Recruiting just drives me nuts. - Page 2 - Gridiron Dynasty

badaxe

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I have never, at D-III or D-II, failed to knock a sim off a player I wanted.

8/18/2012 10:47 PM

grindi

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Posted by mr_mojo on 8/18/2012 9:46:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tcochran on 8/18/2012 7:30:00 PM (view original):
Like stingray said, if you're struggling to beat out SIMs in recruiting then you're doing something wrong.
+1

Here's a question for you prima donnas that think they know it all. When was the last time you recruited for a crappy team? If you take over a crappy team struggling against SIMs is the norm. I don't have any problems with established teams. If that happens with established teams then your right. BUT I AM NOT A FREAKING ROOKIE AND I DON'T DO TO BADLY AT ALL. Not a single one of you guys trashing me had the balls to take the challenge a few seasons ago in Heisman. So excuse me If I don't take the advice from people who won't even except challenges not just leaguewise but team wise. Some of you have ducked OOC games. So F off.

8/18/2012 10:48 PM

grindi

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Posted by badaxe on 8/18/2012 10:47:00 PM (view original):
I have never, at D-III or D-II, failed to knock a sim off a player I wanted.

Neither have I but that is not the point. It should not take your whole budget to knock off all SIMs which you have to battle when you take over a poor program. That is the point. Why should it be easier to knock off a human than a SIM at that level?

8/18/2012 10:51 PM

jibe

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I believe I know exactly what grindi is getting at.

I have a D3 rebuild on another ID. It had been abandoned for 10 seasons, they won something like 2 games in that time. So prestige would have been zero and vision would have been the worst in its world. i have now recruited 3 classes for this team.

Anyway day before recruiting starts I will set my watch list, remember I am recruiting from the bottom. When morning comes I will take a look at my list and lo and behold 90% of the recruits are red. These are the best I can see with the crap vision of this team.

1st cycle I hardly even look at the best players I can see. I now do scouts on the few undecided players that I deem worth signing. Ok now I do my scouting. This depletes easily 25% of my budget. For some odd reason even most of these undecides would prefer to sit out than come to play on my crappy team. I get only a small percentage of greens with these initial scouts. I now look at the reports and see potential. After sifting through this I am lucky to have 1/4 of my needed spots filled with this 25%. I now have to start offering a CV to undecides to get them to play for me. By the time this is all done I usually will have around 40% of my budget, and still looking for good cored high pot guys, left to start to knock off sims from high potential players.

Now I start going after sims. This is about the 4th cycle I believe. I can get very few players with the 3k allotment. As a rule it takes close to 4k. I don't find knocking these sims off hard, I know what I'm going to have to do and how to do it. After sending a scout to find pot I send 1HC home visit and 3 CV's. But almost every time with a bottom team like this I am having to send a 4th CV to ensure the sim is gone. With it costing around 4k it doesn't take a genious to figure out that I don't get to knock many sims off.

Some will get on these forums and brag that they never battle sims and to do so is doing things wrong. Well when you are at the worst vision school most every recruit worth having is crawling with sims. The better schools don't have to bother. They get to pick from the best recruits who are undecided most every time and can sign most with an AC scout. I know I've been there.

The problem I am now seeing in these empty worlds is the top 15 teams have excellent vision and can keep getting better and better. The rest of the few humans have to be in the mire with all the sims. The end result is the sim keeps getting more talented and you struggle to keep your head above water. Don't believe me? Try it yourself now. Things have changed.

8/18/2012 11:00 PM

jibe

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Posted by grindi on 8/18/2012 10:51:00 PM (view original):
Posted by badaxe on 8/18/2012 10:47:00 PM (view original):
I have never, at D-III or D-II, failed to knock a sim off a player I wanted.
Neither have I but that is not the point. It should not take your whole budget to knock off all SIMs which you have to battle when you take over a poor program. That is the point. Why should it be easier to knock off a human than a SIM at that level?

grindi is right. This is now the case. You more often than not at a long down trodden team not only have to spend the whole budget but in most cases have to exceed it.

The point to me is that because this is the case with the sim, that you have to settle for lesser undecides while the sim gets better players than you can. This therefore keeps your program down for a longer period of time. The end result is it takes longer to build your team into a contender and WIS pockets more of your money that way in having to give you any rewards.

