1/11/2013 2:42 PM
I can't lose a debate that science won 50 years ago.
1/11/2013 2:43 PM
Bistiza is either A) a troll (increasingly likely) or B) mentally ill

Obviously he has a pathological inability to admit that he's ever been wrong about anything.  That is a disorder right there.  But he also seems to live in an alternate reality.  In fact, he reminds me a lot of Leo DiCaprio's character in Shutter Island.  I realize this isn't a case study, but it's an example a lot of people are aware of and can understand on some level.

SPOILER ALERT: I will be giving away the plot twist at the end of Shutter Island below.  If you have NOT watched the movie and want to, you should stop reading now.  Seriously.

Annnyyyywhoooo...  At least depending on your interpretation of the novel/film, the DiCaprio character goes through virtually the entire film in a false framework in which he generates a logical, or at least quasi-logical, interpretation of information.  He fits everything he observes within the reality he perceives and it is able to make sense.  When he needs it he creates a total delusion to help fill in the cracks.  He also has misplaced snapshots of his own past which he tries to fit into this reality.  Ultimately, the framework breaks down when he's asked how he got on the boat.  How did the delusion start?  He doesn't know.

There is some reality to this.  There are several disorders that create dream-like delusions, many of which can be persistent.  This Shutter Island example is actually a good representation of how dreams or dream-like delusions work.  Everything seems real and correct in the dream, but typically backstory and motivation are missing.  You don't know why you're running somewhere, just that you need to keep doing it, and that there must be a good reason.  You may or may not know where you're going, probably not where you're coming from.  But as long as you aren't forced to think about that, the dream seems real.  This works because it mirrors how we typically think while waking.  I know that right now I'm a grad student in the UC Berkeley College of Chemistry.  I know, from context clues and a quick glance at the internet, that to get here I had to fill out an application, write a personal statement, and write something called a "Diversity Statement."  I only vaguely remember writing the personal statement, little snippets that could easily be like Leo's misplaced memories.  I don't remember what on Earth I wrote in the diversity statement as a white middle-class protestant with 2 parents.  I don't remember the application.  I remember telling people I got in, but I don't remember the letter.  Don't know if I have it anymore or not.  Anyway, there's nothing in that I couldn't easily have fabricated in my head in about 30 seconds with a few misplaced memories.  The only real proof I have that the whole thing happened is that they keep paying me.

It isn't really unreasonable to think that you might not always remember the whole backstory, and thus dreamlike delusions can feel very real to people who have them.  If bistiza is NOT a total troll (again, also very likely) I think he MUST suffer from Delusional Disorder or some similar diagnosis.  It fits with nearly all of his arguments.  Let's go back through a few of the greatest hits:

1) right here, Young Earth theory.  Bistiza wants us to believe that some meaningful number of scientists agree with him, but he can't tell us who or say anything more than "Google it, you'll find it."  He doesn't know where it is.  He just is convinced it exists.  Fits as a delusion, missing backstory.  Same with the fact that he is apparently CONVINCED that he made a strong argument for the Young Earth other than the one that bad_luck continues to quote and just keeps telling us to "go find it."  Again, he is sure it must exist, since his delusion tells him he wrote it.  But he can't quote it, or restate it, because he has no idea where it would be (since it doesn't really exist) or what it said.

2) Socialism works.  By the end of that thread he was making similar arguments that he "had explained it, go find it."  Prior to that it was "it works, but you wouldn't be able to understand it."  Either way, he got out of having to actually explain HOW it could work.  Which worked well, because while he was convinced that it can, and that he understood how, he couldn't explain it if his life depended on it.  Because he doesn't ACTUALLY know these things.  He only had a delusion of knowing them.

3) Atheism is a religion.  I agreed with him on this, at least in a sense, but the argument showed the same earmarks that suggest a delusional disorder - he's convinced that his argument is fully logical, and he has explained the logic, and continues to refer everyone to it; the problem, of course, is that it doesn't exist.  The ability to be totally convinced that he is being entirely logical, and everyone else is being totally illogical and is simply "afraid" or "uncomfortable" about hearing a dissenting argument is a common theme throughout bistiza's arguments and fits well with a standard presentation of various delusional disorders.  Being "misunderstood" is a common theme in a lower-level Grandiose delusional disorder in which the sufferer simply finds themselves to be intellectually superior and believes that everyone else just isn't capable of understanding his/her arguments.

