him joining a historically bad team.  Brady and Ben played well enough to win with strong support around them.

Never blamed the INTs on the team, just said that his rate is basically average and you're harping on it way too much as if it's a huge wart when it's really not bad at all.  Most rookie QB's throw significantly more picks.
11/11/2011 1:39 PM
And yet I've seen at least two Panthers losses where they've come up just short at the end of the game and a good QB would have pushed them in for the score.  So to say it has nothing to do with Cam is ridiculous.  That team could be 4-4 with any of the other QBs you put in Cam's "league".
11/11/2011 1:42 PM
which 2 games were those?

the team could be 4-4 or 5-3 with Cam himself if they replayed the first 8 games fwiw.
11/11/2011 1:54 PM
Posted by deanod on 11/11/2011 1:39:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Jtpsops on 11/11/2011 12:44:00 PM (view original):
It's just so hilarious that Cam's 2-6 record and all his INTs are the fault of his team, and yet Brady, Big Ben, et al. did well and went to Superbowls because of their defenses and running games.

I guess all Tebow's sacks are the fault of his offensive line, and his incompletions are because his WR just aren't doing enough to go up and get the ball.
Yeah, it's hilarious that the 44 other players on the roster had an impact on their respective team's success.  What a crazy ******* concept.  The Panthers' 2-6 record has nothing to do with Cam not being good and everything to do with him joining a historically bad team.  Brady and Ben played well enough to win with strong support around them.

Never blamed the INTs on the team, just said that his rate is basically average and you're harping on it way too much as if it's a huge wart when it's really not bad at all.  Most rookie QB's throw significantly more picks.

Tebow wins games on a historically bad team and doesn't throw picks.    Wha...what????

11/11/2011 2:00 PM
Posted by deanod on 11/11/2011 1:39:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Jtpsops on 11/11/2011 12:44:00 PM (view original):
It's just so hilarious that Cam's 2-6 record and all his INTs are the fault of his team, and yet Brady, Big Ben, et al. did well and went to Superbowls because of their defenses and running games.

I guess all Tebow's sacks are the fault of his offensive line, and his incompletions are because his WR just aren't doing enough to go up and get the ball.
Yeah, it's hilarious that the 44 other players on the roster had an impact on their respective team's success.  What a crazy ******* concept.  The Panthers' 2-6 record has nothing to do with Cam not being good and everything to do with him joining a historically bad team.  Brady and Ben played well enough to win with strong support around them.

Never blamed the INTs on the team, just said that his rate is basically average and you're harping on it way too much as if it's a huge wart when it's really not bad at all.  Most rookie QB's throw significantly more picks.
The Panthers were a bad team last year, but that was mostly as a result of the injuries and the game of musical chairs at QB (and seriously Clausen and Moore were historically bad each with a QB Rating below 58.5).  In 2009, they were a middle of the road 8-8 team when they were healthier and more stable at QB (and they were coming off a 12-4 leading into that).  Sure they lose some players like Jake D. and Mushin, but last year Deangelo played just 6 games, Smith missed time and was generally uninterested, Stewart missed 2 games, etc.  Couple that with the historically bad QB play and the lame duck coach and the Panthers record was worse then the talent on the team would indicate. 
11/11/2011 3:15 PM
Part of the reason why they were that bad was the surrounding cast.

Moore's QB rating was 98.5 in 09, 55.6 last year, 79.7 this year.  This is subject to SSS but his performance for the Panthers' last year was by far his worst of his career- the supporting cast had a large bearing on this.

Other than that you don't make any point which justifies quite how bad their offense is- Smith and Stewart missing 2 games each isn't going to be their death knell.  Also I don't recall Smith being disinterested, I owned him in fantasy and I recall him being pretty ****** off about the offense most of the time.

Lame duck coach- who cares?

They were a trainwreck to watch as they failed in all facets.  It's not like the offseason magically therapied everything.
11/11/2011 3:27 PM
Cam has been waaaay better than most of us thought he would be.  Specifically, he has adapted to stay in the pocket and throw the ball downfield rather than running like a scared Tebow every time the pocket shakes a bit.