I too have never failed to knock a sim off at d2 or 3. Only once in my memory did I fail to ever. And that was in a Yost world at 1AA when it was first filling and sims at that oint had great strenght.

8/18/2012 11:08 PM

badaxe

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Posted by jibe on 8/18/2012 11:08:00 PM (view original):
Posted by grindi on 8/18/2012 10:51:00 PM (view original):
Posted by badaxe on 8/18/2012 10:47:00 PM (view original):
I have never, at D-III or D-II, failed to knock a sim off a player I wanted.
Neither have I but that is not the point. It should not take your whole budget to knock off all SIMs which you have to battle when you take over a poor program. That is the point. Why should it be easier to knock off a human than a SIM at that level?
grindi is right. This is now the case. You more often than not at a long down trodden team not only have to spend the whole budget but in most cases have to exceed it.

The point to me is that because this is the case with the sim, that you have to settle for lesser undecides while the sim gets better players than you can. This therefore keeps your program down for a longer period of time. The end result is it takes longer to build your team into a contender and WIS pockets more of your money that way in having to give you any rewards.

I too have never failed to knock a sim off at d2 or 3. Only once in my memory did I fail to ever. And that was in a Yost world at 1AA when it was first filling and sims at that oint had great strenght.

Grindi is NOT right. The first day it takes a scout and 5 or 6 CVs at D-II. The longer you wait, the harder it is to knock them off. So don't wait.

8/19/2012 7:09 AM

badaxe

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When I took over, Bryant was ranked 140th overall in wins in Yost history. It had a sim coach the nine seasons previous to my arrival.

My first two seasons at Bryant, I had the 29th ranked class each time. No sims had better classes than I did.

I would suggest that it may not be the system, it may be your method, that needs revision.

8/19/2012 7:19 AM

harriswb3

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I believe grindi is raising a valid point. Now, anyone who brings a question or an issue to the forum, deserves some intelligent and HELPFUL comments.

So, lets assume that both he and katzphang have flawed methods. Can you guys who have it all figured out, please provide some "coaching" and be a mentor to those who do not have it figured out?

With good vision, I just avoid SIMs...don't need those players. However, with poor vision, you don't really have a choice, and its not just one player...its multiple players and the math is not in the human coach's favor. So, if the human coach is "doing something wrong"....what is it that he/she could do better?

Example (and perhaps the only right answer): with poor vision you have absolutely have to stay within your 360 or less in order to have enough budget to get a few undecideds and battle some SIMs. When battling SIMS, you can't afford to wait on scouting reports...you have to just go after the players you want right away and HOPE you get high potential.

It seems to me that the "solution" when battling for a single player with a SIM is entirely different than when having to battle for multiple players with SIMs on them.

8/19/2012 8:09 AM

badaxe

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"The longer you wait, the harder it is to knock them off. So don't wait."

Also, look at how many recruits the sim school needs. And how many recruits they have already been knocked off of.

8/19/2012 9:01 AM (edited)

katzphang88

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At DII and DIII it may be fine to blow all the alloted scholarship cash on a good 3 SIM red recruit because you know no one is gonna have the extra money to come after you and knock you off. This recruit I refer to was recruited (as I stated before) with 5 CV every cycle for the first 5 cycles (25 CV requested - 14 accepted), and he didn't even turn yellow until after I had 7 - 8 CV accepted. In D1AA you can spend all of your recruiting money and turn someone green and if a D1A team even sends a scout they turn yellow, so it is not advised to spend so much up front.

stingray, taint, tcochran, mr_mojo, badaxe - this entire thread was regarding the way GD seems to bias the game from human coaches towards the SIM in some occasions. The game creates unrealistic overcompensation to the SIM giving them an advantage (in this case refusing many CV in the initial stages - making it necessary to continue placing CV's). You seemed to have missed that point and instead hijacked it into a "I'm so great at recruiting and you guys suck" thread. I'm sorry you missed the comprehension of the initial message. You may try re-reading some of the initial posts so you can understand.

jibe and harris were able to understand grindi's initial query regarding the inequities in this game regarding certain SIM recruits being extraordinarily difficult to overcome. You both are applauded by your aptitude.