The general themes of bistiza's arguments - that he has already explained things, that his information is out there, you just need to look for it, that his logic is irrefutable to such an extent that he shouldn't NEED to lay it out - all fit with a delusional disorder that allows him to hold beliefs that he believes have been constructed logically from facts and insights without remembering the facts, insights, or logical construction.  The fact that he also claims to be some level of expert in virtually anything he argues about also feels delusional.  There are a number of psych experts who believe delusional disorders are much more common than officially recognized because the sufferers have no insight into the fact that their delusions are delusions, they tend to be realistic enough to feel plausible, and thus there is no reason to report as mentally ill.  Typically when told they are delusional these people simply feel either superior or persecuted.  Obviously bistiza has gone in the superior direction.
1/11/2013 2:46 PM
The current reference to himself as a "puppetmaster" really supports the Grandiose Delusional Disorder theory...
1/11/2013 2:51 PM
Posted by bistiza on 1/11/2013 12:49:00 PM (view original):
Of course you're happy I came back, bad_luck. You need to keep this going so you can tell yourself you haven't lost. Too bad you don't get that I'm not going to give you a chance to participate in the actual debate again.

tecwrg, I agree bad_luck needed a fix, but I think he never really left, so he couldn't have come back.

As for me, I thought I'd express the amazing amount of laughter I've enjoyed by reading his drivel. 

There's also the things like this, specifically the middle paragraph.  He's done this a number of times, and I always assumed he was just being a *****.  Under the new delusional disorder hypothesis, he could actually believe that his arguments are so obvious and strong that the generally non-participatory observers actually would have to agree with him, rather than virtually everyone else arguing against him.  Again, outside of a delusional reality that is an almost nonsensical assumption, but if you really believed your argument was as blatantly obviously correct as he always seems to believe, it's not unreasonable to think that people would tend to agree with you.  Maybe he really thinks these comments directed at him, but not specifically mentioning him, are directed towards his opponents.
1/11/2013 2:56 PM (edited)
My vote is for bistiza being an attention whoring troll.

Constantly coming back to resurrect threads that are desperately trying to die, posing half-assed theories with little to no credible backing evidence, consistenly touting the obvious inherent validity of his non-existant arguments, and then claiming undisputed victory in every "debate" he believes he is participating in.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

He could truly be delusional.  But I think he's just pulling everybody's chain to get attention, as evidenced by how he brought this thread back to life after it had been euthanized earlier in the week.  If he truly was delusional, he'd be back every day flaunting his "victory".
1/11/2013 2:54 PM
I can't lose a debate that science won 50 years ago.

No matter what science did or did not do, you gave up, and that means you lost.
Bistiza is either A) a troll (increasingly likely) or B) mentally ill
Neither.

To be a troll, I'd have to be essentially saying things I don't believe in order to antagonize others. I'd basically have to do what bad_luck has attempted to do here. I'm not doing that - I actually believe the opinions I post. Some others can't stand to see someone disagree with them, so they have to attack, and it's childish that they can't just agree to disagree.

You suggesting I must be mentally ill is an attack in the same kind, and discredits anything else you may say.

Honestly, dahs, I you seem like  you're an intelligent person and you seem to get a lot of things, but you continually fail to grasp this concept (as do many people): Personal attacks are a fallacy in any argument, stem from ignorance, and only serve to make you appear in a negative light.

Notice I've never called anyone names for disagreeing with me or anyone else. I've never sought to insult someone simply for disagreeing. Yet that seems to be all a number of people can do, including you.

So instead of trying to attack me, just state your opinion on the topic and be done with it.

Yet you can't do that. You have to hate anyone who disagrees with you and can't separate the person from the argument, which is a shame.
1/11/2013 3:07 PM
Are you saying that bad_luck doesn't believe that the earth isn't 4.5 billion years old?
1/11/2013 3:08 PM
The current reference to himself as a "puppetmaster" really supports the Grandiose Delusional Disorder theory...

bad_luck used that term. I simply said he was my puppet because he was continually responding as I wanted him to and I wasn't doing anything he asked.
Maybe he really thinks these comments directed at him, but not specifically mentioning him, are directed towards his opponents.

No, I realize tecwrg meant the comment for me, but that doesn't make any sense because bad_luck is the one who "needed a fix" by posting, so I turned it around to where it should be.

