Posted by burnsy483 on 9/20/2013 2:23:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 9/20/2013 1:20:00 PM (view original):A few things -
One of these guys is Glavine and the other is Mussina.
1) While Glavine is a compiler, he also was a dominant pitcher for a decent amount of years. Mussina was great, but was he ever dominant? Glavine was considered one of the best pitchers in baseball for several years, but did anyone really look at Mussina in that way? 5 All-Star Games for Moose, 10 for Glavine, and 2 Cy Youngs.
2) I know wins are largely meaningless, but 300 wins is a big deal.
3) Pitcher WAR is calculated mostly using FIP, right? I'm passing on it as an important stat in this argument.
1) I would say Mussina was just as dominant as Glavine. Their peaks were very similar.
Mussina's four best years by ERA+ were 164, 157, 145, 143.
Glavine's were 168, 153, 147, 141.
By WAR, Mussina's best 4 were 8.2, 7.1, 6.6, 6.1.
Glavine: 8.5, 6.1, 5.8, 5.5
Glavine won more games...but well, you know, pitcher wins. I'd argue that the Cy Young awards were based primarily on those wins also.
2) If they're meaningless, then the 35 win difference (and the 50 loss difference) should also be meaningless.
3) BR WAR is not calculated with FIP. (EDIT: Fangraphs uses FIP for its WAR calculation. If you use Fangraph's WAR, the difference between the two grows large - 82 to 64 in favor of Mussina)
I think those two are very close in overall value. If you think Glavine is a sure thing Hall of Famer, Mussina should be in too. Glavine's biggest advantage is not his wins, it's the additional 850 innings he was able to throw.