All Forums > Gridiron Dynasty Football > Gridiron Dynasty Beta > LOL the more we try to change the same it becomes.
4/24/2013 9:35 PM
Posted by grindi on 4/24/2013 5:24:00 PM (view original):
Obviously I don't know what you are talking about.  I have no such thing.  I can click on the green xo in the pbp and see the fatigue level but nowhere does it show me the strength of the position. You could sub a crappy player in and get 100.  In your game you got beat by the #1 ranked team.  If that was the only evidence I would say the game is working properly.  I looked at the player rankings of both teams and he had the better team. 

Also as for game planning it he used pretty much the same defense based around the5-2   all season and he has 3 offenses all based around the ND and Trips.  I doubt if he changed anything for the game
Actually, he changed both about three times in the 12 hours before the game, so I didn't get a read on his intentions early by running test games. His offense was totally different, something he hadn't run all season. I suspect he changed his coverage settings on defense as well. He didn't change his base D because it's like a million key strokes to do that, but he had multiple Ds pre-programmed, and just swapped them out and tweaked them until he was comfortable with what he saw on the test games. His game plan maximized his strength (D line) with the 5-2 and minimized mine (QB strength) by setting his coverages correctly.
4/24/2013 10:38 PM
It does seem the SIMs are tougher than I remember. Their unnatural strength due to new world population makes sense. Either way I do fee the new engine is better than the 2.0 version.

When playing some tough SIMs with similar or better position ratings at some positions, game planning made the difference. In one my OL had a decent advantage to the SIMs DL. Since they run 3-4 we ran inside a lot, and more on 2nd and 3rd and short. This changed the completion of the game and we won.

And I feel the formation editor can provide a lot of miss-matches and wrinkles. Changing LBs cover/line and blitz pct for example seem to help lock the SIMs offences down a little more.

Neither of these were available to us before. The games would just be losses until we recruit and practice our squads too great a talent difference for SIMMY to handle. I would think these types of features will also help in coach v. coach battles. To be able to potentially 'coach' your team to a win is an exciting prospect.



4/25/2013 7:33 AM
As I said I like the changes.  I think it is a step in the right direction but only a step.  The SIMs should not be as strong especially in recruiting.  It doesn't bother me that my Bava team missed the POs it bothers me that a lone SIM, not in my conf division, is the one that went to the CC.  It went to the POs.  This is a problem.  Weaken the SIM recruiting by making them pick after humans and I think the game will be much better.  

Thanks noah.
4/25/2013 9:04 AM
my team is St Norbert. i expect some advantages
4/25/2013 9:44 AM
grindi, I disagree. The SIMs are already too easy to beat because the AI game-plans are so predictable. The only reason that SIMs have a chance now is because they get some decent talent. If they get nothing but the dregs, they'll all be nothing but automatic wins.

I'll concede your point that it's tough starting a rebuild in any world because of how many SIMs you have to recruit against. It's not impossible, though. I just took over  Cheyney in Leahy. We had a crappy history (15 wins in 3 seasons) and crappy vision to go with it. I had to recruit 14 players, and every one of them had SIMs on them. I didn't have much cash left when I was finished, but I pulled in a better than average class, and got every recruit I wanted. If I can do it, anyone can. You just have to learn from your mistakes.

As for the SIM going to the CC game, I can understand that you're butt hurt over it. People are still ******** about BYU winning a NC, or Auburn getting left out of the game on '04. People agitated for change after those events, too. I just don't think it's a symptom of a problem with the engine. The DII teams in Season 2 were all very comparable; the only big differences were in the freshmen recruited by humans. If you had a good recruiting class, you had a good team. I don't know about anyone else, but most of my recruiting class ended up starting because the existing talent level was so average.

