All Forums > Hoops Dynasty Basketball > Hoops Dynasty > Ivy League better RPI than ACC and Big 12 - Phelan
3/20/2014 4:49 AM
Posted by gvsujulius on 3/19/2014 11:46:00 PM (view original):
Come on back dac
probaby won't qualify for a couple seasons...
3/20/2014 11:15 AM
coaches who face "existential dilemmas" belong in the Ivy League!
3/20/2014 11:15 AM
This might be the most misleading thing I've seen in a while.  Did anyone bother to look at the actual wins the teams have out of conference?

One team beat the #6 RPI team in a big upset.

One team beat the #56 RPI team.

Other than those two wins, no other team in the entire conference has an out of conference win against a team with an RPI less than 62.  If it proves anything it's that the RPI number is pretty meaningless on its own.

3/20/2014 11:55 AM
Most people are aware that RPI is easy to manipulate. In the past many conferences have made the agreement to play as easy schedules as possible so that everyone can get 8-10 wins which would then bump the SOS way up during conference play, thus bumping up the RPI. This is how you build up a conference intelligently. You don't just instantly schedule tough.
3/20/2014 12:09 PM
You said:

"Find it amusing that so many people that were saying it is near impossible for mid majors to compete with BCS conferences have steered clear of this thread."

They aren't competing with the BCS conferences.  They are manuipulating their RPI to look better than they are.  They won't likely get more than one NT win over the entire conference and might be lucky to get that.  When they actually starting winning games against BCS teams both regular season and NT then you have something to talk about.

3/20/2014 1:58 PM
Posted by Lizak on 3/20/2014 12:10:00 PM (view original):
You said:

"Find it amusing that so many people that were saying it is near impossible for mid majors to compete with BCS conferences have steered clear of this thread."

They aren't competing with the BCS conferences.  They are manuipulating their RPI to look better than they are.  They won't likely get more than one NT win over the entire conference and might be lucky to get that.  When they actually starting winning games against BCS teams both regular season and NT then you have something to talk about.

exactly... 
3/20/2014 2:25 PM (edited)
Posted by gillispie1 on 3/20/2014 1:58:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Lizak on 3/20/2014 12:10:00 PM (view original):
You said:

"Find it amusing that so many people that were saying it is near impossible for mid majors to compete with BCS conferences have steered clear of this thread."

They aren't competing with the BCS conferences.  They are manuipulating their RPI to look better than they are.  They won't likely get more than one NT win over the entire conference and might be lucky to get that.  When they actually starting winning games against BCS teams both regular season and NT then you have something to talk about.

exactly... 
Why "exactly?" While it may be true that dear Ivy (Phelan) notches only one NT win this season (and it sure will not be from my rebuilding Dartmouth), there is no basis for saying that Ivy teams are "manipulating their RPI to look better than they are," or scheduling OOC in any manner, shape or form different from power conferences (or any conferences, for that matter), & a quick look at Phelan IVY OOC disproves the contention of gamesmanship. That's just silly, irresponsible journalism, fellas.  

Honor remains intact in Phelan Ivy. If any member team was suspected of manipulating its RPI in some untoward way, we would be required, as men of the Ivy, to turn them in.
3/20/2014 3:55 PM
MyGeneration - I think you are missing the point.  Regardless of how the RPI got to where it is, it is a false indicator of the quality of the conference in this case.  No offense intended in that.  I play in the Patriot so I'm not one to throw stones.

I'm just trying to put a little sanity into the thread because some seem to think the RPI rating in the Ivy means something when obviously the only thing it means is the RPI can be very misleading in some cases.
3/20/2014 4:45 PM
Lizak - even if we only win 1 NT game, we may get 3-4 teams in and that will help with postseason cash. It is a slow process to build up a conference, doesn't happen overnight.
3/20/2014 5:40 PM
Dac. MWC.  And also consider the likelihood of a solid coach picking up Utah from simmy soon.  And with this, you will be granted a worthy challenge with a worthy reward...true threats to the BCS money east and west at a consistent level.  I think the MWC is much closer than the Ivy personally...(sorry guys!).  Dac+MWC not for that reason of power equality...we are just fans.  Food for thought...gotta chew while the struggle within rages.  Plenty of quality coaches with which to both learn, teach, and appreciate. 
3/20/2014 5:49 PM
Agreed Giles, if I could go back I would have joined the MWC
3/20/2014 5:53 PM
Posted by MyGeneration on 3/20/2014 2:25:00 PM (view original):
Posted by gillispie1 on 3/20/2014 1:58:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Lizak on 3/20/2014 12:10:00 PM (view original):
You said:

"Find it amusing that so many people that were saying it is near impossible for mid majors to compete with BCS conferences have steered clear of this thread."

They aren't competing with the BCS conferences.  They are manuipulating their RPI to look better than they are.  They won't likely get more than one NT win over the entire conference and might be lucky to get that.  When they actually starting winning games against BCS teams both regular season and NT then you have something to talk about.

exactly... 
Why "exactly?" While it may be true that dear Ivy (Phelan) notches only one NT win this season (and it sure will not be from my rebuilding Dartmouth), there is no basis for saying that Ivy teams are "manipulating their RPI to look better than they are," or scheduling OOC in any manner, shape or form different from power conferences (or any conferences, for that matter), & a quick look at Phelan IVY OOC disproves the contention of gamesmanship. That's just silly, irresponsible journalism, fellas.  

Honor remains intact in Phelan Ivy. If any member team was suspected of manipulating its RPI in some untoward way, we would be required, as men of the Ivy, to turn them in.
the "exactly" was really to kmason. he brings up this example that in no way demonstrates anything, in reference to the original argument about the difficulty of mid majors competing at a high level. i did avoid posting because really he is better than that :) this is a worthless waste of time example and he knows it (see his post about 6 up).

the "exactly" had nothing to do with the ivy conference or anyone in it. i was not questioning your honor and i doubt lizak was either. also, by saying, "this proves nothing", im not slamming the ivy league in any way. it just proves nothing re: the mid major argument. its a ****** example for kmason to bring up because he basically forces the response, "well, they haven't done anything big enough to talk about yet", which is hard to say in a non-offensive way. but please take it that way, because no offense is intended :) or at least, if you take offense, blame kmason - its his crappy example :) to me its really more along the lines of baiting than attempting to further a substansive discussion - thats why i avoided responding in the first place, and kept my original response to 1 word.
3/20/2014 6:07 PM
We haven't done anything and we know that. It is nice to have a good RPI but we aren't going to be competing for an NC. I will likely be leaving BU to go to a BCS conference this year if there is an attractive opening.
3/20/2014 6:16 PM
As a new coach in the Ivy, I think there is potential here.  Some good opportunities and some nice places open. 

We're just playing the schedule we inherited - which was darn tough because of bunch of quality teams wanted to play Harvard. 

As a conference, we need to win lots of games, build some prestige, get to the NT and sooner or later start winning some games.  But, as the new guy I'm just trying to get these players to do their best, succeed academically and boost our prestige.
3/20/2014 6:53 PM
Agreed with gillespie on this issue. Kmason seems to be taking victory laps when there isn't much of an accomplishment here.
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