All Forums > SimLeague Baseball > MLB > Adrian Beltre
7/23/2014 1:23 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/21/2014 7:36:00 PM (view original):
Ken Griffey didn't have a problem in Seattle.
Neither did Edgar Martinez

Piazza hit in LA?

We are talking HOF here, not just being an all-star
Griffey asked to be traded because he didn't like hitting in Safeco Field!
7/23/2014 3:39 PM
Yet he led the league with 48 hrs his last year in Seattle
7/23/2014 3:44 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/22/2014 7:05:00 PM (view original):
The more I think about it the more I don't care either that he is using something

A lock HOF does not hit like an average player for 5 consecutive years
Since when is that the standard? Willie Mays hit .283 and averaged 25 HR and 79 RBI from 66-70. I'm not a fan of using the BA/HR/RBI line but that's what you used.

Instead of focusing on just five years, why not consider his career as a whole?

I think a guys who gets 3000 hits, close to 500 home runs, and has a two decade track record of exceptional defense at third deserves to be in. 
Yeah, and it was in Candlestick when he was 35-40 yrs old (I don't like to use ballparks as an excuse but everyone else is)

Can't help wondering why a lock HOF hits for barely above the league average in the prime of his career age wise.
7/23/2014 3:50 PM (edited)
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages
7/23/2014 4:06 PM
Randy should get a tremendously high voting percentage next year, like one of the best of all-time.
7/23/2014 4:16 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:44:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/22/2014 7:05:00 PM (view original):
The more I think about it the more I don't care either that he is using something

A lock HOF does not hit like an average player for 5 consecutive years
Since when is that the standard? Willie Mays hit .283 and averaged 25 HR and 79 RBI from 66-70. I'm not a fan of using the BA/HR/RBI line but that's what you used.

Instead of focusing on just five years, why not consider his career as a whole?

I think a guys who gets 3000 hits, close to 500 home runs, and has a two decade track record of exceptional defense at third deserves to be in. 
Yeah, and it was in Candlestick when he was 35-40 yrs old (I don't like to use ballparks as an excuse but everyone else is)

Can't help wondering why a lock HOF hits for barely above the league average in the prime of his career age wise.
Again, why focus on just a small portion of the career? The entire career counts. It's very likely that Beltre finishes with over 3,000 hits and close to 500 home runs. Add in two decades of exceptional defense at third and you have a Hall of Fame player.
7/23/2014 4:29 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:50:00 PM (view original):
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages
Is that the standard? Randy Johnson is arguably one of the ten best pitchers of all time, maybe top 5 if you toss out the turn of the century guys.
7/23/2014 5:02 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:50:00 PM (view original):
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages

Exactly.   If you have to explain, to a baseball fan, why a guy should be in the HOF, he shouldn't be in the HOF.

7/23/2014 6:33 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/23/2014 5:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:50:00 PM (view original):
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages

Exactly.   If you have to explain, to a baseball fan, why a guy should be in the HOF, he shouldn't be in the HOF.

Argumentum ad populum


He deserves to be in or out based on his accomplishments. Whether or not the case has to be made to "baseball fan[s]" is irrelevant. Fans are often idiots.
7/23/2014 8:21 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 4:29:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:50:00 PM (view original):
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages
Is that the standard? Randy Johnson is arguably one of the ten best pitchers of all time, maybe top 5 if you toss out the turn of the century guys.
that's what you took out of what I was trying to say?
7/23/2014 8:23 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 4:16:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:44:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/22/2014 7:05:00 PM (view original):
The more I think about it the more I don't care either that he is using something

A lock HOF does not hit like an average player for 5 consecutive years
Since when is that the standard? Willie Mays hit .283 and averaged 25 HR and 79 RBI from 66-70. I'm not a fan of using the BA/HR/RBI line but that's what you used.

Instead of focusing on just five years, why not consider his career as a whole?

I think a guys who gets 3000 hits, close to 500 home runs, and has a two decade track record of exceptional defense at third deserves to be in. 
Yeah, and it was in Candlestick when he was 35-40 yrs old (I don't like to use ballparks as an excuse but everyone else is)

Can't help wondering why a lock HOF hits for barely above the league average in the prime of his career age wise.
Again, why focus on just a small portion of the career? The entire career counts. It's very likely that Beltre finishes with over 3,000 hits and close to 500 home runs. Add in two decades of exceptional defense at third and you have a Hall of Fame player.
If he plays 4 more seasons, he will have played for 21 years. that is less than 150 hits a year to get to 3000 hits. That is less than 24 homers a year to get to 500. That's a hall of famer?
That's a compiler
Beltre is an All-Star.
He is not a Hall of Famer.
This post has a rating of , which is below the default threshold.
7/23/2014 9:09 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 8:21:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 4:29:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:50:00 PM (view original):
I love debating baseball, but if you gotta talk a player up to get into the Hall, he ain't a HOF.

If this tread had the headline "Randy Johnson" and it was a vote on whether or not he was a HOF, it would not have gone 3 pages
Is that the standard? Randy Johnson is arguably one of the ten best pitchers of all time, maybe top 5 if you toss out the turn of the century guys.
that's what you took out of what I was trying to say?
You tell me, what is it you're saying?
7/23/2014 9:10 PM
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 8:25:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 4:16:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/23/2014 3:44:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/23/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by cobra on 7/22/2014 7:05:00 PM (view original):
The more I think about it the more I don't care either that he is using something

A lock HOF does not hit like an average player for 5 consecutive years
Since when is that the standard? Willie Mays hit .283 and averaged 25 HR and 79 RBI from 66-70. I'm not a fan of using the BA/HR/RBI line but that's what you used.

Instead of focusing on just five years, why not consider his career as a whole?

I think a guys who gets 3000 hits, close to 500 home runs, and has a two decade track record of exceptional defense at third deserves to be in. 
Yeah, and it was in Candlestick when he was 35-40 yrs old (I don't like to use ballparks as an excuse but everyone else is)

Can't help wondering why a lock HOF hits for barely above the league average in the prime of his career age wise.
Again, why focus on just a small portion of the career? The entire career counts. It's very likely that Beltre finishes with over 3,000 hits and close to 500 home runs. Add in two decades of exceptional defense at third and you have a Hall of Fame player.
If he plays 4 more seasons, he will have played for 21 years. that is less than 150 hits a year to get to 3000 hits. That is less than 24 homers a year to get to 500. That's a hall of famer?
That's a compiler
Beltre is an All-Star.
He is not a Hall of Famer.
How many players have been able to average 150 hits and 24 home runs a year for 21 years?
7/23/2014 9:30 PM
H R RBI OPS+ GG AS
2534 1229 1360 115 4 4
Those are the numbers at the moment.
That doesn't look like a HOF yet.
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