So between nobody having an overpowering talent advantage, and it being only the 2nd season of beta and a lot of coaches either retreating from the game because of how long it takes to set up game plans, and people not really knowing how the game plan works, a SIM won its division. Big deal; it's season 2. In Season 1, you couldn't recruit a QB without blowing your budget. Just give it some time and let things develop. norbert has enough to do right now fixing things that are flat out WRONG, like kicks going backwards, and phantom FGs. Let him concentrate on that while we build teams, because we HAVE to build teams over several seasons if we're going to see how FIQ works. Right now, everyone pretty much has the same SIM-driven FIQ, so we can't see the effects of average skill levels against high and low skill levels. Give it a few seasons for peoples practice plans and recruiting classes  to kick in, and for norbert to work out the detail stuff in the engine mechanics.
4/28/2013 1:20 PM
Posted by grindi on 4/25/2013 7:33:00 AM (view original):
As I said I like the changes.  I think it is a step in the right direction but only a step.  The SIMs should not be as strong especially in recruiting.  It doesn't bother me that my Bava team missed the POs it bothers me that a lone SIM, not in my conf division, is the one that went to the CC.  It went to the POs.  This is a problem.  Weaken the SIM recruiting by making them pick after humans and I think the game will be much better.  

Thanks noah.
SIMs should not be weak by design ... they should recruit like average humans.

SIMs should also not lose all the time ... not because of randomness, but because they should be able to recruit.

Humans already have WAY too much advantage over SIM teams.  They never add more players if they lose a battle.  If they are targeting 20 players for 10 slots, and if they get knocked off of all 20 players early, they never try to get any other players.  This results in SIM teams taking way more walkons than human teams and makes them suck. 

Recruiting in HD is much closer and after a period of time after signings start, SIM teams can start recruiting undecided players again.

Why should SIM teams suck?


4/28/2013 1:44 PM
I actually think SIMs should have MORE recruiting advantages, to offset the crappy AI of their game-plans. Specifically, I think SIMs should be able to recruit without vision limitations. That would accomplish three important things: 1) SIMs get a shot at more high-end recruits, giving them better teams to offset the crappy AI. 2) Because the SIMs are recruiting over a wider range of recruits, there will be more undecided recruits in the lower vision range, letting newer coaches have access to more inexpensive recruits, leading to fewer AC picks. 3) Because the SIMs are now recruiting in the high-vision range, the coaches with high vision will have a harder time recruiting, instead of just slam-dunking top classes because nobody else has good enough vision to challenge them for recruits.

I recently closed out my recruiting at Rockne-Carnegie Mellon. I targeted almost 100 recruits for 11 slots. TWO of those had SIMs on them. The rest were undecided, and I signed what will almost certainly be the top GUESS class without a single battle. Seriously, it's just too damn easy at DII and DIII. norbert, let's raise the bar a little for 3.0, OK?

4/28/2013 7:52 PM
I think get rid of vision altogether, and cram DII closer up against D1A, and DIII up against DII. That's right make every recruit visable to every coach. Make a formula to rate all the teams so that the worst D1A team is just better than the DII NC, the DIII NC just below the D1AA cellar dweller (plenty of overlap).

Give the SIM teams recruiting $$ just like the humans get - so at DIII they aren't recruiting 2000 miles away, but are darn tough close to home (<250). DII would be tough to the 500, D1AA to the 1000 mile distance and D1A could go 1500. I mean to the point if a SIM is on a player- expect to lay out a bunch to turn them or battle to deadline. But also the SIM would not be 3 deep on a player before the humans start. To be simplistic - each Division should be as competitive for recruiting as D1A is now. Don't give SIMs a great advantage, but upgrade their tenacity to be more like human coaches. Let them reclaim undecideds or even lower recruit ranking teams to get recruits after they get bumped.

