How low would you go with hitting fatigue? Topic

I drafted a team, and the guy I'm going to play at DH:

A) is my best hitter
B) has 620 PA/162

I really don't have any bench depth, so my best options are to hit him lower in the lineup, or let him get more tired by hitting higher in the order.

If I hit him 3rd, he'll probably end up around 750 PAs, meaning he'll finish the year around 89-90%. If I hit him 4th, maybe 740pa/93%, if I hit him 5th, maybe 730/94%.

Luckily, he'll be DH-ing, so I don't have to worry about what the impact would be on his fielding.

I'm thinking that letting him get down to 90% is probably too low, but 93-94% is probably fine.
10/26/2012 8:11 AM
In my experience with fatigue, above 93% should be OK. I've seen the drop off for fielding below 95%, but for hitting stats in my experience it's below 92%. I'd hit him where he helps your team the most, do what I can to rest/sub him and keep him above 95% going into the All-Star break since his performance won't fall off much and then ride him down the stretch. If you get to rest him before the's an added bonus.
10/26/2012 9:56 AM
Examples from a current league of mine at game 79 right before the All-Star break (80 million devious weasel league, so it's really like playing a 65-70 mil theme). After the All-Star Break, I'll let them run down if I need to, but for now, they're hitting well and I've only rested them a handful of games. I'm hitting Butler leadoff, Dilone 2/5 and Jacoby 4 all season. jacoby has exactly 620 PAs, so you may not see the fatigue you are expecting to be honest.

Brook Jacoby '87 (R) 1B^ 4 98 336 292 16 70 0 .308 .375 .510 5.01M
Miguel Dilone '80 (S) LF* 5 97 317 302 0 36 58 .371 .401 .467 4.39M
Brett Butler '85 (L) CF* 1 97 365 330 4 25 25 .288 .353 .436 7.17M

Real Life Stats
Harrah, Toby 1982 R 162 602 100 183 29 4 25 78 84 52 12 17 3 .304 .398 .490 .888 708 3 7
Butler, Brett 1985 L 152 591 106 184 28 14 5 50 63 42 1 47 20 .311 .377 .431 .808 666 3 8
Bernazard, Tony 1986 S 146 562 88 169 28 4 17 73 53 77 6 17 8 .301 .362 .456 .818 636 8 7
Jacoby, Brook 1987 R 155 540 73 162 26 4 32 69 75 73 3 2 3 .300 .387 .541 .928 620 2 0
Johnson, Bob 1945 R 150 557 75 156 28 7 13 78 66 59 1 5 3 .280 .358 .425 .783 624 0 0
Dilone, Miguel 1980 S 134 535 83 182 30 9 0 40 28 46 2 62 18 .341 .375 .432 .807 574 2 6
10/26/2012 10:03 AM
Unlike everybody else, I have had poor results even using fatigued players at 80M caps.  If you have the PA, I'd juggle my line-up to keep my guys all at 100%, especially in the first half.  Down the stretch you can work guys down to 95-98%. 
10/26/2012 10:32 AM
There are many thingsabout this game that defy logic, andI suppose that the randomness of our results generating system are the cause. In 80m leagues, I frequently draft '18 Ruth. I used to rest him whenever he dropped below 100%, but I stopped doing that, and play him down to 80. The results are inconclusive. sometimes he does better when he is fatigued, occasionally much better. IMO, the P %s do notalways represent their true vulnerability to fatigue. If my opponent is using modern Ps in a 3 man, low PC rotationRuth kills them,nomatter his fatigue %. I have found that to be true of other deadball era hitters as well. This does not seem to be as true forsimilarly IP dead ballera Ps,like Dutch Leonard. In higher cap leagues, pitching fatigue is non existent most of the time, and playing fatigues hitters doesn't work out. I wish I had data to prove this, but I dobelieve it is accurate.
10/26/2012 11:19 AM
I normally don't let a player get below 92%.

But I've let 1965 Norm Cash run at 90-91 in a progressive league, and there's no sign of deterioriation. If there is it is too subtle to pick up by casual observation.

