Figured out a way to completely scout players within 400 miles in literally 5 minutes. It's even better than current HD because you know the High-Highs

FAST WAY TO SCOUT ALL PROSPECTS TO LEVEL 4 IF YOU WANT TO FOCUS ON A RELATIVELY SMALL AREA - ABOUT 5 MINUTES
1. FSS the states within your immediate area
2. Hold a private camp, inviting the maximum number possible
3. Send out the assistant scout to recruit people up to the next level. You can do 25 at a time. You may have send the assistant 2-3 times.
Using this method, you actually have more information than in the current game because you know the high highs and low lows.

Alternately, If you were not in a hurry, you could go to a public camp in your region before step 3 and wait for the camp to run. At that point, there would be many players already at level 4, so you could save some money on the assistant coach, and you would have discovered some new players that were outside of the area that you FSSd.

Posted by chapelhillne on 8/14/2016 8:43:00 AM (view original):
Figured out a way to completely scout players within 400 miles in literally 5 minutes. It's even better than current HD because you know the High-Highs

FAST WAY TO SCOUT ALL PROSPECTS TO LEVEL 4 IF YOU WANT TO FOCUS ON A RELATIVELY SMALL AREA - ABOUT 5 MINUTES
1. FSS the states within your immediate area
2. Hold a private camp, inviting the maximum number possible
3. Send out the assistant scout to recruit people up to the next level. You can do 25 at a time. You may have send the assistant 2-3 times.
Using this method, you actually have more information than in the current game because you know the high highs and low lows.

Alternately, If you were not in a hurry, you could go to a public camp in your region before step 3 and wait for the camp to run. At that point, there would be many players already at level 4, so you could save some money on the assistant coach, and you would have discovered some new players that were outside of the area that you FSSd.

I just did something very similar and found some quality players...thanks Chapel.

Chap - I just fss local (which varies by school / state size / market / etc, then finish out the guys I want, which generally isn't that many.

But, I don't really think that is the way people who win long term will do it though, nor will your way be. The guys who win will take 5-10 hours, and scout the whole country, and really work hard to hone in on 'pref fits' without making too many AP mistakes.

But even if you find them quick, i.e. pref fits by making a quicker local search of some sort, you still have used up many more clicks and minutes than the old game when the old game goes quickly.

Plus, what takes time (because you have to return each update cycle and spend significant time) isn't boring repetitive click fest we all engage in when initial scouting, but is having to monitor all the BS moderate, high, very high, signed to someone else even though your are ahead, constant reallocating of AP's etc, EACH cycle.

Plus, even what you posted, in the old game take a click or two, and sometime 5-10 seconds, i.e. you scout your states. I had two openings recently, A+ prestige, about 70K, and the #2 player in the country wanted to play at my school, close to home, and was local to me, I simply threw all 80K in on him, and hoped nobody else would want him that much. I played in a 3 day golf tourny this weekend, so I barely looked at his status, as I was busy all day (and night long) and two more worlds had recruiting going on that I had to look at a little bit more. I didn't spend much more than a minute for the entire effort. But generally, even in more complex current game recruiting sessions, the data you must look at prior to deciding who to offer takes me at least 30-60 seconds per player, along with making the offers, in the new game, that is more like 3-6 minutes, and instead again of 1-2 clicks, it is 10-20 clicks. And one has to monitor the progress much more closely, and the corrective action if one fails is both more sudden, and requires much more time and thought as Plan B or Plan C need to go into affect.

No big deal, the new game is more complicated, I think those who are trying to get others enthused about the new game, should sell the complicated part as a feature, not lie to everyone that the new game is easy or uncomplicated or anything like that. IMO those who learn the new game and embrace the complicated, time consuming, click after click after click, along with the vast amount of data one must pour over (relatively speaking) - those coaches are going to both have fun, and have a huge, huge advantage over everyone else. This should be very appealing to many, esp those frustrated by losing to the vets who apparently are leaving. But I do think - and this is a selling pt Chapel that you should emphasize, is those vets who are great team builders and game planners, with the apparent exodus of top end vets, should have an enormous edge over the wanna be trolls and apologists who have drove the vets out of the game, along with the new coaches who will be needed too be found by HD marketing in order to fill the open spots.

The big ? is, will the 'everyone else' population be large enough after the exodus and the hopeful marketing of the game bringing in new players, that the game continues to be viable in the current form - i.e. ten worlds, 3 divisions.

