6/6/2012 6:45 PM
Posted by tufft on 6/6/2012 2:36:00 PM (view original):
Has anyone done any sort of analysis to test if ALL fielding differences are reflected in +/- plays and errors?

It seems that my pitchers have much better stats when I have a team has above average (by HBD recommendations) fielders at every position than when I don't. And that the +/- plays & errors don't come close to having enough of an impact to explain that.

I suspect that much of the impact of fielding is not shown in the box score or play-by-play.  Which means balls are caught or drop in for hits based on fielding and there is no way for us to know if any particular play had anything to do with fielding ratings.

Before I buy into the Rock In RF Theory, I'd want to see a lot of data that includes putouts, assists, and how many times a runner went 1st-3rd or scored from 2nd on balls hit to RF.   Not that I'm going to gather the data. But it would be cool if someone did. And shared it with me.  And nobody else.
 

I think this is exactly true.  When the sim is calculating....picture a field with circular range overlays for each position.  Anywhere a circle does not meet another fielders circle is open space.....if the sim determines the ball lands there, you got yourself a hit.  Not an error, a hit, which will not show up in the box score.  You cannot quantify it.  If a ball lands within a defenders circle...then other factors come into play to determine the outcome of the play.  And this is just the beginning of things happening that you cannot track, with all the ratings numbers playing a role to either increase the offensive success or decrease it.

What can you do?  Well you can stack SS all over the field and far exceed the rec's and have a great D.....but minimal offense...so you sacrifice some for the other.  Try to find that middle ground so the team wins more often than not.
6/6/2012 8:29 PM
I don't think that's true at all.  WifS has said, repeatedly, that players don't "cover" for other players.    Meaning a ball hit to RF cannot be caught by a high range CF or 2B.   While some of what they've said has proven to be incorrect, I don't think this is.    You're thinking of the field as a checkerboard where a high range player can cover 8 squares and a low range guy can only cover 2.    While that might make for an interesting board game, it doesn't feel right in a sim.
6/6/2012 9:23 PM

You're also implying that Range Factor doesn't show anything.   I know that's wrong.  The higher range player almost always has a higher RF given enough innings to get a decent sample size.

6/6/2012 10:17 PM
Hmmm, interesting. For my NL teams, I have been totally disregarding good-hitting catchers with bad PC ratings. Now it makes me think I should turn them into right fielders. 
6/6/2012 10:31 PM
6/6/2012 10:42 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/6/2012 8:29:00 PM (view original):
I don't think that's true at all.  WifS has said, repeatedly, that players don't "cover" for other players.    Meaning a ball hit to RF cannot be caught by a high range CF or 2B.   While some of what they've said has proven to be incorrect, I don't think this is.    You're thinking of the field as a checkerboard where a high range player can cover 8 squares and a low range guy can only cover 2.    While that might make for an interesting board game, it doesn't feel right in a sim.
Also, using my previous computer programming experience as a point of reference, something like that would be a real ***** to code.  I would think that an algorithm that factors in pitchers ratings, hitters ratings and a few other various factors, though complex, would be more straight-forward to design, code, test, debug and implement.
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6/7/2012 12:26 AM
I'm pretty sure there is, I've seen it posted in the forums before and it wouldn't surprise me if it popped up here simply because you asked for it!
6/7/2012 8:42 AM
I'm pretty sure booger has it and has posted it.    I halfass looked for it last night after ranger's post.    I believe he was being sarcastic.
6/7/2012 10:32 AM
I'm not a computer programmer, and it may be hard to code, but it would make sense to me to work that way.  The truth is, no one really knows exactly.  I guess more than anything I am just an old school stickler and would have a hard time playing guys out of position according to their rec's for any length of time.
6/7/2012 10:40 AM
I'd hesitate because I would fear having a 45ish arm in RF would allow runners to take an extra base as opposed to having say a 70+ arm in RF to nail anyone trying to stretch out a single. 
6/7/2012 10:52 AM
You just have to play the game as it's designed.   If there was some benefit from putting a 80/80/80/80 guy in RF, most of us would do it.    I know I was using 70+ across the board, and sacrificing some offense to do it, only to find out it wasn't helping me.

Hardball Dynasty – Fantasy Baseball Sim Games - Player Profile: Vic Cervantes  2582 IP, 6 errors, 10 assists, 13 plus plays and a RF of 1.46.

A couple of seasons later, I used Hardball Dynasty – Fantasy Baseball Sim Games - Player Profile: Felipe Lee in RF.  1010 innings, 3 errors, 6 assists, 5 negative plays with a RF of 1.36.

Using my "Positive impact" defensive formula, Lee made .144 positive plays per inning while Cervantes made .165. 

Over the course of 162x9 that 209.95 for Lee and 240.57 for Cervantes.   Cervantes .750 OPS and extra 30 plays per season doesn't equate to Lee's .892 OPS.  And we know that neither will play a full 1458 innings. 
6/7/2012 11:00 AM
FWIW, you can get a big boost in LF by playing one of those 85/65 range/glove guys that kill you in CF.

Same team as Nieve(the RF experiment).   Hardball Dynasty – Fantasy Baseball Sim Games - Player Profile: Bingo Pearson   Killing the team in CF, could win a GG in LF. 
6/7/2012 3:55 PM
Posted by rangerup on 6/7/2012 10:32:00 AM (view original):
I'm not a computer programmer, and it may be hard to code, but it would make sense to me to work that way.  The truth is, no one really knows exactly.  I guess more than anything I am just an old school stickler and would have a hard time playing guys out of position according to their rec's for any length of time.
Actually, I have asked this on more than one occasion to clarify, and we do know -- The sim does not work that way.
6/7/2012 3:59 PM
Hardball Dynasty – Fantasy Baseball Sim Games - Player Profile: Alfredo Tejeda

Ok.  I'll give it a shot with this guy.  If Adrian Gonzalez can do it in real life why can't everyone?

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