ODL Evaluation Thread. Natenoy vs Vancem Topic

im actually gonna try and play mchale at pf....ive had success with him at 97% at sf before but he always ends up around 56-58% shooting and i feel like he could be a 25+ppg guy at over 60% if i build it right....itll be tough to make up for the huge board hit there but getting kidd at pg is a nice start....i can also go after after some LMBLs later on with weaker d since mchale is a 90d who covers 3 positions
6/16/2013 4:35 PM
can anyone tell me how to unblock an owner? I was clicking in my iPhone and blocked Vancem by accident and haven't been unable to unblock it to see his posts!
6/16/2013 11:57 PM
I've done that on my phone before too. Even though that user was blocked, I remember seeing a grey strip if that person posted. I clicked "show" then "unblock user"
6/17/2013 12:02 AM
in my phone doesn't appear "unblock user" only shows vancem the post and under vancem is empty
6/17/2013 12:07 AM
thanks jhsukow! I will look into in ipad later... hopefully Vancem doesn't get mad lol
6/17/2013 12:09 AM
(pasted from earlier so it doesn't get lost)

98average - LeBron James

Can't argue against the King.  The 12-13 season would be the best in the sim if it had more minutes... and it might still be anyway. Other seasons are quality as well, but that 12-13 season is just insane.  Nobody except shaq brings that kind of offensive efficiency (shooting & turnovers) in the sim, and Lebron brings it all in the backcourt while helping others get better & a rebounding advantage that the Big Fella doesn't bring.

2. jhsukow - Wilt Chamberlain, John Stockton

With the right owner & right supporting pieces, 66-67 Wilt teams should almost be unstoppable.  I have yet to see it in an ODL, however.  I've seen it done right in the funk52, however.  If using the 68-69 or 71-72 versions, you should have taken someone else (moses).  If using the 65-66 season, you should have taken Kareem.  None of the other seasons are elite in a non-progressive setting. Okay... Stockton + Wilt is frightening.  My only concern is only having 4 usage points with $20M already spent.

3. mikee1 - Dennis Rodman

I still think the Worm is the highest value in the sim, as nobody gives you what he gives you.  It's a challenge to build around him in this league, though, or more people would win with him.  It's pretty unthinkable to take a full support player this early, but I still hold to the opinion that his value is top 5 worthy.  Give me Worm & I'll walk away with the ring.

4. skypilot - Kareem Abdul-Jabbar

3500 minutes of tier 2 usage at 57% efg?  Yes, please.  Note:  I won the ODL recently with the Captain.  It should be pretty easy to see why.

5. cmcafeeky - Michael Jordan

This feels about right for Jordan now.  Lebron (in the sim) is clearly better in all areas except tov% (but when you factor in assists, it becomes a close race there as well), but he's the only guard you can say this about.  I feel like building around Jordan is more of a challenge than building around bigs, but his value, to me, is top 5.

6. ashamael - Moses Malone

Moses used to be the unanimous #1 pick in this league season after season.  It's easy to see why: 44% crb (an absurd 18% on the offensive side), almost 55% efg at tier 3 usage, lots of ftas at a decent make percentage, not many fouls... all for 3300+ minutes.  Lots of turnovers doesn't detract from his value.  I value Howard here more per minute, but Moses has a lot more minutes to use.  While that means he costs more, it also means I get to use him almost the entire game in the playoffs, which is a boon to me.

7. seapilots - Karl Malone

3100+ minutes of almost 57% efg at tier 1 usage with a metric ****-ton of ftas at a decent make-rate.  Yes, please.  Should be noted that I won the ODL recently with the Mailman (the version I just mentioned).  The 96-97 version is often used, and is good, but I feel the 89-90 version is superior in this particular league.  You almost can't go wrong with either, however.  Very easy to build around.

8. smokey57 - Kevin Durant

Clearly a top 10 value now that his 12-13 season has come out.  Gives you an edge in all 3 facets of the game (possession, shooting & fouls).  If it wasn't just flat easier to build around big men, I'd say he's a top 5 value.  He gives you better boards (in regard to position) than Kareem or Shaq, gets to the line as much as anybody and makes them at a ridiculous rate.  Almost a 56% efg at tier 2 usage with many of those being 3s... the guy is a stud all around.

9. banditone - David Robinson

I'm not the fan of the admiral that many people are.  People keep saying "his boards..." but his boards are only 12 & 23.  That's not elite.  That's certainly not better than Howard.  "...and his 55% efg" is not better than Howard or Shaq or Chuck.  His 100 defense is nice, though.  55/100 vs 60/90... I'm taking the 60/90 (efg/def).  His turnovers are way better than Howard's, though, so there is that.  All told, can't diss the pick... just expressing that I'm just not as huge a fan of him as many others seem to be (I've never won anything with him in any league variant, which is saying something).