Some coach who likes the new beta made a great comparison, going back to the old game after playing the beta is like playing an old Atari game from the 90's vs the amazing stuff out there now. There is just no comparision in terms of bells, whistles, and complexities for video games from twenty years ago, nor is there in HD Beta over the old game.

PS: IMO AP's was a great idea, it fixes all by itself (even if it had been incorporated into the old game with NO other changes) about half of all the problems the old game had. If that and conf bonus money had been eliminated, the old game would have been about 85% fixed in terms of being more competitive, with no other changes.

there are absolutely a number of great ideas in the new game - targeted implementation of them without a total rewrite could have been great

I think you'll be able to consistently recruit NT and an occasional NC caliber team using something similar to Chapel's method.

OR - I understand what you are saying and agree with you. The new game does have a lot more complexity and strategy, but I was wanting to point out a way that a complete list of players in your area could be generated quickly and easily, because some were saying it was very time consuming. One of the things I encouraged in the Beta was to have 4 levels of FSS so people could get a complete list quickly, if they didn't want to spend a ton of time on it. Once you have the list, you will definitely want to spend more time analyzing it and looking at preferences, to figure out the best player you can possibly get. But I was focused on the initial list because I never realized there was such a fast way to do it.

Posted by chapelhillne on 8/14/2016 11:21:00 AM (view original):
OR - I understand what you are saying and agree with you. The new game does have a lot more complexity and strategy, but I was wanting to point out a way that a complete list of players in your area could be generated quickly and easily, because some were saying it was very time consuming. One of the things I encouraged in the Beta was to have 4 levels of FSS so people could get a complete list quickly, if they didn't want to spend a ton of time on it. Once you have the list, you will definitely want to spend more time analyzing it and looking at preferences, to figure out the best player you can possibly get. But I was focused on the initial list because I never realized there was such a fast way to do it.

I think anyone who spent time in the beta already had some form of strategy like this figured out. It's still an increase in time, it's inefficient, and is a forced disadvantaged onto people who don't have the same amount of time as people who would do a much more detailed scouting effort. Sure I can make it quicker, but as OR said, someone who has time can scout more individually on a national level and hone in on preferences. So, sure I can put together a decent, NT caliber team, but that's not the same as what it might take to build a high level competitive team. If that's what the game becomes, new users who don't have that kind of time won't stick to it.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 8/14/2016 11:06:00 AM (view original):
I think you'll be able to consistently recruit NT and an occasional NC caliber team using something similar to Chapel's method.

I think another round of scouting similar to what chapel has been saying and I'll have more than enough quality recruits for just three open spots.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 8/14/2016 11:06:00 AM (view original):
I think you'll be able to consistently recruit NT and an occasional NC caliber team using something similar to Chapel's method.

Second. There is going to be huge diminishing returns once you get a step or so past what chapel outlined.

CHap - here is something you are missing.

The preference results change throughout the season so if you choose to do your scouting up front you could waste a lot of time.

How do you mean Mully? Is it this: At the very beginning of the year, a player that favors a certain Offense or Defense or play style does not list you as high until your team starts playing games, even if your team matches them. Once you start playing, it will list you as Very high at that point. You can still see which ones will match you, but it's not as obvious.

This is a good point. What my goal is at this point in the process - which is the initial first day or two is to get my list of all of the people that look really good that are in my area.

Once all of the preferences show (some show now), then I will make my final decision who to target. I still have over a week to make my final decisions. I think right now I have 15 players listed as top choices.

I actually FSSd all 50 states today. My reasoning was to get the Top 100 players to level 2, where I could see if there are some that want to play far from home. The top 100 are available (discovered) to every team at Level 1, but Level 1 does not show preferences. I wanted to see far away players who like Far From Home, then see if there are any that prefer Motion and Zone. In HD 3.0, if you can find a player like that, you can compete quite well for them, even if they are on the other side of the country. I am at Dartmouth, and if I remember, I saw a 5 star or 4 star player in Georgia that looked like that. I have not tried this yet in Beta, but I know Stanford pulled in a 5 star player from New York a couple of seasons ago.

Posted by chapelhillne on 8/14/2016 10:22:00 PM (view original):
How do you mean Mully? Is it this: At the very beginning of the year, a player that favors a certain Offense or Defense or play style does not list you as high until your team starts playing games, even if your team matches them. Once you start playing, it will list you as Very high at that point. You can still see which ones will match you, but it's not as obvious.

This is a good point. What my goal is at this point in the process - which is the initial first day or two is to get my list of all of the people that look really good that are in my area.