I personally would like to get away from the auction style recruiting. But I also feel that if I am the top dog in DIII, if on the last days of signing there are players that the upper divisions haven't signed, I should be able to pick them up (like dropdowns in HD). There are lots of things with regards to recruiting that could be improved.
4/29/2013 12:15 AM
I actually think recruiting is fine as is.  Sure there could be improvements, but let's not screw up the only thing working properly in the new engine.  There are a lot of other things that need a serious fix or a complete overhaul, I'd rather the time be spent there.
5/5/2013 7:36 AM
Actually I have figured out what I hate most about this game.  The recruiting part.  I spend hours recruiting.  Watching cycle after cycle to turn the guys I want green.  Only to have those same guys turned in the last couple of cycles.  What a waste of my time.  Powerplay manager you bid on the open market at anytime for players. You have to be able to afford their salaries.  But when you win a bid the guy is yours. you can even set a limit as to what you want to pay and have the game do it automatically.  For me, this recruiting is a big waste of time.  I've done my last.  All you poachers out there will be poaching someone else.  I am tired of doing your scouting for you.  It isn't worth it to me.
5/5/2013 8:23 AM
I agree grindi. I always hated recruiting for the same reason. We hear the argument that the player isn't yours until he signs, but it seems that it would be better for the game with some sort of game logic like you described. It would also make the sim teams better if it had the same logic.
5/5/2013 9:27 AM
Hmmm! I noticed Grindi came in on one of the guys I was on.  I knocked off 2 of the 3 Sims and was getting ready to hit him again when Grindi shows up on him all lby himself.  Funny how the shoe is on the other foot when it suits him.  I just dumped more on another guy and knocked off the Sim that was on him.  Didn't need to go after a human recruited player to get one with the same basic cores. 
5/5/2013 12:12 PM
The difficulty about this recruiting vs other games is that we don't get to pay salaries. My thoughts:

SIM teams not on recruits before humans. They will start recruiting with same budget as humans and recruit closer to home.

Make the initial recruiting about finding out about the recruit. Letters and phone calls to info (needs to be more realistic than an 350 rated recruit saying "I really like USC!") AC scouts and HC scouts to get potential and formation IQ, with potential being more like HD where it is attribute specific and not general, and Formation IQ starting in the 40 - 50 range for one formation. Give schools and recruits more personality and let the coaches look for good fits to improve their teams.
 
Give each coach one home visit per cycle and make a home visit mean the most. These would be used to get the recruit interested enough to get on his campus visit list.

Give each recruit only one campus visit when he is down to his top 5 or 3 teams. I always thought that being able to have a list of items to give the recruits for their one campus visit to your school could be a make or break thing. Have a screen for campus visit - and then drop downs for travel (from 1st class plane to bus - with different costs), hotel (Four Seasons to Motel 6), meals (Del Monico's vs Mickey D's), and extras (use you imagination from meet and greets with famous alums to frat parties). Coach would pick what they could affor and the one who impressed the recruit the most with the bid would get the inside track.

We just have to get away from this unrealistic multiple CV recruiting (Really - you live across town and I need to spend 10 CV at $800 each to convince you?).

5/5/2013 1:35 PM
Well said katz. I agree with you 110%
5/5/2013 1:54 PM
katz, I agree that the scouting phase is too basic. I'd like to see all of the "fluff" statements in the scouting report actually MEAN something. You could break the potential score into different areas, like willingness to practice, how well he learns from game experience, how disciplined he is about his training, etc. Have four or more different measurements, and a recruit that maxed them ALL would be a true STL. You could even recruit to your training plan. It would give the game more texture, but it would probably require a serious re-write to the code.

As for the CVs, it's just a matter of window dressing. You win recruits by building up interest. To get the interest, you have to spend recruiting dollars. Instead of saying "I'm going to spend $800 recruiting dollars", you say "one CV". Does it matter if you pay your rent in $100 bills or pennies? It's still the same amount in the end. In reality, recruits only have one official CV, but coaches also make hundreds of phone calls and texts. They send mailings. have dozens of different people contacting the recruits. Should we simulate all that too? Instead of buying that one CV for $800, do you want to ring up 80 AC phone calls?

runrun, late flips are part of college recruiting. While I can understand your frustration at getting jumped, have you actually done anything to prevent it? I don't know about anyone else, but if I have a key recruit, I'll pump a few CVs into him even after he turns green, just to block a late flip. I regularly keep more recruits green than I have scholarships for. That gives me ready backups, and makes it harder for someone else to get much info about my recruits just by looking at my greens.Did I work to turn him green, or did I flip him on an AC phone call? Hard to tell without keeping phase by phase track.

grindi, recruiting is a basic part of this game; probably the most enjoyable part, if you're not getting your *** kicked. If you don't LIKE recruiting, and think Powerplay Manager is better, maybe you should spend more time on that, and less time here? I also hear recruiting is easy in Tecmo Bowl...

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All Forums > Gridiron Dynasty Football > Gridiron Dynasty Beta > LOL the more we try to change the same it becomes.

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