Posted by MikeT23 on 1/8/2017 10:40:00 PM (view original):
All BS aside. Google "sim basketball". 1 and 2 on the list were www.whatifsports.com on my list.

Not everyone is going to use the same search as you, and others who are new to this type of game may not know what to call it. You're right "sim basketball" is at the top, but using the terms Monsterturtl used "simulation basketball coaching games", it's 3rd. Yes, that's still easy to find, but it's got one reference amongst a whole page of different sites. Chances are someone is going to click on the top one.

Furthermore, some of these sites are free to play. Odds are free is more appealing.

It's an impulse purchase.

Let's say you go to the store to buy some milk. On the way out you pass by the ice cream and see a new flavor that looks delicious. Even though you had no intention of buying ice cream, you decide to try it out.

It's the same concept here except foxsports.com is the store. You go there to check out scores, read some articles, whatever. Then while perusing the site, you see an ad and link to a basketball simulation game so you click on it and see what it's all about. After figuring out what the game is, you think it looks fun and decide to give it a try.

There are MILLIONS of basketball fans out there and we're talking about losing a couple hundred users. There are people out there who would really enjoy this game but they need to know it exists. Relying on them to find the game themselves is a really poor business model.

This is my take on things. If the game doesn't cease to exist, then you have far greater odds at the NT, PIT and ultimately the Champiomships in both. It's crappy to look at it that way, but can you imagine being in a world with 300 users every season and making the NT half the time? Some users may never even make it once and obviously they'll leave in that event. They spent the money on the upgrade, they have other games to close shop on before HD ever hits the chopping block.

I'm not suggesting they shouldn't market. All I'm saying is a massive marketing campaign isn't going to bring in 100s of future long-term owners. Impulse buyers aren't likely to stick around. Those that will stick will be the ones actively looking for something like this.

I'm sure you guys are aware of ROI. WifS puts 10k into marketing. Introductory price is $4.95. They need over 2000 users to join just to cover the initial marketing. $4.95 is likely a break even point. So, how many and how long, do they need some of that 2000 to stay to make it worth it?

Posted by Benis on 1/9/2017 7:13:00 AM (view original):
It's an impulse purchase.

Let's say you go to the store to buy some milk. On the way out you pass by the ice cream and see a new flavor that looks delicious. Even though you had no intention of buying ice cream, you decide to try it out.

It's the same concept here except foxsports.com is the store. You go there to check out scores, read some articles, whatever. Then while perusing the site, you see an ad and link to a basketball simulation game so you click on it and see what it's all about. After figuring out what the game is, you think it looks fun and decide to give it a try.

There are MILLIONS of basketball fans out there and we're talking about losing a couple hundred users. There are people out there who would really enjoy this game but they need to know it exists. Relying on them to find the game themselves is a really poor business model.

if I were Fox and I want WIS to succeed, I would not just put some adverts on Fox

1. get some Fox blogger/columnist to play and write about it - like Bill Simmons did once upon a time
2. run some features based on WIS products - like the modelling of playoff games, like the games between historical teams - put up results of SIMs of bama v clemson - SIMs of the NFL playoffs - SIMs of matchups between the Michael Jordan Bulls and the LeBron Cavs - between different Duke championship teams......generate some attention or controversy....

or be totally silent and rely on customers ability to find you if they search for you. That, after all is how, McDonalds, sells its products. Like, a decade ago before the internet they ran tv ads - but now they know that anyone can find McDonalds so they stopped advertising. But those old tv ads were fun.

It really is a niche' market. I imagine WifS would give a FOX blogger free team after free team IF they wanted to play. Some of the least attentive users in HBD have been WifS' employees.

Don't spend much, market constantly on social medias.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/9/2017 8:29:00 AM (view original):
I'm not suggesting they shouldn't market. All I'm saying is a massive marketing campaign isn't going to bring in 100s of future long-term owners. Impulse buyers aren't likely to stick around. Those that will stick will be the ones actively looking for something like this.

I'm sure you guys are aware of ROI. WifS puts 10k into marketing. Introductory price is $4.95. They need over 2000 users to join just to cover the initial marketing. $4.95 is likely a break even point. So, how many and how long, do they need some of that 2000 to stay to make it worth it?

I work in digital strategy at a fairly large ad agency. If they were to invest 10k into a digital e-commerce campaign, an average expectation would be an ROI of 3. The expectation would be higher if they're hitting an audience that has never seen the brand.

The fact that WIS isn't at least running paid social campaigns is kind of baffling to me.

I'm not sure WifS is very profitable for FOX. I'm almost positive it is not. That would explain the lack of dedication to advertising and/or game adjustments.

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/9/2017 9:10:00 AM (view original):
I'm not sure WifS is very profitable for FOX. I'm almost positive it is not. That would explain the lack of dedication to advertising and/or game adjustments.

It's kind of a catch 22 though. How can you expect to be profitable, if you don't advertise and no one knows your product exists?

especially if you have very low marginal costs

Posted by poncho0091 on 1/10/2017 2:10:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/9/2017 9:10:00 AM (view original):
I'm not sure WifS is very profitable for FOX. I'm almost positive it is not. That would explain the lack of dedication to advertising and/or game adjustments.

It's kind of a catch 22 though. How can you expect to be profitable, if you don't advertise and no one knows your product exists?

I would hope they've done their research and know there is a limited market for sim games.

I can advertise the hell out a tomato and ice cream sandwiches but, if people don't find that enticing, they're not going to sell.

research? WIS? tell us another joke!

Well, they asked three dudes in a bar after work. None were interested. Research conclusive!!!

Posted by MikeT23 on 1/10/2017 8:37:00 AM (view original):
Well, they asked three dudes in a bar after work. None were interested. Research conclusive!!!

Crickets....