Recruiting the first cycle Topic

So I am in year 3 of a smaller D1 school, and while I am doing ok, I am still learning the nuances of recruiting. The toughest part is getting in with a player that starts considering a school after the first cycle... So here are my questions for those who know--

1) Is there any additional advantage to getting in on a player and having them considering you immediately? I have lost multiple players  that were close to me to SIM teams that were far away. Those players started "considering" the sim teams immediately, and I couldn't get in with them no matter how much money I threw at them.

2) What type of actions (calls, scouting trips, etc) will work to get you considered by a player immediately? I have thrown home visits and campus visits out there, but they normally get rejected on the first try, so I don't want to throw 5 home visits right away if they just reject them.

Any other tips on early recruiting would be helpful for any of you experts out there. Thanks for the answers in advance!
6/19/2013 11:48 AM
To my understanding, lower D1 schools may have to wait for recruits to 'drop' down to them, or pull down if you chose to send SVs, even if they are on the D1 list. If you had trouble battling a SIM for a recruit, chances are it was a prestige matter.
6/19/2013 1:18 PM
At low level D1 you have to treat it almost the same as you would at D2 or D3, calling recruits in the first cycle to see if you can recruit them immediately or if you will have to pull them down or wait for them to drop to you. It all depends on your prestige level, but you certainly wouldn't be able to recruit a top 20 ranked player immediately with a D+ prestige.

As far as SIMs go, you should be using FSS to see if they are "tight" with the player, or one of the other messages that mean they have spent a lot of money on them already. In that case (or really any where you are competing against another school) you need to have a good idea of how prestige affects the value of recruiting effort, and then combining that with the cost associated with distance and each schools available budget you should be able to know if you have a legitimate shot at taking the player away from that school or if you should just move on.
6/19/2013 1:32 PM
1. Consideration credit doesn't start to accrue until 24 hours have passed, so the only "advantage" is the psychological one that people might not go after a particular recruit because someone else has already indicated a desire/intent for the player. Sims always get first crack at players and always recruit as if the player is 250 miles from campus, regardless of actual distance. So the Sim is 2,000 miles from the player and you're 270 miles from the player, YOU will actually be the one recruiting at a distance disadvantage. Program prestige is a much bigger factor at D1 as well and needs to be looked at.

2. Assuming the player is open to being recruited by you (and not every player on your D1 screen will be), you can blast out a package of a phone call, HV/CV's (depending which are more cost-effective at your distance), and a few SV's plus the scholarship offer. But unless you KNOW the player will be open to your effort, that could just be throwing money away. Safer play, especially if you're eyeballing a Sim-targeted player, is to make the phone call and find out if they're open or you're a backup and then also wait for that first FSS Word on the Street to come out so you get an idea of how much effort Sim has placed into getting the kid.

6/19/2013 1:44 PM
Does anyone know how much the consideration credit is per cycle? Maybe something equivalent to like a scouting visit?
6/19/2013 4:58 PM
Also with SIMS if they have multiple guys considering, depending on how many. One or maybe 2 will have much more effort than their other targets because they are their "main targets". Normally I think its the best ranked player. So its tougher to get on the player.
6/19/2013 5:22 PM
Posted by clouseb on 6/19/2013 4:58:00 PM (view original):
Does anyone know how much the consideration credit is per cycle? Maybe something equivalent to like a scouting visit?
I think most of us overvalue the consideration credit.
6/19/2013 6:13 PM
Posted by clouseb on 6/19/2013 4:58:00 PM (view original):
Does anyone know how much the consideration credit is per cycle? Maybe something equivalent to like a scouting visit?
I've been under the impression that the credit is only applied once
6/20/2013 3:53 PM
I have been thru the hoops with lower level Dl teams, and you need to manage expectations with a C- prestige. My thoughts, and some of these are from several salty dog mentors who have been kind enough to help me out over the years.