But he isn't even the best rookie QB in the NFL this year...  Andy Dalton is waaaaay better with waaaay less around him.
11/11/2011 3:34 PM
Bottom line, five of the Panthers 6 losses this season have been by 7 points or less. He has at least one pick in 4 of those.  So don't sit there and tell me he has nothing to do with his team's 2-6 record.
11/11/2011 3:34 PM
Posted by toddcommish on 11/11/2011 3:34:00 PM (view original):
Cam has been waaaay better than most of us thought he would be.  Specifically, he has adapted to stay in the pocket and throw the ball downfield rather than running like a scared Tebow every time the pocket shakes a bit.

But he isn't even the best rookie QB in the NFL this year...  Andy Dalton is waaaaay better with waaaay less around him.
you're trolling amirite
11/11/2011 3:50 PM
Posted by Jtpsops on 11/11/2011 3:34:00 PM (view original):
Bottom line, five of the Panthers 6 losses this season have been by 7 points or less. He has at least one pick in 4 of those.  So don't sit there and tell me he has nothing to do with his team's 2-6 record.
this statement would make sense if on average QB's threw 0 interceptions a game.

in reality, quarterbacks average 1 INT a game so you're holding him to an unrealistic standard of perfection with this logic.
11/11/2011 3:53 PM
Bottom line, five of the Panthers 6 losses this season have been by 7 points or less. He has at least one pick in 4 of those.  So don't sit there and tell me he has nothing to do with his team's 2-6 record.

Last year, every game that the Packers lost was by 7 or less.  I know this because they trailed by no more than 7 all season.  So..........  in any of the 6 games that they lost by less than 7 points....  if Rodgers threw a pick, he was to blame for the loss?  I am not sure I agree with this logic.
11/11/2011 3:56 PM
No I'm not. Anytime a team loses a game by one score or less and their QB threw an INT, he bears some responsibility in the loss. I'm not holding Newton to any perfect standard. I'm saying, contrary to your claim, he bears as much responsibility in those losses as his teammates.
11/11/2011 3:56 PM
Posted by eschwartz67 on 11/11/2011 3:56:00 PM (view original):
Bottom line, five of the Panthers 6 losses this season have been by 7 points or less. He has at least one pick in 4 of those.  So don't sit there and tell me he has nothing to do with his team's 2-6 record.

Last year, every game that the Packers lost was by 7 or less.  I know this because they trailed by no more than 7 all season.  So..........  in any of the 6 games that they lost by less than 7 points....  if Rodgers threw a pick, he was to blame for the loss?  I am not sure I agree with this logic.
Again, pay attention to the point being made.

Deanod has said several times that Newton is not responsible for his team being 2-6 - it's everyone else's fault. My point was that Newton is just as much responsible as his teammates in those close games where he turned the ball over.
11/11/2011 3:57 PM

JT...  I agree with you sometimes, and disagree sometimes.  Here is a little of both.

Your point is valid only if ANY stat could make you partially responsible.  If you go 23/24 for 2 TD and 0 INT, but the one incompletion was a 5 yarder to a wide open receiver in the end zone as time ran out in a 24-20 game you were losing and then lost, which you short-armed.....  well....  then you are more than partially responsible for the loss.  Each game has to be taken separately, and the game inspected to see WHERE the stats occurred from the QB.  Some incompletions hurt more than interceptions.  A hail mary at the end of a half that gets picked looks like an interception on the last drive of a game in the 2 minute drill while down 4 in the box score, yet has much less impact than an incompletion on 3rd and 3 with 3 minutes left down 5. 

I choose to look deeper into the stats than make one blanket statement that "Well, he threw an interception, so he is just as much to blame as his teammates".  Sometimes that is true.  Sometimes that is just flat out wrong.

11/11/2011 4:06 PM
Well, let me know how many of Newton's INTs were desperation hail mary's to end the half.
11/11/2011 4:10 PM
◂ Prev 1|2|3|4|5|6...21 Next ▸
Cam Newton GOAT Thread Topic

Search Criteria

Terms of Use Customer Support Privacy Statement

© 1999-2024 WhatIfSports.com, Inc. All rights reserved. WhatIfSports is a trademark of WhatIfSports.com, Inc. SimLeague, SimMatchup and iSimNow are trademarks or registered trademarks of Electronic Arts, Inc. Used under license. The names of actual companies and products mentioned herein may be the trademarks of their respective owners.