OK....Looks like I'll have the first pick in our progressive (Doby) for year '55.  I ALSO had the 1st pick in '54 (won the lottery both times)

In '54 I picked The Hammer, Henry Aaron.

In '55 you have rookies like clemente, Killebrew, Koufax, Jim bunning and Larry Jackson.  who do you pick?

I'm leaning toward Killebrew, even thogh he gets almost no PA's from '55-'58 (89,110,33,33) because after that, for the next 14 seasons, he is one of the great sluggers ever. He and Aaron batting 3rd and 4th will generate a lot of runs.

Clemente is a 500-ish PA player from 55-59.  OPS in generally less than 100..  then from '60-'72 he is, well, Clemente.  During that time he is great, but not the slugger Killer is.

Koufax is functional until '61, then he is, well, Koufax.  His last 4 years may be the most dominant stretch in the game's history.

Bunning throws only 54 and 57 innings in 1955 and'56.  then he churns out mid to high 200 inning seasons, with two over 300 in 13 of the next 14 years.  Hhis "injured" year he throws only 160.  He is a terrific workhorse to build a progressive staff around.  I don't have much of a staff right now, as you can imagine.  Once did, way back in '49, when I won the WS and the ToC.

Larry jackson throws 187 iinnings right out of the box.  Only 90 iin '56.  the he thows between 222 and 298 for the next 12 years, minus one year where he "only" throws 209.

Clemente and Jackson are the most help as Rookies, but are probably the last two gusy I would pick in that group. 

Who would you pick first through 5th.

I think I'll pick Killer...and then would go Bunning, Koufzx, Clemente, Jackson.

not a bad dilemma, though.

I'd probably say Killebrew, Bunning, Clemente, Jackson, Koufax.  It depends, though.  I've had a progressive team that had a random down season for a bunch of guys at once and got a lottery pick but the next season was a playoff team again.  In that case you might go for Jackson.  And if you happen to have a few other guys that peak at Koufax's peak he could jump the whole way from 5 to 1; during his dominant run nobody's gonna help you win more than he will.

Actually, I'd probably take Koufax over Jackson regardless.  But Jackson's not a bad consolation prize and again might jump up to #1 if your team is immediately competitive.

We are now in 1957 single season progressive, I took out the names.  I didn't have the 1st pick,  but I agree with Koufax as the 1st pick, especially since you have Hank Aaron.  You have the stud hitter, now get the stud pitcher and contend and win a couple championships in the 60's.

BRO  9 P Sandy Koufax
KC 10 P Herb Score
CIN  11 P Jim Bunning
CLEV  12 OF Harmon Killebrew
CHIW 1 P Larry Jackson
NYG 2 3B Ken Boyer
NYY 3 OF Roberto Clemente
CHIC 4 OF Elston Howard
WAS  5 P Pedro Ramos
STLC  6 P Frank Lary
BAL 7 P Johnny Kucks
PIT  8 P Tom Sturdivant

I'd probably go with Bunning because it is priceless to have those kinds of innings every year without having to worry about it. You can always get 1-year wonders at 1B and the corner OF spots. Koufax gives you a long time to build up to that peak. Killer makes a great middle of the order guy but usually not at a scarce position. Jackson is another good innings eater but not the same quality as Bunning. Clemente is a name guy and while he's great to have, he's also not at a scarce position and doesn't have Killer's pat.

Bunning - clear #1
Killer/Koufax - 2 and 3
Jackson - easy #4
Clemente - solid consolation prize at 5.

Well moe, looks like you have 3 different opinions so I'm guessing you're more confused than ever, better just trade that pick to Washington!

I'm laughing bheid, I'm laughing.  Great post.

As bheid will tell you, this is an interesting progressive because you must keep 16 players, no more, no less.

And what I've found is that guys who churn out tons of innings are WAY valuable.

There is some sense, as robboogi has said, in drafting Koufax and living wonderfully high on the hog for four or five seasons.....But in career value, bunning must be worth more.  That would be an interesting way of evaluating picks.  Who has the greater WIS salary $ value over the length of a career?

I'm still leaning toward Killer, though.  Long career, great production.  Wonderful tandem with The Hammer.  It would allow me to fill positions with role players and still have a fine offense...and concentrate future drafts on pitchers, exclusively.  However, might be a while before I can draft an iinnings eater like Bunning.

I'm thinking, I'm thinking.  But, bheid, I must confess, I'm not thinking about trading the first pick for your Virgil Trucks!  :)

moe

OK..Interesting stuff.

I just did a quick survey of career salary values for those 5 players.

Here is the ranking: (rounded figures)

1. Bunning $96.7M
2. Clemente $83.1M
3. Jackson $78.3M 
4. Koufax  $75.6M
5. Killebrew $70.4M

Something close to $50M of Koufax's value is in 4 seasons. But man, what 4 great seasons they are!

 I may reevaluate Killer as the #1.  In this light, Bunning is the clear winner.

What do you think?

well, low-AVG power hitters tend to be cheaper than they should be in the sim, and high-AVG hitters tend to be more expensive. plus the salary penalties for poor 1B and corner OF are probably too high. so even though they are 13mil apart i would argue that killer and clemente are probably pretty close in value (though that is going to depend a lot on your park).

much like real baseball, you need to be strong up the middle (C, SS, 2B, CF) and have a top-level SP to win progressive leagues. but i think there's a greater value in  an inning-eating #2-#3 guy than you'll find in RL. and probably a slightly lesser value on corner guys (LF, RF, 1B). sure, it's nice to have a stud 1B, but you can always play other positions there, or get a 1-year wonder. would i pass up Lou Gehrig for Larry Jackson? probably not. but Carlos Delgado? maybe.

the other thing to consider about power hitters is that you need to surround them with guys who can get on base. Killer with 7 defensive specialists is going to hit 45 HR and drive in 80.

I'm with you, jfranco.  I think Killer is much closer than that to Clemente in overall value.  I would certianly take him over Clemente, I think.  But I certainly have caused myself to revisi the Bunning or Killebrew question.

moe

Not trying to sway your decision moe, but if you look back to Season 3 when you won the WS by killing my Senators 4 games to 0, It was hitting that won it. My Team was definitely superior in Pitching. My ERA was 3.20 and yours was just over 4.00. My hitting was about average for the league and yours was much better. The old adage that Pitching wins championships does NOT relate to WIS baseball. I'd go for the hitting! Or make that trade!

Interestingly bheid, when we had the original draft and I picked the St. louis pitching staff, i chose them because they had a bunch of guys who threw a bunch of innings for a LONG time.  Getting all those innings allowed me to concentrate the next couple of years on getting some bats.  I still think of that as a "pitching" team, because of that.  that's still my only WS trophy..and then I went on to win the Tournament of champions with that team.  Still playing on that money.  The last coule of (BAD) years I've been trying to patch together 1500+ innings....and the results haven't been pretty.

I would take Bunning/Koufax -

Like jfranco says, and like you know, someone who can give you innings for long stretches are priceless in progressives.  I think it depends on your team structure, and your patience.  If you can wait it out a couple more years, (Drysdale is available in 56...how great would it be to have him and Koufax 61-65???)  I say take Koufax.  If you don't want to wait the years for him to get good, I would take Bunning hands down.  

Trade down, someone always wants to move up.   Grab an extra pick or player and let someone else make a decision.   If you can, trade down twice.   Whatever the draft Fred Lynn and Keith Hernandez are in I did that and dropped from like 1 to 4 to  8 and picked up something like an extra  1st and 2nd the next year.

what is a progressive league and how does the draft work?