1.  You don't have the money or prestige to battle a SIM (unless of course you want to take the advice listed here, and its good).  If you see guys considering SIMS after the first cycle, drop them to LOW on the priority list.  Forget about it.  With your prestige, you want to target guys in the 550-575 rating range, with as many high-high potentials as possible.  Its work.  But there are so many of them out there, that's why it makes sense to move on from the guys considering SIMs.  That being said, if you have a 1 or 2 star guy within 100 miles that you love and have the money to go out big and run off the hyenas, by all means go for it.  But, if  you are smart, you ease into this thing with "modest" targets and build your program that way.  The big 6 guys are not coming after those types of targets, most of the time.  

2.  Best advice I ever got....go out easy on a handful of targets you really like, guys who fit your program and style and will be solid contributors later.  At Riverside, you need 11 guys that can contribute, win you some games, and boost that prestige.  So, "easy" meaning 3-5k on a handful of guys....2-3 scouting visits, 2-3 HV, 1 CV.  If you are recruiting guys at the level I mentioned, they will consider you with that kind of spend (MOST of the time).  Then you gotta sit on your hands....let everyone get out there and spend.  Let the big money hit the market, which will happen at 7, 10, and overnight into the next morning.  If your guys you hit up are still considering you, then hit then you need to spend and lock them down, all the while moving guys who are committed elsewhere down the list, and moving non considered guys up the list.  Dig into your 2nd and 3rd tier recruits.  Avoid battles.  You are in fertile recruiting ground.  Watch Arizona, USC, UCLA, Stanford, Cal etc as they fill up their spots.  Go for the guys just beneath that tier (550-575 guys).  

FSS California and any of the southwest states that have players that fill your needs.  How far do you cast your net?  For now, you don't need to go further west than Colorado.  Cal, Ore, Utah, NV, AZ, NM, etc will give you a great recruiting base, and you don't have to go flat broke building your team.  Dl recruiting is very frustrating, but if you can put together an "off the radar" type of plan,  you can succeed.  Don't be afraid to take the 90th or 100th rated PG that has monster high-high potentials and RS him.  One last tip, and I apologize if this is TMI, but get your last recruit considering you, but don't offer that scholly.  Let signing day come and go.  Check back and see who may have gotten dropped at the alter and is now on the open market.  One man's trash is another's treasure, as I was once told.  You can upgrade that last spot big time.  Its not fool proof, but why not try it right?  Plus you paid good money who wants to be done recruiting after day 1?  :)

Good luck, again sorry if too much info but I don't think any of what I said can hurt your process.
6/20/2013 5:01 PM
PS.  sorry you DO have the money to battle a SIM.  Just up to  you if you want to spend it!!!!  I've seen alot of posts on here that it has become damn near impossible to pull a guy off a SIM.
6/20/2013 5:03 PM
Great info dirtycajun, thanks!
6/20/2013 6:12 PM
Good info dirtycajun, but I just have one thing I want to point out/refute. You're saying to go out easy on guys, saying to give 2-3 SVs, 2-3 HVs, 1CV. You really shouldn't be doing all that variation. If you are trying to pull down a guy or find out his high-high potentials then SVs are useful, otherwise you should be doing either HVs or CVs dependent upon the distance. One of the two is the more efficient option at whatever distance you are, so mixing the two is just being inefficient with your money.
6/21/2013 10:43 AM
If a player is being considered by a SIM at the start of recruiting, he may or may not be difficult to get. Wait until the first Word on the Street before you do anything, except perhaps make a call to see if the player is recruitable. If they are tight, then I usually will forget about them - you never know how tight "tight" is. But sometimes they are very open to other offers, and therefore very easy to knock off.

I think a good strategy at C- or worse prestige at D1 is to do like 3-4 HVs and a call to the players you are interested in, and to do this to approximately twice as many players as you have scholarships for.

If they are not recruitable, your HVs will get rejected, so you won't lose that money.

If they are recruitable, and no one else is after them, they will be considering only you. You can then make them solid the next cycle or at least before the 2 AM cycle.

If a team makes a big push for that player on the first cycle, you won't show up as being considered, and won't look as weak by having so many people consider you.

By just doing 3-4 HVs, you are not blowing a huge amount of your budget.  This strategy works pretty well for me, sometimes, but not always.
6/23/2013 12:25 AM
Recruiting the first cycle Topic

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