btw, did uneble ever institute any kind of mass recruiting actions (coach calls, etc.) for this BETA/update...if not, then what the hell's the point of the update?

Posted by CoachSpud on 7/31/2016 5:34:00 PM (view original):
One guy says "learning something new is not the problem" ... but the next guy says "i've been playing D3 for, what, a week now, and i still don't really get how i'm supposed to find good players at that level." Someone even projects his feelings onto others: "The learning curve for new users is just going to be way too steep for most new coaches." So, yeah, it sure looks like most of the complainers just never learned the new system, don't understand what it can do for them and are so accustomed to whining that it's their knee-jerk response and they drown out the rest of the conversation.

I really hope you have fun playing nuHD v. no humans, because while you are championing the nu game, there are about 20-30+ heavy playing/seasoned HDers here saying that they're going to drop the game when the update rolls out. Just for the fact that a ton of the "old guard" are going to leave with this update, says the update is a horrible idea. This will kill HD and all you sit and say is "This is fine"...

Folks, please don't one person derail what was a peaceful thread. This coach is not going to change. I've blocked him. In months of posting, he's constantly playing devil's advocate just for the sake of it, often taking a thread WAY off topic. He can not or will not comprehend other points of view well enough to consider them. It makes the forums nearly intolerable. If people aren't responding to trolls, they aren't empowered.

Colonels, your response was very logical, but logic doesn't work with some folks.

I think I'll stick it out for a little while, but if the whole game becomes a ghost town, then I'll lose interest and most likely leave (though I might be playing for free if I'm winning titles with only 20 human coaches in each world....but I would miss the competition). Anyway, I hope that seble is devoted to the fixes that many of us have brought up in the beta world. We will see. Scouting sucks, but I don't think the rest of the game sucks at all. If scouting is fixed and simplified, many of you might like the beta. Lets hope that happens. If not, it was a pleasure coaching against the majority of you :)

Posted by CoachSpud on 8/1/2016 12:44:00 AM (view original):
“can you see the potential issues of having a scouting system that takes vastly more time and energy for retaining current users?” Of course. But the beta doesn’t require “vastly more time” and the time that it does involve is spread out over most of the season, to be accomplished at our convenience. So let’s keep the argument real, or at least not exaggerate it, okay?

“1. I have no issues with learning something new.” Right. Some, like you, are fine with it. But some are digging in their heels and resisting learning as hard as they can … noisily in the forums. “…potential was a significant change that forced everyone to learn the new potential system in regards to recruiting…” And they learned, didn’t they? I don’t imagine people have suddenly become dumber. (Cue the sarcastic comment about the forums). “…the issue I addressed was Seble rolling out an incomplete product” Which isn’t an “issue,” is it, it is your imagination so far.

“2. Notice the key thing you said here was a little advertising?” Sure, it is a part of the process that shouldn’t be ignored. “What if the beta was never a thing and WIS just advertised the game more.” What if we stick to things as they are and not how some people wish they would have been. I am fully aware that seble hasn’t changed the game according to some people’s wishes for some time. From what I see of those people’s arguments, I am on Seble’s side on that. So, poncho, before you resort to some stale old ad hominem attacks, how about sticking to the conversation. You seem to be able to do that. Thanks.

-Most would say scouting does take more time, so I'm going to say the majority is correct. Many even check their teams multiple times a day, but its to chat, check forums, look at statistics and make adjustments. I don't want to be forced to check scouting over multiple periods when I could be enhancing my gameplanning or just not checking at all. Problem is this leaves me to do it all at once, which now takes more time. Current HD - about 1-1.5 hours total time needed for scouting and recruiting. NuHD - 1-1.5 hours just in scouting. Now spread that over multiple teams and you might understand why people aren't happy.

-With the new potential system, they did learn, but what you didn't see, because you weren't here at that time, was the decrease in world populations. This game is not as populated as it was before. I believe Billyg or someone recently posted the world populations by division and you can see how many people this game lost and never recovered. Maybe a 1/4 of each world population quit (don't know exactly, but it was a lot). The people who stuck around are these people with anywhere between 3-10 teams or more. Now imagine what happens if we lose another 1/4. You're going to have divisions with less than 100 coaches. That's not good for business when new players come to the game and see empty worlds. They will say, "well this must not be a very good game if the world's are this empty" and they will not stick around.

-You say you're on Seble's side for not adjusting the game to some people's wishes. I can understand that statement when it's a few people who think a change is needed, but when the majority of your customer base thinks something is an issue, you should probably listen to your customers rather than chase them off. That's a basic concept of business. The cost of acquiring a new customer is more than the cost of keeping a current customer. If they weren't advertising before due to limited resources, it's going to cost more now to replenish the games customer base, and I'm willing to bet they don't put the necessary investment for it to succeed.