10. Tarheel1991 - Larry Bird

Nothing not to like about this pick, as long as he's playing the 2 (or you do a crazy ast% thing, in which case he can do the 3 or 4 fine).  Good efg% at tier 2 usage, a few threes, helps everyone shoot better, moderate defense, crazy good tov% when factoring in all of the assists he gives... definitely a top 15 value in my mind, so taking him at 10 is realistically good.

11. krishnaman - Dwight Howard

Great value in getting Howard here.  The 10-11 is idea for building a team around, and the 07-08 is a wonderful compliment season if you get someone with high usage later on.  The 09-10 season is another good compliment season.  Good defense, fantastic efg% at a tier 3 (or tier 2 if you go 10-11), elite rebounding - THIS is what I strive for in the first round of the ODL.  If you can get this outside of the top 10, you're ahead of the game.  Fantastic pick.   Should be pointed out that I've won the ODL with Howard.  Twice, actually.

12. natenoy - Shaquille O'Neal

Pretty much what I just said is repeatable here.  Rebounding isn't as good but the turnovers are WAAAAAY down (both being possession stats, you see that one sort of washes out the disadvantage of the other).  Shaq is one of the most efficient high usage scorers there is.  His 94-95 season has only a 9.0% tov% (good luck finding even CLOSE to that in tier 2 or above usage at 57%+ efg).  His 93-94 season has lots of minutes.  His 99-00 season has great defense and the least fouls.  His 00-01 season gets to the line more per minute than just about anybody else you want to talk about.  Lots of good choices here and is extremely easy to build around.

13. slymonium - Charles Barkley, Marcus Camby

60% efg at tier 3 usage for 40mpg; almost 35% creb at the small forward position, gets to the line like nobody else & makes them while there. 56 defense is not horrible, especially in this league.  I once told the ODL that Chuck was the best player in the sim and should be taken #1.  People scoffed.  I won two championships with him... and then people started taking him #1.  He's not #1 anymore (he wasn't even really back then) but he's still a top 10 value for sure... and sly getting him at 13 is painful (for the entire league).  Sly has won rings with Chuck before and knows how to build around the guy.  Scary.  Camby brings more boards & good defense to the fray.  Helps Chuck shoot better.  Doesn't turn the ball over.  Doesn't foul.  As I said, Sly knows how to build around Chuck.  If you aren't scared yet, get that way.

14. steelers821 - Tim Duncan
, Elton Brand

I don't think this is the reach that others do.  Tier 2 usage, 54% efg, top notch boards & great D... yes, please.  Has another season with more minutes & less boards to use, too.  He doesn't help you win in the foul factor, though, so he might not be a top 15 guy.  But I feel like he's a top 15 to 20 value, so I can't fault you for this.  Brand's another guy with that whole meh efg%/high defense.  When it's the best you can get, I understand that, but when there are guys out there with better, I don't understand the mentality.  Still.. gives you good boards at the 3.  Just not feeling very frightened of this squad.

15. tanguma44 -  Chris Paul, Donyell Marshall

I'm still not huge on cp3 as a guy you build your team around.  He gives you few negatives & quite a few positives, but I'm still not sold on him as the centerpiece.  Lots of guys have won with him, however.  Once upon a time I was a huge Marshall fan.  Not so much anymore.  He is a lot like Paul to me... not many negatives, just not that overwhelming "THIS IS MY GUY" feeling.  I really feel like this was the time to get the dude Paul was to compliment, not a role player.

16. iccoachb - Oscar Robertson, Hakeem Olajuwon

I like Oscar more than cp3.  More minutes, better boards, better efg%, better fta/poss... things I care more about than the ast% & tov%.  Have to use the 54+% efg season, however, or I don't like the pick at all.  Oscar deserves better than Olajuwon.  I've broken the dream down enough in the past... at least nobody wasted a 1st on him this time.

17. badja - Artis Gilmore, Penny Hardaway

Thievery in motion.  Should have gone before Duncan.  His 3rd tier usage, 58% efg%, 39% creb season is no joke.  His 4th tier, 56% efg%, 40%+ one is also not a joke.  Penny combined with either of these is serious business.  I really, really, really like your start, badja.  Scary offense, good possession control, good defense.  Scariest combination by far in the league thus far.

18. malone9975 - Dwyane Wade, Tom Boerwinkle

I've always wanted to build around this guy's 08-09 season but have never had the cojones to pull the trigger.  He brings a lot of good.  Should be able to build a solid possession control/shooting control team with him, but I never see anyone do it right (dh came close, it seems like).  I like the Boerwinkle pick because it leads me to believe you're using Wade at the 1.  His short minutes are the only downer in an otherwise solid pick that really fits well with Wade (great boards, decent d, the lower minutes actually help you financially...).  I'm interested to see how you treat Wade in later rounds.