To see that it is where it should be, all you need to do is notice that every time bad_luck has to have the last word between himself and I. While I can (and have) left the thread without having the last word, he couldn't stop posting unless he has had the last word. If you need further proof of this, I'll purposefully leave the thread again and see if he can go without responding.

Just let me know if you want me to do that, and I'll make a final post stating that it is the final post and I can guarantee bad_luck will respond to it. In fact, if I make a final post in this thread and bad_luck never responds to it at all, then I will admit I was wrong about him.

So if you want to see me admit I'm wrong, that's the way to make it happen. Then again, you have to rely on him not to respond to my post, and I'm quite confident that won't happen.
Constantly coming back to resurrect threads that are desperately trying to die

I'm fine with threads dying. I'm just finding it entertaining the way bad_luck has to have the last word.
posing half-assed theories with little to no credible backing evidence
 
I believe everything I post. Just because I don't agree with the mainstream on every topic like some kind of sheep doesn't make me a troll.
consistenly touting the obvious inherent validity of his non-existant arguments
Again, I believe in what I say. Stop launching personal attacks and I'll stop touting what I believe beyond its basic level.
1/11/2013 3:09 PM
But I think he's just pulling everybody's chain to get attention, as evidenced by how he brought this thread back to life after it had been euthanized earlier in the week.

I am the one who "euthanized" the thread!

bad_luck had to have the last word, so I posted an LOL the next time I looked at it because I found that funny.

Stop pretending that I'm the one who has to have the last word when you can clearly see it is bad_luck who is in that particular boat.
1/11/2013 3:26 PM
The last post in this thread before your "LOL" was three days ago.

So who has to have the last word?
1/11/2013 3:29 PM
I purposefully left the thread and paid it no attention for those three days. I absolutely knew when I checked it again, bad_luck would have responded, because bad_luck has to have the last word.

I was right, and it was funny to me, so I posted an LOL.

I don't care if I have the last word or not. If I cared, I would have been back to see if he posted long before I actually did check.

Notice, if he didn't need to have the last word and wanted the thread to die, bad_luck could have simply ignored my "LOL" and let it go, but he couldn't do that because he has to have the last word.

1/11/2013 3:41 PM
The fact is that nearly 72 hours had passed since the last update to this thread, and you had to come back and start it up again.

You criticize bad_luck for his need to have the last word, yet by your own actions you show that is indeed YOU who needs to have the last word.

That's a bit hypocritical, don't you think?  (Yes, I know you'll deny it).
1/11/2013 3:56 PM
The fact is that nearly 72 hours had passed since the last update to this thread, and you had to come back and start it up again.

The fact is I deliberately left the thread alone and stated as much before I left, and bad_luck had to come back and get the last word.
You criticize bad_luck for his need to have the last word, yet by your own actions you show that is indeed YOU who needs to have the last word.

You just don't get it. I responded with a simple LOL because I found it funny that bad_luck had to have the last word. He could have left it at that, but then continued on.
That's a bit hypocritical, don't you think?  (Yes, I know you'll deny it).

You have things entirely backward, either because you're confused or you are deliberately doing it.

I'll prove it to you right here, right now:

I'm not going to respond to this thread again for several days. If bad_luck makes a single post in this thread after this one, it will show you beyond any doubt that bad_luck has to have the last word.

I will only post again after bad_luck makes a post, and my post will simply be to point out he has to have the last word and is responsible for the continuation of the thread.
1/11/2013 4:01 PM
What a ******* loser you are.
1/11/2013 4:05 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 1/11/2013 2:12:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 1/8/2013 1:33:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 1/8/2013 11:54:00 AM (view original):
Here's where the war on christmas thread started getting redlined.

I moved it to a new thread. 

Here's your last post on the topic in the new thread.

Here's me, directly responding to your "evidence."

Here's you, going into hiding.
I never gave up. Here's proof.*

*I know proof isn't really your thing...you know...with the whole "believing in a young earth" brain damage you have. But just in case.
Did I lose? I linked these posts several times. I also directly quoted your "evidence." You refused to respond.

Not sure why you want this to keep going. If said something as stupid as "a young earth is equally as likely as an old one," I'd want to run away and hide. I wouldn't want to perpetuate a thread that reveals my stupidity.

I can't lose this debate because science already won it for me 50 years ago. But, please, continue.
So you're just going to ignore every challenge to your "evidence?"

Only an idiot would think the world is 10,000 years old.
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