My statements were not some old ad hominem attacks, but you have been one of the most vocal supporters of the beta without showing a legitimate understanding of the current game. I've seen many posts where you are arguing with people who, based on their success vs yours, know significantly more about the game. A lot of these people have more time and money invested in this game than you would even know where to start. What's more is I watch these people try to offer you advice on how to be better and you argue that they are wrong. A vocal supporter with a lack of knowledge is the worst thing this came could have in regards to this beta. I refrained from name calling, because it's not necessary, but you come off as trolling everyone. Being vocal, but not knowledgeable about the game can hurt the beta more than help it.

I apologize if my rant to spud has derailed anything. Spud no disrespect intended.

Posted by colonels19 on 7/31/2016 10:52:00 PM (view original):
btw, did uneble ever institute any kind of mass recruiting actions (coach calls, etc.) for this BETA/update...if not, then what the hell's the point of the update?

Kind of.

There are no longer coach calls. But there is a way to send mass scouting trips at least. On your main recruits page you can select the players you want to scout and then basically get a quote for how much it'll cost. Then confirm you want to do. It saves a lot of time since before you had to go to the players page.

Scouting isn't quite there yet and is still tedious. I still believe just eliminating level 1 will go a long way in making it more enjoyable and less time consuming.

I have 3 teams and plan on keeping all 3 for the time being. If it becomes too much then I'll drop a team but we'll see. Fantasy Football is coming up soon and I'll be busy with that too so don't really want to take on too much.

Was in all ten, am in seven now and will have no more then five teams when all my current teams have rolled over. And that may be too many.

I used to be in all 10 worlds, currently in 4, plan to drop all 4 either immediately or as credits run out.

I have 8 teams and will be dropping several. Debating on if I should keep Syracuse and UNC as these are destination jobs............although once parity kicks in this may not matter anyway.

Well, I have enjoyed the BETA. IT Takes a whole lot less time to scout and recruit and I like the fact I don't have to be at my computer 24/7 for 3 days to recruit and sign guys. It is taking less time, not more for me. I have 2 teams now plus a BETA and may be adding teams. I like the new interface, its mobile friendly which is what everyone was begging for until it happened then a bunch of "I can't take change" people cried about it. It makes it easy to log in on my phone, check my recruits during signings and make any adjustments I need. I also like the fact that if you put the effort in on a recruit, you still can sign them. For those of you worried about parity, you got your wish. The last changes made really made recruiting way easier for top D1 conferences/teams to win the recruit. Many people in this thread cut teams way before the BETA was even being tested and quit the BETA test. You can't honestly say you even gave it a chance. Just about every vote taken during BETA testing went against the "experienced" coaches, those are the ones that have all those teams and want almost everything to stay the same.
I ran the changes by my nephew and a few of his college friends and they really like them and will be giving the game a try when it releases. It also sounds like WIS will be throwing some marketing at the game and I would expect that initially, all those coaches riding their "free" credit highway will cut some teams because now they won't be guaranteed free seasons but that is what WIS wants anyway, paying customers. In the long run, I think you will see new coaches come on, find the game mobile friendly and interesting, and stick around.

For those of you who didn't see this change coming, you need to only look at two things:
The number one complaint of current coaches was that the game was not mobile friendly, HD 3.0 solves that.
The number one issue was a poor retention rate of new coaches. A host of reasons fit that. The game was not mobile friendly, the recruiting process made you feel you couldn't recruit anyone good against the best coaches, and even at DIII, it was impossible to even feel you can compete against the great teams. Today's youth want some instant gratification. HD 3.0 solves that by letting any team with effort at least get on the recruit's considered list (though with recent changes, very little chance of signing them), reduces the short "full time" commitment to recruiting by putting more emphasis on scouting all season and its really mobile friendly.

Spud - when you say the beta doesnt take vastly more time than does scouting in the existing game, I see two possibilities

1. Your approach to scouting in the existing game is rather inefficient, taking a lot more time than needed. That is fully understandable given your limited experience. With the use of FSS, filters and experience in looking at players for roles on one's roster, a thorough job of scouting at the DI level is doable now in 20-30 minutes.

2. Your standard of adequate scouting in the beta is lower than the level to which I aspire. I have tried in the beta to get close to the thoroughness of scouting that I pursue in the existing game. With much more effort than normal, I dont feel that I have been even close to as thorough in searching for diamonds in the rough, the players who can develop and surprise over four year careers. That has been real fun for me in scouting - finding guys who go unappreciated who can round out classes and rosters.

But, you may well be right, for you the beta may take the same or not much more time and effort for scouting than your level of effort in the old game. To each his own.

My experience and conclusion is unambiguous, it took me a ton more effort to do less thorough work.

Anyone who thinks that making a change to a product that drives away a significant part of your most loyal long-term paying customers has no clue how to run a business. Hoping the change will draw new customers with no basis other than hope itself is not a business plan.