8/19/2012 12:05 PM

jibe

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Posted by katzphang88 on 8/19/2012 12:05:00 PM (view original):
At DII and DIII it may be fine to blow all the alloted scholarship cash on a good 3 SIM red recruit because you know no one is gonna have the extra money to come after you and knock you off. This recruit I refer to was recruited (as I stated before) with 5 CV every cycle for the first 5 cycles (25 CV requested - 14 accepted), and he didn't even turn yellow until after I had 7 - 8 CV accepted. In D1AA you can spend all of your recruiting money and turn someone green and if a D1A team even sends a scout they turn yellow, so it is not advised to spend so much up front.

stingray, taint, tcochran, mr_mojo, badaxe - this entire thread was regarding the way GD seems to bias the game from human coaches towards the SIM in some occasions. The game creates unrealistic overcompensation to the SIM giving them an advantage (in this case refusing many CV in the initial stages - making it necessary to continue placing CV's). You seemed to have missed that point and instead hijacked it into a "I'm so great at recruiting and you guys suck" thread. I'm sorry you missed the comprehension of the initial message. You may try re-reading some of the initial posts so you can understand.

jibe and harris were able to understand grindi's initial query regarding the inequities in this game regarding certain SIM recruits being extraordinarily difficult to overcome. You both are applauded by your aptitude.

Thanks katz.

The problem that I am seeing once again is that I have to spend 1 and a half times the scholarship amount to knock off most of the sims I face. I would have no problem with the 3k amount. Why shouldn't we have to spend the allotted amount? The sims should be able to recruit too. But when it costs me 4,500 to drive them away this is stupid. Do I spend too long in doing this? I don't see that doing this in 2 cycles is so terribly wrong. i don't see that waiting until the 3rd or 4th cycle to do this and find potential should be so wrong either.

Whats wrong is when the sims are on every lineman almost who has better than 45/45/30 cores. So consistently I am faced with taking poorer players than the sim. It doesn't take a mathematition to figure out that spending an average of 4k to knock off sims when you are only allotted 3k will mean a bunch of AC signings.

So I get to sign poorer players than the sim every season. My only saving grace is that yes I can get all high potential recruits. But it takes them all of 2 seasons to catch up with the guys I'd like to have and the guys that I'd like to have who I get to choose from aren't even close to as good as the good teams get to choose from.

8/19/2012 12:23 PM

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grindi

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I give. 3 guys get it and the rest just think the topic is me and my inadaquacies. Yet if I am so inadaquate, why did they refuse to come play in the same World and Div taking over long term SIMs. I can't believe how many of you chuckleheads are so narrow minded that everything is personal. I have had a lot of success with my teams. Obviously I recruit fine thank you. All a lot of you clowns do is sling mud. Jt/Partyrock, why show up? Especially both tags when it is the same guy. You don't like me. Big deal. I think your a useless piece af garbage too but I don't show up after every one of your posts. So why not just crawl back under the rock you came out from under and don't post after me? Oh yea, I know why. Because you are classless and rude.

8/19/2012 1:25 PM

jibe

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Oh and btw, lest anyone thinks that I am inadequate with the team i am reffering to, I have yet in 3 recruyits taken an AC signing. My classes with the worst vision in the world possible have all been ranked in the 70,s pretty much by Bob's rankings. no thats not great and I don't claim it to be. My team which was on a 100 plus losing streak has improved to 1-10, 9-4 and now stands 8-1.

We have opinions of problems with the game with recruiting at the lower levels and instead of guys considering the possibility that these problems exist just thump their chests and put others down.

We all know the engine needs revamping. But with the attitude of the chest thumpers on here its no wonder these worlds are empty.

8/19/2012 1:43 PM

harriswb3

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More food for thought on this topic. I've said once before, quite a long time ago, that I think the recruiting capability of SIMs is set in the computer, assuming that the worlds are mostly full of humans....lets say 90%+ full of human coaches. With this situation in mind, it probably makes a lot of sense for the SIMs to have a very strong advantage, so that that they remain at least semi-competitive. This then leaves humans to fight humans (which is what we all want, I think).

With that said, when the worlds are only partially full (say less than 50% humans), then the strong SIM concept is improper and their relative strength should be "turned down" a bit.

8/19/2012 2:05 PM

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