All PED induction Topic

Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
7/27/2016 7:14 PM
Posted by wylie715 on 7/27/2016 5:42:00 PM (view original):
Personally, I don't care if a guy took steroids. If they want to risk their health to hit more homeruns, or strike out more guys, I have no problem with it. Cheating has always been a part of baseball, from stealing signs, taking greenie, corking bats to taking steroids. Like Mike says, wearing glasses, or tommy john surgery could be considered performance enhancing. Its like if some actress wants to get a boob job in the hopes she'll get more acting roles...what do I care? The guys I don't think should be in the Hall, I don't think should be there because I don't feel they are hall worthy. I thinks Bonds and Clemens should be there. They were on track for the Hall before they started taking steroids. I don't think McGwire, or Palmiero should be there. I don't think they're stats warrant it. Of course, there are a number of guys already in the hall who shouldn't be there in my opinion.
I still can't fathom that anyone thinks Palmiero didn't have HOF numbers. Thats ridiculous.
7/27/2016 7:19 PM
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
PEDs are PEDs. If it enhances performance, all the PED haters should be up in arms over it.
7/27/2016 7:27 PM
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:19:00 PM (view original):
Posted by wylie715 on 7/27/2016 5:42:00 PM (view original):
Personally, I don't care if a guy took steroids. If they want to risk their health to hit more homeruns, or strike out more guys, I have no problem with it. Cheating has always been a part of baseball, from stealing signs, taking greenie, corking bats to taking steroids. Like Mike says, wearing glasses, or tommy john surgery could be considered performance enhancing. Its like if some actress wants to get a boob job in the hopes she'll get more acting roles...what do I care? The guys I don't think should be in the Hall, I don't think should be there because I don't feel they are hall worthy. I thinks Bonds and Clemens should be there. They were on track for the Hall before they started taking steroids. I don't think McGwire, or Palmiero should be there. I don't think they're stats warrant it. Of course, there are a number of guys already in the hall who shouldn't be there in my opinion.
I still can't fathom that anyone thinks Palmiero didn't have HOF numbers. Thats ridiculous.
I think we've gone over this before. we agree to disagree on Palmiero. I don't think he's a HoFamer, you do. Since neither of us can vote, it really doesn't matter what we think in this case.
7/27/2016 7:29 PM
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
If you want to split hairs, it's a chemical your body already produces that can be ingested to increase performance. Like testosterone.
7/27/2016 8:01 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 8:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
If you want to split hairs, it's a chemical your body already produces that can be ingested to increase performance. Like testosterone.
Yep. It's not a drug. Glad you acknowledge that. And you are the master hair-splitter here.
7/27/2016 9:02 PM
Posted by wylie715 on 7/27/2016 7:29:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:19:00 PM (view original):
Posted by wylie715 on 7/27/2016 5:42:00 PM (view original):
Personally, I don't care if a guy took steroids. If they want to risk their health to hit more homeruns, or strike out more guys, I have no problem with it. Cheating has always been a part of baseball, from stealing signs, taking greenie, corking bats to taking steroids. Like Mike says, wearing glasses, or tommy john surgery could be considered performance enhancing. Its like if some actress wants to get a boob job in the hopes she'll get more acting roles...what do I care? The guys I don't think should be in the Hall, I don't think should be there because I don't feel they are hall worthy. I thinks Bonds and Clemens should be there. They were on track for the Hall before they started taking steroids. I don't think McGwire, or Palmiero should be there. I don't think they're stats warrant it. Of course, there are a number of guys already in the hall who shouldn't be there in my opinion.
I still can't fathom that anyone thinks Palmiero didn't have HOF numbers. Thats ridiculous.
I think we've gone over this before. we agree to disagree on Palmiero. I don't think he's a HoFamer, you do. Since neither of us can vote, it really doesn't matter what we think in this case.
Agreed.
7/27/2016 9:04 PM
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 9:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 8:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
If you want to split hairs, it's a chemical your body already produces that can be ingested to increase performance. Like testosterone.
Yep. It's not a drug. Glad you acknowledge that. And you are the master hair-splitter here.
Would you consider HGH a drug?
7/27/2016 9:11 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 9:11:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 9:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 8:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
If you want to split hairs, it's a chemical your body already produces that can be ingested to increase performance. Like testosterone.
Yep. It's not a drug. Glad you acknowledge that. And you are the master hair-splitter here.
Would you consider HGH a drug?
Creatine is not a drug. That's all I said. I didn't challenge anything else you said. So that's as far as I'm going.

