My two best relievers are getting pounded. help? Topic

looking at their ratings they look like they would be solid relievers. Am I missing something? or should I get a new closer? They both had AWFUL spring trainings as well.
11/29/2012 11:40 AM
5 combined innings.
11/29/2012 11:45 AM
Only cause after spring training I set their call bullpen to 5. and to mop up duty as well for a few games. Reed already with two blown saves in 4 tries,and the other save he gave up 3 ER.

McAnaney had at least a ER in every appearance, and after 10 innings, gave up 12 ERs and a 10.80 ERA.
11/29/2012 11:53 AM
Happens all the time with relievers.  Eventually it all evens out.
11/29/2012 11:54 AM
It seems to me that neither have had good careers. Both extremely high earn run averages. I don't understand all the ratings yet but if they're suppose to be better wouldn't it have happened seasons ago?
11/29/2012 12:18 PM
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Reed cost me another win. 2 ER bottom of the 9th
11/29/2012 8:28 PM
Posted by tedwmoore on 11/29/2012 4:58:00 PM (view original):
Yeah, 321 IP for Reed and 189 for McAnaney is getting to be a large enough sample size.  Relievers will have ERAs that vary, but these two will rarely be dominant, though either one or both might sustain a hot stretch over a 65-inning season.  Pitch calling and overall defensive ability behind them will have an effect, but not knowing what the defensive situation has been for them it is difficult to predict any future improvement based on a defensive overhaul.

Reed:  fringe-low vR split (70), extreme flyball tendency (34 gb/fb) and the lack of a dominant second pitch (70).  Change any one of those and Reed probably improves, but the combination is not good. 

McAnaney:  lack of a dominant pitch.  Good splits help, as does the 66 GB/FB, but a repertoire rated 73, 63, 44 is going to get exploited.  If his splits were elite he would improve, but with those pitch ratings elite here means 85+ in both vR and vL, maybe even higher.  Again, pitch calling can help, and I definitely recommend using a stud defensive catcher for late inning duty anyway...

All things equal, McAnaney's splits and GB/FB should make him the better pitcher despite his poor pitch ratings, and so far their career have shown that, though the edge is slight.

I agree with this assessment and would like to add a few thoughts of my own.  Both pitchers are lefties and will probably face more RH batters than LH.  Reed is not only a flyball pitcher, but has a high velocity.  At home in Baltimore and on the road in other HR friendly parks, he has a good chance of surrendering an uncomfortable amount of round-trippers.  That spells potential disaster every time he takes the mound. 

McAnaney has better splits and lower control than Reed.  He also has a high velocity and is a fringe groundball pitcher with 3 pitches that leave a lot to be desired.  LIke Reed, he will cough up HR's in critical situations and will raise your blood pressure.

I'll also introduce a purely speculative thought here as well.  Regarding Temper,  the FAQ states, "In HBD, A player with a higher rating has more of a bad temper or is considered a "hothead." This will effect how often he argues with the umpire or tries to hit a batter."  Whether or not there's much truth to that statement, I've always theorized that high temper pitchers come unglued more often than their counterparts.  Your two pitchers have enough "flaws" that hinder them already, but if there's any connection between temper and relief pitchers, it just got worse for those guys.

If it were me and I didn't have better options in the minors, I would go ahead and try them both out as lefty specialists with a high pull rating.  I'd also set their availability to "ANY".  Either way, I hope they start doing better for you!
11/30/2012 4:56 PM
theiir career whips in the high 1.40s is about what I would expect for them. the analyses by ted and selvendar sound spot on. The pitchers should even out soon enough, but maybe you have their pull rating too high? Especially now that they are starting so cold. maybe a 5 until they warm up, then give em both 4 or if they get hot a 3. I dont agree with Selvendars idea of lefty specialists though, the specialist role is completely broken. just make them SU-Bs with a 4 or 5 pull.
11/30/2012 5:06 PM

I haven't had any problems with the specialist roles. Of course, I've only been playing HBD for a few months now.  But in this case, saying that he should make them SU-B's because LHS is broken makes zero sense.  Even if LHS only works the way it's supposed to half the time, its better than making them SU-B's where they will almost always have to face RH batting opposition.  Look at his players right now.  One is already a SU-B and getting blown up, and the other is being used as a Closer and getting blown up as well. 

I need to clarify something as well.  When I mentioned setting their pulling ratings "high" I meant between 4-5. 

11/30/2012 7:34 PM (edited)
LHS/RHS is broken because pitchers assigned as one of them get much less IP then a setup even a B.  And from what I understand they dont end up seeing that much more of their preferred batters then if you simply make them setups.
11/30/2012 11:21 PM
Wouldn't you expect the specialists to get fewer innings than any other reliever? Most appearances would be 1 or 2 batters.
11/30/2012 11:30 PM
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That's exactly the point.  Why would you want either of those guys seeing MORE batters or pitching MORE innings when they are getting shredded?  I just went back over Kevin's most recent games.  He's won 3 out of the last 4.  In 3 of those games, Reed (still being used as a Closer for some reason) got tagged and had to be pulled for a SU-A.  McAnaney hasn't pitched in 4-5 games (still a SU-B).  However, in the first of those wins, a RHS was brought in

Ironically, he pitched 2 2/3 innings effectively.  He only faced one switch-hitter and one lefty.  The lefty had a much higher vL than vR.  Looks like it worked fine to me.  I'm not saying it works all the time or that if Kevin took my advice his guys would be guaranteed to be better off.  But he can demote them to the minors, keep using them as ineffective Closers and SU-B guys or try something different.
12/2/2012 1:16 AM
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