Once all of the preferences show (some show now), then I will make my final decision who to target. I still have over a week to make my final decisions. I think right now I have 15 players listed as top choices.

I actually FSSd all 50 states today. My reasoning was to get the Top 100 players to level 2, where I could see if there are some that want to play far from home. The top 100 are available (discovered) to every team at Level 1, but Level 1 does not show preferences. I wanted to see far away players who like Far From Home, then see if there are any that prefer Motion and Zone. In HD 3.0, if you can find a player like that, you can compete quite well for them, even if they are on the other side of the country. I am at Dartmouth, and if I remember, I saw a 5 star or 4 star player in Georgia that looked like that. I have not tried this yet in Beta, but I know Stanford pulled in a 5 star player from New York a couple of seasons ago.

again chapel the process you describe is not easy nor 5 minutes, it is excruciating, compared to the few clicks, few minutes, one day, I often scout / offer / finish in about 5 minutes during the first recruiting in the first cycle of the current game.

Again, why lie, this new game is very time consuming, which is a feature. The HD management will have to market it to players who want to spend alot of time recruiting, and will lose many coaches who don't.

That doesn't mean many of the current coaches won't stay and like the game, but certainly not all of them. Those who leave will largely because of how time consuming recruiting is.

I said a few days ago, that I too see some easy shortcuts to recruiting, again, I see no reason to do what you said, I will simply FSS local, then scout the few guys I want to level 4, and only leave my area if I must. But that doesn't change how much time the rest of the recruiting process takes, after the scouting is done. And you are assuming that you won't have to go back and scout more, once you lose more than half your battles of when you get EE's, which is going to happen. And if you are recruiting 8 guys for 2 spots, then you won't have to maybe rescout, but you will be reallocating AP's each cylce, as you win or lose battles. Again, right now none of this work is done.

IT IS NOT A 5 MINUTE JOB THOUGH, again, why lie?

And I do think the guys who will ultimately win at this the most, assuming there are guys like that willing to commit time, will be the guys who recruit nationally, and who spend exorbitant amounts of time scouting, and then recruiting.

By the way, if I continue, I will do just fine at this. Unlike many of the coaches here who win more than most, I rely less on recruiting than most, and the 'way' I recruit, i.e. the types of players I bring in, more resembles how the beta game will allocate players, i.e. I often bring in lower rated guys who develop, rather than all 5 stars. The reason I do this is I hate recruiting, and am not willing to even in the old game spend the time it takes to recruit top classes. As I said, I often take seconds (or minutes) to scout and recruit thru completion, as opposed to hours.

And, I play ten teams right now, I already 'hate' when I have to recruit 2 at once, I often even have 3 sessions going at once, just had one with Tark, Knight, and Naismith. In the new game, that might be double that, with the two session. Would be tough for me to imagine doing that many at once - even if it wasn't so clunky and time consuming.

chap the word lie is harsh, I apologize, that was wrong of me. I want to add a few compliments to you and several others here who IMO are honestly trying to do good here and are legitimately excited and committed to the future of the game as opposed to those who are posting about posters, and making personal attacks on any and all posts that are negative about the beta, rather than making cases for the game itself. You are doing the opposite, you are a credit to this game. Well done!

First off, I admire what you are doing. IMO you likely are going to be the spokesman for the new Beta game going forward, because of how you've embraced the new game. What you are doing is awesome.

I think Gil said he likely will either quit or dial it back, but that the beta was only a small factor in doing so. That kind of is where I'm at, the beta or the update simply for me 'might' be the final nudge. If I do quit, I likely will keep one team, down from my ten, which to me is 'leaving'. I do plan on at least playing a season of all ten, probably more likely a few, just to see how it goes. I'm esp curious how d2 goes, and might even switch one of my teams to d3, as I also am curious how that will play. In many ways, in the old game, d3 is night and day difference from playing / recruiting in d1. I wonder if that still will be the case, or if all the levels will be more the same? So I haven't quite left yet.

So in conclusion, I'm happy that a good guy, good coach, and great spokesman for the new game has stepped up. My posting here is to try and help you stay on message, i.e. the new game, albeit complicated and time consuming and makes recruiting even a bigger part of the total time and effort required, still it is tremendous (modern video games vs pacman so to speak), and worth the extra time vs the old game.

I don't want to argue over to how to best recruit, but what is blatantly obviously to everyone is that this new system is going to be more intensive and more time consuming, so for the life of me I can't figure out one of Seble's excuses for this as it will be easier for new players to pick up... I don't see it at all.