Posted by MikeT23 on 7/28/2014 6:52:00 PM (view original):
Posted by burnsy483 on 7/28/2014 5:04:00 PM (view original):I think you're still missing the point. You said "And people forget that 3B is a defensive position."
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/28/2014 4:39:00 PM (view original):Unless you can play the position and hit. Still true. The standards held by people in the 60s may have been slightly different.
And, as I said, 40 years ago, they valued defense over offense at SS and CF thus making them "defensive positions". That no longer exists for the exact reason you just laid out.
I countered with "I don't think there's such a thing as a defensive position these days. I think teams look at the plus of the bat against the minus of the glove. And, if it leans to the the positive, the guy plays what was once considered a defensive position."
And away we went.
To make it understandable, on something we already agreed upon, I'll bring back Soriano. Not a good 2B. But hit the **** out of the ball. So he played 2B for almost 800 games. I don't think that happens in 1970. I can't prove it but I think teams felt "Oh, hell no. Where's Felix Millan? We'll put Soriano in LF!!!"
The original point was that people tend to hold third basemen to offensive standards similar to first basemen. Which is why there aren't a lot of third basemen in the hall of fame. They should actually be held to offensive standards closer to second basemen.
Beltre, even with his bad walk rate, is already one of the best offensive third basemen and his defense pushes him up into all time great territory. At age 35, Beltre ranks 8th on the JAWS list. Another couple solid years and he easily passes Robinson and Santo to move into 6th, behind Chipper Jones, Brett, Boggs, Mathews, and Schmidt.
7/28/2014 7:16 PM (edited)