12/30/2013 10:58 AM
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 10:38:00 AM (view original):

If it's not recognized as valid in ND, then why are you expecting that ND can tell somebody "sorry, you can't get married in ND because you're already married somewhere else"?

Is this somehow very confusing to you?

Not confusing at all. ND telling someone that they can't get married in ND because they are already married (to someone else) in another state is perfectly acceptable. It's what other non-gay marriage recognizing states do.
12/30/2013 10:59 AM
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/30/2013 10:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 10:19:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/30/2013 10:04:00 AM (view original):
And if the person says "Yes but you do not recognize it as a legal marriage"?
Refuse to marry them.

Wouldn't that then be recognizing it as a legal marriage?  

Nope. The gay couple wouldn't be legally married in ND.
12/30/2013 11:02 AM (edited)
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 10:58:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 10:38:00 AM (view original):

If it's not recognized as valid in ND, then why are you expecting that ND can tell somebody "sorry, you can't get married in ND because you're already married somewhere else"?

Is this somehow very confusing to you?

Not confusing at all. ND telling someone that they can't get married in ND because they are already married (to someone else) in another state is perfectly acceptable. It's what other non-gay marriage recognizing states do.

Let's say South Dakota allows people to marry oak trees.  North Dakota calls "bullshit" on that and doesn't recognize marriages between people and trees.

Joey Smith marries an oak tree in South Dakota.  He later wants to marry a woman in North Dakota.  North Dakota says "well, we think it's batshit crazy, and we don't consider it a valid marriage, but we can't let you marry a woman in ND because you're already married to an oak tree in SD".

That makes sense to you?

12/30/2013 11:01 AM
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 11:00:00 AM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 10:58:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 10:38:00 AM (view original):

If it's not recognized as valid in ND, then why are you expecting that ND can tell somebody "sorry, you can't get married in ND because you're already married somewhere else"?

Is this somehow very confusing to you?

Not confusing at all. ND telling someone that they can't get married in ND because they are already married (to someone else) in another state is perfectly acceptable. It's what other non-gay marriage recognizing states do.

Let's say South Dakota allows people to marry oak trees.  North Dakota calls "bullshit" on that.

Joey Smith marries an oak tree in South Dakota.  He later wants to marry a woman in North Dakota.  North Dakota says "well, we think it's batshit crazy, but we can't let you marry a woman in ND because you're already married to an oak tree in SD".

That makes sense to you?

Gay marriage and tree marriage are not the same thing.
12/30/2013 11:03 AM
But yes, substitute Bill Shanahan for oak tree and that's the way it would work.
12/30/2013 11:33 AM
That makes absolutely no sense at all.
12/30/2013 11:49 AM
"We don't recognize SSM.  Unless you're in one in another state."

Yeah.  Brilliant logic, there.
12/30/2013 12:20 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 11:49:00 AM (view original):
"We don't recognize SSM.  Unless you're in one in another state."

Yeah.  Brilliant logic, there.
ND doesn't put its fingers in its ears and pretend that gay marriages don't exist. The marriages just don't carry legal weight in ND. But that doesn't prevent ND from verifying whether or not someone is eligible to marry.
12/30/2013 12:20 PM
Like all other states do.
12/30/2013 12:25 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 10:59:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/30/2013 10:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 10:19:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/30/2013 10:04:00 AM (view original):
And if the person says "Yes but you do not recognize it as a legal marriage"?
Refuse to marry them.

Wouldn't that then be recognizing it as a legal marriage?  

Nope. The gay couple wouldn't be legally married in ND.
On what grounds could they refuse to allow them to marry in ND?
12/30/2013 12:34 PM
A man, Bill for example, in ND applying to marry a woman could be denied the marriage license if he is already married to someone else (man or woman) in New York.
12/30/2013 12:42 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 12:34:00 PM (view original):
A man, Bill for example, in ND applying to marry a woman could be denied the marriage license if he is already married to someone else (man or woman) in New York.
And that is not acknowledging a SSM?

You know it is.  Not sure why you're even attempting to pretend it isn't.

Nonetheless, ND is either refusing to allow marriage with no legal grounds(thus inviting a lawsuit) or acknowledging a SSM in another state. 
12/30/2013 12:45 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 12/30/2013 12:42:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 12:34:00 PM (view original):
A man, Bill for example, in ND applying to marry a woman could be denied the marriage license if he is already married to someone else (man or woman) in New York.
And that is not acknowledging a SSM?

You know it is.  Not sure why you're even attempting to pretend it isn't.

Nonetheless, ND is either refusing to allow marriage with no legal grounds(thus inviting a lawsuit) or acknowledging a SSM in another state. 
Who said it wasn't an acknowledgement?

The state knowing that SSM happens in other states and the state legally recognizing SSM are not the same thing.
12/30/2013 12:48 PM
And you don't think acknowledging a legal SSM in another state isn't the next step for legalization?

We both know this is just a legal dance with an ultimate goal of forcing states to legalize SSM.    No need for us to dance around that dance.    Do you disagree?
12/30/2013 12:51 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 12/30/2013 12:20:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 12/30/2013 11:49:00 AM (view original):
"We don't recognize SSM.  Unless you're in one in another state."

Yeah.  Brilliant logic, there.
ND doesn't put its fingers in its ears and pretend that gay marriages don't exist. The marriages just don't carry legal weight in ND. But that doesn't prevent ND from verifying whether or not someone is eligible to marry.
If the "marriages just don't carry legal weight in ND", then on what legal grounds can they refuse a marriage permit to somebody in a SSM marriage in another state?
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