19. theyard2 - Ben Wallace, Jerry Lucas

If you're not getting one of the top 7 or 8 efg% monsters to build around, I like building around a defensive/rebounding specialist like Wallace (see: my funk52 team).  Really would like to have seen you steer towards an offensive player here in round 2 instead of a guy like Lucas.  Lucas is solid, don't get me wrong, but you've drafted 2 guys and have 1.5 usage points.  Most of the high efg% guys will be gone before you get a chance to grab them (those with few weaknesses, anyway).  You've got good support, but I feel like waiting till round 3 to grab your first scorer is bad news.

20. felonius - Julius Erving

I still don't think he belongs in round 1 despite a plethora of good numbers in important areas.  If you could somehow combine his 81-82 offensive efficiency with his earlier 70s seasons' minutes/boards, he'd be a freaking stud. But you can't, so he's either a mediocre shooting, high volume guy or a limited minutes, decent efg% guy that gives you zero 3s.  He doesn't belong in round 1.  Prove me wrong, primate man.

21. eleibowitz - Bill Russell, Shawn Marion

Anytime you can get 3570 minutes of 44% creb, 70 def at 100% pf/c at pick 21, you've got a good steal.  See: what I said about Big Ben, only add 700 minutes.  I love the Matrix here.  Boards are a little crappy for a 4 where he's 100%, but he works well at 98% for a 3.  I might look at a flex forward so you could perhaps get that extra 2% out of Matrix by starting him at the 4, but you have a ton of flexibility going forth.  The guys after you have 52-53% efg% with good defense.  You have 56% with good defense.  I'll take the latter over the former (bill's only a tier 5 usage guy, so I'm not worried about him hurting you offensively much).

22. coachcroft - Kevin Garnett, Scottie Pippen

Still not a fan of Garnett.  Someone needs to win it all with him in this league to change my mind, otherwise, he's one of these guys that is a great value on paper but doesn't translate to ultimate success.  Pippen added to the mix is reminiscent of my opinion on Vance's squad:  efg% very meh.  Great defensively, though, and great assists, good on the boards.  Tad had a ton of success with this combo, so that shows you what I know.  I still don't care for mediocre efg%/high defense guys when there are high efg%, high def guys still available.

23. vancem - Magic Johnson, Bill Walton

Frightening to think you got Magic here.  Only concern is that his best overall season is only 52% efg%.  I like his 56.5% efg season a lot, but only at SF in a high ast% theme.  Walton was the reach of all reaches in my mind, but you can't get a guy like him by the time you would have gotten to pick again in round 3.  So far, your efg% is very meh to me.  I don't feel scared of your squad. Yet.

24. dh555 - Jason Kidd
Kevin McHale

Love Kidd, especially on the turn.  Don't have to explain why.  Then combining him with McHale... yes.  Really interested to see how you shore up the board shortage sine you've said you're going to play McHale at the 4.  Extremely efficient combo, both offensively & defensively.  You're set up really well to excel at the next turn, too. 

6/17/2013 9:59 PM
apparently nate has fallen down on his job
6/18/2013 4:15 PM
....and lebron gets paired with mcgrady again

crazy stuff....tho im sure 98 will do a better job of making it work than iccoachb did....i doubt *** -ah f*uck it no one is drafting him-  iverson makes an appearance here as well

6/18/2013 7:29 PM
Posted by dh555 on 6/18/2013 7:29:00 PM (view original):
....and lebron gets paired with mcgrady again

crazy stuff....tho im sure 98 will do a better job of making it work than iccoachb did....i doubt *** -ah f*uck it no one is drafting him-  iverson makes an appearance here as well

yeah I doubt he picked too...especially since jethroeg is out.  I believe in the course of one draft he took Jordan, Olajuwon, Iverson, and Spencer Haywood
6/18/2013 7:45 PM
Having trouble geting the team built with Magic and Walton. It will have to work somehow.
6/18/2013 8:43 PM
sry, dealing with some RL stuff since Sunday mid-day that has eaten all of my time, likely be later tonight or early am before I can get caught back up with the evals.
6/18/2013 8:45 PM
the banter between you and vancem wont get good til the money rounds anyway....not too much to be said about the first two rounds anyway...standard stuff for the most part
6/18/2013 8:53 PM
yes, picking a guy like cp3 requires a lot of attention because one bad pick can ruin it... I got two bad one's in DHs league hopefully this time around can go 7 rounds picking the right personell!
6/18/2013 9:46 PM
dh, yea the really good stuff is yet to come.

Vance, I will say this having taken Walton multiple times lately and having Magic in the PPL, your tov% is way behind right now, but you sure have banked a nice dreb% advantage.
6/18/2013 10:23 PM
Nate evals and previous draft positions updated through ash pick of Boozer.
6/19/2013 4:23 PM
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ODL Evaluation Thread. Natenoy vs Vancem Topic

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