Anybody watching Spurs/Heat game...thoughts? Topic

Good point. It's pretty much you versus everyone else, so it's probably me arguing blindly.

I know, I know. You're smarter than everyone and we're all sheep. All great points.
6/24/2013 12:00 PM
I'm right. You're wrong. The Decision clearly had no economic impact on Cleveland. I know this because of my background.

Good luck trying to prove my actual points wrong. It's ok, I know you don't have a counter to what I just said. Even if you did, it doesn't count because I know more than you. There, I just bistizaed you. I win.
6/24/2013 1:39 PM
You offered speculation and opinion, as always.  Show evidence.
6/24/2013 2:01 PM
OK. List out each piece of "evidence" you offered, and I'll address it right here. I'm not asking you to reiterate every opinion, just list specific pieces of evidence. For example:

(1) article by XXX
(2) specific statistics from XXX

Don't, and I'll assume you had none. And I'll of course take that as me winning. Can you handle that?
6/24/2013 2:40 PM
I am with the Heat haters mostly cause I am for underdogs all the way well unless my team is the favorite I guess. Spurs not big underdogs but Heat were better team. I do not really want to get involved in this other crap but lebron leaving cleveland sucked for them and of course it lost the area money. If jordan had left the bulls they would have lost a lot of money too thats just how it works.

6/24/2013 2:43 PM
Posted by shawnfucious on 6/24/2013 2:43:00 PM (view original):
I am with the Heat haters mostly cause I am for underdogs all the way well unless my team is the favorite I guess. Spurs not big underdogs but Heat were better team. I do not really want to get involved in this other crap but lebron leaving cleveland sucked for them and of course it lost the area money. If jordan had left the bulls they would have lost a lot of money too thats just how it works.

Yeah, that's not the issue. Among other things, the debate has turned to whether "The Decision" itself caused any substantial economic loss, or whether it was simply that Lebron left, regardless of how it happened.
6/24/2013 3:09 PM
Posted by bistiza on 6/24/2013 2:46:00 PM (view original):
Right here on page 20 I gave you a link to an article.

It's also not hard to find many more articles that say roughly the same thing I have: The loss to the Cavaliers when LeBron left can't be exactly determined, but it was a great loss in the area of hundreds of millions of dollars.

Never mind that you haven't provided a shred of evidence for your own position yet. So how about it? Show me something that says there was no negative impact from LeBron leaving.

See my post above. You continue to focus on the wrong issue. Lebron leaving was never the issue. Lebron is allowed to leave with violent karmic balancing. You claim how he left, specifically "The Decision," is the main issue. You have not provided one iota of evidence that how he left had anything to do with any economic downturn.

And no, your "common sense" is neither "common," nor "sense." So I don't accept that as evidence of anything.
6/24/2013 3:11 PM
No. I don't think anyone spent less money in Cleveland because of how Lebron left. And neither does anyone else. But we already addressed that you're the smartest person on the boards. I'm going to start calling you SPOB. 
6/24/2013 11:11 PM
Posted by bistiza on 6/24/2013 10:50:00 PM (view original):

So with millions of people watching LeBron "decide" to leave Cleveland, you honestly think that had no impact on how any of them viewed the city or its surrounding area?  You also honestly think people in the area weren't ****** off and not only caused problems but spent less money because of the way he left?

Because there is no point in trying to convince you of how significant that impact was if you are in denial about it happening in the first place.
Can you find one example of someone saying they thought less of Cleveland or its surrounding area (which now counts to you?) because of that dumb televised announcement?  That's not a high bar, and one guy besides you saying so wouldn't exactly be an airtight case, but that's what I mean when I ask for (even weak-*** anecdotal) evidence.

I honestly don't believe people in the area spent less money because of the way he left.  If you can show that people in the area socked away cash instead of spending it, I'd be very interested to see that.  I don't believe that people hoarded the money they would otherwise have spent on basketball games, merchandise, nightlife, etc.  It's your assertion that they did - that that amount of spending left the economy, so it falls to you to provide evidence.  The money doesn't just vanish because it's not spent in a specific way.
6/24/2013 11:58 PM
Seriously, we're at the point now where we're supposed to see that it's somehow self-evident that The Decision caused people in Cleveland to spend less money?  You need to just give this one up.  No way you're dumb enough to believe that.  If anything they spent a little extra on alcohol...
6/25/2013 12:33 AM
The obvious conclusion that nobody but you has reached?

In an economy the size of Cleveland, almost anything can have an economic impact in the hundreds of thousands.  But it's not always easy to see what that impact is.  One could argue, for example, that The Decision played a role in how long it took the terrible post-LeBron team to break the sell-out streak.  Maybe the fans made an extra effort to make it to games to show up LeBron, let him know what he'd left.  Maybe the sell-out streak would have ended 5 games earlier, maybe over the course of the season The Decision sold 10,000 extra tickets.  Then those fans buy food and beer in the surrounding area, buy Cavs gear, etc.  I don't think you can just offhand say, "something bad happened to people, so they spent less money" as if that were a foregone conclusion.  If something bad happens to them economically, obviously.  But The Decision isn't economic, it's a social occurrence, and I think your giant assumption that this would "obviously" cause people to spend less money is short-sighted.
6/25/2013 1:36 PM
So you think that if LeBron had just gone quietly to Miami all kinds of people would have been visiting Cleveland for their long weekends because it had LeBron's stamp of approval?  And if people were so much less interested in the Cavaliers, how did they still sell out over half the next season with a TERRIBLE team?  As I mentioned previously, if anything it seems that The Decision INCREASED game attendance.  That's not really hard to believe, when the team takes a hit like that it's not unusual for fans to rally around them.
6/25/2013 2:21 PM
"You act as though the few people here in this thread on this message board somehow represent everyone, which obviously isn't true. So please, stop saying things like 'nobody but you.'"

All we're asking you to do is find one other person. Just one. In the entire world.
6/25/2013 2:47 PM
You're hung up on game attendance, and again, that is a flawed way of measuring interest in a team. Would you honestly argue that more people were interested in the Cavaliers team and the city of Cleveland after LeBron left than they were before? Because I think that's ridiculous.
Of course that's ridiculous.  I would honestly argue that it's quite possible that more people were interested in the Cavaliers team after The Decision than they would have been if LeBron had gone to Miami without a national TV broadcast.  Talk about missing the forest for the trees - you consistently bring the argument back to pre-LeBron vs. post-LeBron, which is an understandable deflection from the real question at hand, namely, "what is the economic cost of The Decision to the city of Cleveland."  I understand why you're doing that, because your position on the real question is laughable.
6/25/2013 3:11 PM

I'm not saying we're right because we agree. We're right because we're right. Boom, bistizaed again! It's a lot easier to argue like you.

I'm actually pretty impressed with how long this troll has gone on. It's pretty impressive, really. Kudos.

6/25/2013 3:24 PM
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Anybody watching Spurs/Heat game...thoughts? Topic

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