All Forums > SimLeague Baseball > MLB > Derek Jeter's Last Stand
3/5/2014 9:01 AM
Posted by rsp777 on 3/4/2014 10:26:00 PM (view original):
My thing is that Mike won't admit that Cabby was better at 3rd than Jeter is at short...cuz he's a moron who ignores stats and goes back to pix of one bad hop. Unlike Jeter, who I can continue to produce HUNDREDS of photos of his ****** fielding.

Don't know about that. They are both pretty horrible defensively. But Jeter's what, 39? In his prime he was much better defensively than Cabrera was in 2012 and 2013. Cabrera was the worst defensive 3B in baseball over the last couple years.
3/5/2014 9:29 AM
Shouldn't this thread title be "Derek Jeter's Last Dive"?
3/5/2014 9:45 AM

Shouldn't you have STFU when I asked what signing Beltre, putting A-Rod on SS, moving Jeter to LF, Matsui to 1B and Giambi to DH would have accomplished?  

I mean, your response of "They'd have better D" was countered with "And they'd make the playoffs?"

Shouldn't that have been enough to make you realize moving 4-5 players around the season AFTER losing the WS was dumb?

3/5/2014 1:37 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/5/2014 9:45:00 AM (view original):

Shouldn't you have STFU when I asked what signing Beltre, putting A-Rod on SS, moving Jeter to LF, Matsui to 1B and Giambi to DH would have accomplished?  

I mean, your response of "They'd have better D" was countered with "And they'd make the playoffs?"

Shouldn't that have been enough to make you realize moving 4-5 players around the season AFTER losing the WS was dumb?

I never said move 4-5 players around.  Where did that come from?  I said move Jeter to LF (1).  I believe Matsui was the LF then.  He'd move to DH (2).  That's 2 moves.  Thanks dipshit.

Giambi and I believe Tino was still on the team then would be just fine at 1B.

Thanks for proving once again that you're a dumbass.
3/5/2014 2:10 PM

The Beltre signing isn't a move?     Did you watch Giambi play 1B?    If you're deadset on improving D, you start there and not at SS. 

Nonetheless, they only do the three moves(Beltre-3B, Jeter-LF, Matsui-DH), what happens then?   They make the playoffs? 

3/5/2014 5:11 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/5/2014 2:10:00 PM (view original):

The Beltre signing isn't a move?     Did you watch Giambi play 1B?    If you're deadset on improving D, you start there and not at SS. 

Nonetheless, they only do the three moves(Beltre-3B, Jeter-LF, Matsui-DH), what happens then?   They make the playoffs? 

Last I saw, Beltre played 3B.  ARod was a far superior SS than Jeter.  Those 2 are a 10 times better than a Jeter/ARod combo.  Yeah, I saw Giambi play.  He was serviceable.  

What happens then.  I'd say that they'd have been better off then and much better off now. 
3/5/2014 7:55 PM
To be fair to Mike, nomar, the big benefit of a move like that isn't replacing Jeter's D at short, it's replacing Tino's or Sierra's or Tony Clarke's or whoever's bat in the lineup with Beltre's.

So say it's Clarke you're replacing, and let's assume he was at least replacement level with the bat. You're probably picking up 25ish offensive runs over the course of the season. Considering how good the offensive already was, that translates to maybe 2 wins on a team that is already going to win between 90 and 100.

Taking that Beltre money and investing it in the pitching staff would probably yield a better return.

And you avoid upsetting the golden child.
3/5/2014 11:02 PM
Posted by 05nomar05 on 3/5/2014 9:29:00 AM (view original):
Shouldn't this thread title be "Derek Jeter's Last Dive"?
3/5/2014 11:15 PM
2012 AL 3B FIELDING

RK PLAYER TEAM GP GS FULL TC PO A E DP FPCT RF DWAR
1 Adrian Beltre TEX 129 129 1125 312 95 209 8 23 .974 2.43 0.0
2 Mike Moustakas KC 149 147 1314 454 127 312 15 41 .967 3.01 0.0
3 Miguel Cabrera DET 154 154 1322 383 127 243 13 31 .966 2.52 0.0
4 Kevin Youkilis BOS/CHW 111 107 894 248 62 177 9 20 .964 2.41 0.0
5 Alberto Callaspo LAA 131 122 1107 324 77 235 12 19 .963 2.54 0.0
6 Kyle Seager SEA 138 137 1209 338 99 226 13 20 .962 2.42 0.0
7 Brett Lawrie TOR 123 123 1072 374 84 273 17 23 .955 3.00 0.0


2013 AL 3B FIELDING

RK PLAYER TEAM GP GS FULL TC PO A E DP FPCT RF DWAR
1 Manny Machado BAL 156 156 1390 484 116 355 13 42 .973 3.05 4.4
2 Evan Longoria TB 147 145 1289 386 96 279 11 27 .972 2.62 1.7
3 Kyle Seager SEA 160 158 1425 417 94 308 15 38 .964 2.54 -0.3
4 Matt Dominguez HOU 149 149 1312 431 92 323 16 28 .963 2.85 1.4
5 Josh Donaldson OAK 155 155 1373 414 143 255 16 22 .961 2.61 1.8
6 Adrian Beltre TEX 146 146 1290 339 93 232 14 25 .959 2.27 -0.2
7 Miguel Cabrera DET 145 145 1235 283 87 184 12 24 .958 1.98 -1.4



3/5/2014 11:16 PM
Now tell me more about how "incredibly bad" Cabrera was at 3rd. I'm not saying he was Brooks Robinson by any means, but I don't think the numbers lie. Sure, his range was bad, something Jeter fans should know ALL about.
3/6/2014 1:04 AM
Fangraphs has Cabrera at -10 defensive runs in 2012 and -17 in 2013. Compared to Jeter's age 30 & 31 seasons at +4 and +2. And those are not adjusted for position, widening the gap.
3/6/2014 6:56 AM
Posted by 05nomar05 on 3/5/2014 5:11:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/5/2014 2:10:00 PM (view original):

The Beltre signing isn't a move?     Did you watch Giambi play 1B?    If you're deadset on improving D, you start there and not at SS. 

Nonetheless, they only do the three moves(Beltre-3B, Jeter-LF, Matsui-DH), what happens then?   They make the playoffs? 

Last I saw, Beltre played 3B.  ARod was a far superior SS than Jeter.  Those 2 are a 10 times better than a Jeter/ARod combo.  Yeah, I saw Giambi play.  He was serviceable.  

What happens then.  I'd say that they'd have been better off then and much better off now. 

1.   Either you didn't see Giambi play 1B

or

2.   You don't understand the meaning of "seviceable".

You tell me.

3/6/2014 11:06 AM
If you think the first baseman's only job is to catch throws, then yeah, Giambi was "serviceable".  Kinda like David Ortiz.
3/6/2014 11:49 AM
He did play almost 900 innings for the Yankees at first in 2008 and over 700 in both 2002 and 2003, so the suggestion that he play there full time in 2005 isn't absurd. 

And he was just below average, not a disaster, and the difference is probably overcome by lineup and other positional improvements the Yankees would be making.
3/6/2014 11:54 AM
Posted by bad_luck on 3/6/2014 11:49:00 AM (view original):
He did play almost 900 innings for the Yankees at first in 2008 and over 700 in both 2002 and 2003, so the suggestion that he play there full time in 2005 isn't absurd. 

And he was just below average, not a disaster, and the difference is probably overcome by lineup and other positional improvements the Yankees would be making.
What B_L said here.

His bat (early part of his Yankee career) more than made up for his glove.  He wasn't the worst 1B either.
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