10/26/2012 12:32 PM
With 620 PA, playing DH and being ur best hitter, I'd bat him 3rd and never take him out of the lineup. 
10/26/2012 6:16 PM
I say play him all year in the 3 hole.  If he's your best hitter then he would still probably be better than any replacements even if he drops a little bit.  Below are some examples of a 1969 progressive I am in - Mack Jones and Dick Allen are my best hitters - both were light on PA's - but I batted them #2 and #3 all season long - I had them on 90% auto rest for the 1st 120 games and then put them at 85% auto rest.  As you can see - they are both over performing their RL stats despite being down very low in fatigue.  


Mack Jones '69 (L) LF* 2 90 649 546 26 85 0 .304 .414 .515 3.72M 
Dick Allen '69 (R) 1B* 3 87 620 526 44 122 0 .298 .403 .610 4.05M

real life:

Mack Jones '69 (L) LF* 2 90 542 455 22 79 6 .270 .379 .488 3.72M 
Dick Allen '69 (R) 1B* 3 87 506 438 32 89 9 .288 .375 .573 4.05M
10/26/2012 6:50 PM
90% fatigue is my standard. I'm willing to let any and all of my hitters play down to 90. In fact, I've gotten several of the "Best" seasons on various Performance Histories with guys who I've played down to 90. I'll let some players play down to 80 depending on the league and where I'm at in the standings (the aforementioned '18 Ruth is one of those guys).

It used to be well documented that there was a sharp curve that started after 93%, but after the one of the last updates they fixed it so it started having a minor effect right away, but as you can see from another thread about fatigue (I'm bumping), the fatigue curve is very minor for the first 20% or so and the last 20% or so, but is steep in the middle 60%.

Defense always seems to be effected strongly, even at 99%, but the hitting scale slide seems to be very tolerable down to about 80% depending on league and team factors and even the player in question (certain stats are effected by fatigue more than others).
10/26/2012 9:44 PM
I'd try to keep him at 100% early in the season. later in the season you can begin wearing him out. early season fatigue has a bigger impact because he'll be fatigued all year long. if you delay onset of fatigue he'll be healthy for awhile and then he'll be less fatigued for the entire season.
10/27/2012 2:42 AM (edited)
so fatigue doesn't impact hitting as much as it does that correct?
10/27/2012 9:08 AM
Posted by winnetka1 on 10/27/2012 9:08:00 AM (view original):
so fatigue doesn't impact hitting as much as it does that correct?
Correct.  Fielding is affecting by fatigue starting at 99%, hitting isn't affected until 93% (and the effect isn't significant).
10/27/2012 10:30 AM
Posted by ncmusician_7 on 10/26/2012 6:16:00 PM (view original):
With 620 PA, playing DH and being ur best hitter, I'd bat him 3rd and never take him out of the lineup. 
I completely agree.  You should try to have this guy play in every meaningful game.  Rest him against weak pitching or inter-division (or inter-league if your league is set up that way) opponents and you should easily get thru the season with him.
Here's a similar situation:  I have 1975 Ted Simmons (awesome for me btw) in a prog. He's got 649 pa for the season.  He's played in 130 out of 148 games.  I used my aaa catcher and rested Ted 3 games at a time at 6 spots in the schedule against the weakest teams outside my division or league.  He's been at 100% at all times and has plenty of gas left in the tank for the playoffs.

10/27/2012 11:12 AM
bat him 3rd and against inter-league teams that aren't good rest him
10/27/2012 3:25 PM
Posted by ncmusician_7 on 10/26/2012 6:16:00 PM (view original):
With 620 PA, playing DH and being ur best hitter, I'd bat him 3rd and never take him out of the lineup. 
I rarely allow a regular position player fall below 100%, but if your guy is a REALLY good hitter with run producing abilities, I would play him regularly but sit him against the weaker teams, especially those with bad starting pitching and/or seriously fatigued lineups. Just check your opponent's last three box scores to see what kind of lineups and pitching he's been running out there. 
10/29/2012 10:08 AM
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