This discussion should have never gone beyond the point where I told you that I wasn't going to acknowledge your ridiculous comment. Doing so only would give you a platform for another one of your 'let me make a controversial comment so I can look smart' discussions.

Others were more than happy to oblige because they love to **** with you. So be it.
7/27/2016 9:24 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 6:42:00 PM (view original):
Remember when Bagwell came to his last ST, right after they started testing, and looked like he was wearing his big brother's shirt? That was funny. If you're gonna quit juicing, buy some new clothes.
Can I see a pic? As far as I'm concerned, he was never connected to steroids.
7/27/2016 9:31 PM
7/27/2016 9:44 PM
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 9:24:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 9:11:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 9:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 8:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by sjpoker on 7/27/2016 7:14:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/27/2016 11:55:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/27/2016 11:46:00 AM (view original):
If caffeine is great for lifting, I guess it's a Performance Enhancing Drug or PED for short.

So I guess all inductions were All PED inductions.
Pretty sure everyone (other than you) makes a distinction between an illegal PED (amphetamines, steroids) and a legal PED (caffeine, creatine).
Creatine is not a drug.
If you want to split hairs, it's a chemical your body already produces that can be ingested to increase performance. Like testosterone.
Yep. It's not a drug. Glad you acknowledge that. And you are the master hair-splitter here.
Would you consider HGH a drug?
Creatine is not a drug. That's all I said. I didn't challenge anything else you said. So that's as far as I'm going.

This discussion should have never gone beyond the point where I told you that I wasn't going to acknowledge your ridiculous comment. Doing so only would give you a platform for another one of your 'let me make a controversial comment so I can look smart' discussions.

Others were more than happy to oblige because they love to **** with you. So be it.
You're a weird dude.
7/27/2016 9:44 PM
Posted by all3 on 7/27/2016 5:40:00 PM (view original):
Posted by dahsdebater on 7/27/2016 5:21:00 PM (view original):
Posted by all3 on 7/27/2016 3:36:00 PM (view original):
Posted by wylie715 on 7/27/2016 2:15:00 PM (view original):
He was very good for a long time, but that does not make him hall of fame worthy.
Like Jeter.
There's a big difference between being very good for a long time as a 1B/OF and being very good for a long time at shortstop.
It's more difficult to last, but good is still only good.
I don't want "Sure he was only good, but he played a long time." in the HOF.
Of course, I don't want "He was great those couple years." in either.
I'm not going to claim there's any benchmark numbers for performance, longevity, or the combo, which does make the argument of who's in and who's out very subjective.
That subjectivity probably results in too many guys being admitted (in all sports).
It's not just more difficult to last. There also just aren't guys who can play MIF positions who ARE "best hitter in baseball" caliber bats. It's not a fair standard for HOF inclusion not because of some subjective feeling about what you should have to do at each position offensively for the HOF, but because objectively it's the only way you have MIF in the Hall.

I mean seriously, how many middle infielders, in the entire history of the sport, have been MVP-caliber bats for more than 1-2 seasons? Honus Wagner, Rogers Hornsby, Nap Lajoie, Joe Morgan, A-Rod, and Ripken. Maybe Arky Vaughan and Eddie Collins if you want to be generous in your definition of an MVP-caliber bat at a different position. So by this standard you have between 3 and 4 HOFers at each middle infield spot? I don't think many people want that. And if you're going to include any more guys beyond these, Jeter is comfortably in the next group. He OPSed over .850 6 times in his career. Go look how many shortstops in Major League history can say that.
7/27/2016 10:31 PM
I hate Jeter and I think his defense was mediocre at best, but he's easily a HOFer. Great hitter for years, played under the brightest lights in the most scrutinized market and never really had any scandals or bad press, and won a ton of World Series.
7/27/2016 10:35 PM
And he was a good on-field leader. Off the field, kind of a douche. But he kept himself very professional in all baseball-related activities and his teammates generally really enjoyed playing with him. From the Tom Brady school of how an athlete should comport himself, I suppose...
7/27/2016 11:32 PM
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