ESPN HOF ballot revealed. Topic

burnsy483
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Posted by tecwrg on 1/14/2014 10:49:00 AM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 1/14/2014 9:34:00 AM (view original):
Cy Youngs and wins.  OK.  I know we hate hypotheticals, but I'll ask tec this - if it wasn't for the 300 wins, do you think he's in?  If he finished with 285, is he a HOFer?
Cut the last two years off his career, and he's at 290 wins.  So let's go with that.

Sure.  He still has five 20-win seasons, six top-3 CYA finishes (as well as two wins).  Plus, his "rate stats" improve slightly because those final two seasons dragged those numbers down a bit.

I'd say he's in at 290.  Probably not on the first ballot, but certainly within 2 or 3 elections.
OK, so your argument isn't that the 300 wins is an achievement, it's that he has a bunch more wins than Moose.  We'll disagree with your argument on why Glavine is deserving and Mussina is not.  Wins are great, but I'd argue all the other stats Mussina leads in makes him just as deserving as Glavine.  Gonna move on now.
1/14/2014 11:14 AM
MikeT23
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Sure.   You say wins are meaningless.   I say only good pitchers can reach that milestone.     Is it a meaningless milestone?   

That's a yes/no question. 

1/14/2014 11:14 AM
burnsy483
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Posted by MikeT23 on 1/14/2014 11:14:00 AM (view original):

Sure.   You say wins are meaningless.   I say only good pitchers can reach that milestone.     Is it a meaningless milestone?   

That's a yes/no question. 

Yea, this is good because we've never had this conversation before.
1/14/2014 11:19 AM
bad_luck
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Since 1940, the 10 guys with the most walks allowed:

Ryan
Carlton
Phil Niekro
Wynn
Hough
Clemens
Glavine
Randy Johnson
Spahn
Seaver

Maybe we should start letting guys into the hall who walk a lot of batters over their entire career?




1/14/2014 11:21 AM
MikeT23
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Isn't every HOF discussion on repeat? 
1/14/2014 11:21 AM
bad_luck
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Posted by MikeT23 on 1/14/2014 11:14:00 AM (view original):

Sure.   You say wins are meaningless.   I say only good pitchers can reach that milestone.     Is it a meaningless milestone?   

That's a yes/no question. 

It is meaningless. There is no real difference between a 305 game winner and a 270 game winner. It's an arbitrary round number.

Also, Mussina is number 33 on the all time wins list. Are you saying there shouldn't be 33 pitchers in the hall of fame?

Also #2, Mariano Rivera is number 764 on the all time wins list. No hall for you, Mariano.
1/14/2014 11:30 AM
MikeT23
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Hehe.  That's dumb.  Even for you.
1/14/2014 11:32 AM
bad_luck
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Posted by MikeT23 on 1/14/2014 11:32:00 AM (view original):
Hehe.  That's dumb.  Even for you.
Why is that dumb?
1/14/2014 11:49 AM
bad_luck
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Who had a better 1992, Jack Morris or Curt Schilling?
1/14/2014 11:52 AM
tecwrg
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Posted by bad_luck on 1/14/2014 11:52:00 AM (view original):
Who had a better 1992, Jack Morris or Curt Schilling?
Jack Morris.  He got a World Series ring.
1/14/2014 12:04 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by tecwrg on 1/14/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 1/14/2014 11:52:00 AM (view original):
Who had a better 1992, Jack Morris or Curt Schilling?
Jack Morris.  He got a World Series ring.
But Schilling was the better pitcher that year, right?
1/14/2014 12:09 PM
mfahie
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Obvious troll is obvious.


The more I look at Glavine and Mussina the more they look alike. Mussina's quality was slightly better, Glavine's longevity was slightly better. Glavine had a tiny bit higher peak but Mussina had more excellent seasons. They really are neck and neck.

Don't you think the voters should be looking this closely at players? But screw that, 300 wins, look no further, and 270 wins, not in my HOF!

1/14/2014 12:14 PM
burnsy483
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Posted by tecwrg on 1/14/2014 12:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 1/14/2014 11:52:00 AM (view original):
Who had a better 1992, Jack Morris or Curt Schilling?
Jack Morris.  He got a World Series ring.
Haha.

Luis Sojo is one of the best Yankees of all-time.
1/14/2014 12:20 PM
MikeT23
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Posted by mfahie on 1/14/2014 12:14:00 PM (view original):
Obvious troll is obvious.


The more I look at Glavine and Mussina the more they look alike. Mussina's quality was slightly better, Glavine's longevity was slightly better. Glavine had a tiny bit higher peak but Mussina had more excellent seasons. They really are neck and neck.

Don't you think the voters should be looking this closely at players? But screw that, 300 wins, look no further, and 270 wins, not in my HOF!

Do you think they're not?
1/14/2014 12:31 PM
mfahie
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I honestly believe that many of them are not. I'm willing to admit I'm wrong, or listen to debate on the matter, but that's my feeling.
1/14/2014 12:34 PM
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ESPN HOF ballot revealed. Topic
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