If Maddux isn't diamond it all else fails. No steroids pitching against steroid machines. Without any velocity. I would purpose he is the greatest pitcher of all time. But I admit I have always been a Braves fan.

C -- Bench
1B -- Gehrig
2B -- Hornsby
SS -- Wagner
3B -- Schmidt
LF -- Williams
CF -- Mays
RF -- Ruth
SP -- Walter Johnson, Cy Young, Koufax, Mathewson, Gibson

That’s where we have our disagreement. I’d rather take Cobb, Mays, Speaker, DiMaggio, Mantle, Griffey, and Trout, among others, over Brett, Schmidt, and especially Mathews. The only 3rd basemen I might take over those CFers is Boggs. And that’s only over the last few

Posted by thunder1008 on 12/20/2018 6:20:00 PM (view original):
C -- Bench
1B -- Gehrig
2B -- Hornsby
SS -- Wagner
3B -- Schmidt
LF -- Williams
CF -- Mays
RF -- Ruth
SP -- Walter Johnson, Cy Young, Koufax, Mathewson, Gibson

That roster is tough to counter.

I'd replace Gibson with Maddux. And because I just have never had a great feel for pre-1900 players, I'd probably replace Young with Pedro.

I'd also add:

RP - Rivera

Posted by tecwrg on 12/20/2018 8:11:00 PM (view original):

Posted by thunder1008 on 12/20/2018 6:20:00 PM (view original):
C -- Bench
1B -- Gehrig
2B -- Hornsby
SS -- Wagner
3B -- Schmidt
LF -- Williams
CF -- Mays
RF -- Ruth
SP -- Walter Johnson, Cy Young, Koufax, Mathewson, Gibson

That roster is tough to counter.

I'd replace Gibson with Maddux. And because I just have never had a great feel for pre-1900 players, I'd probably replace Young with Pedro.

I'd also add:

RP - Rivera

Agree w/ Rivera as RP and tough to argue against including Maddux. Coin flip w/ Gibson.

Randy Johnson is a top 5 pitcher of all time, IMO.

Posted by cccp1014 on 12/21/2018 11:29:00 AM (view original):
Randy Johnson is a top 5 pitcher of all time, IMO.

He'd be in my next tier w/ Maddux, Seaver, Pedro, Pete Alexander and either Lefty Grove or Whitey Ford, but he's an elite pitcher any way you look at it.

don't get cccp started on Pedro. He loves him some Pedro!

Ramon was better.

at what? Not pitching.

Walter Johnson and Pedro Martinez are 1A and 1B best pitchers of all time.

But if we talking about the elite tier, I’m curious where y’all have Addie Joss. Lowest WHIP in history.

If y'all give Koufax’s short career a pass for arthritis, the same should be applied to Joss for tuberculosis.

But my top elite tier would be

1A. Walter Johnson
1B. Pedro Martinez
3. Christy Mathewson
4. Addie Joss


Then you get to Maddux, Koufax, Kershaw, Randy, Young, Walsh.

that would round out my top guys, not in that order (mostly cuz I don’t have the time to rank them). But that would be my elite tier, sorry I guess I’m not a small ball type of guy

Posted by d_rock97 on 12/21/2018 4:57:00 PM (view original):
Walter Johnson and Pedro Martinez are 1A and 1B best pitchers of all time.

But if we talking about the elite tier, I’m curious where y’all have Addie Joss. Lowest WHIP in history.

If y'all give Koufax’s short career a pass for arthritis, the same should be applied to Joss for tuberculosis.

I'd take Clemens over Pedro. I might put Clemens at 1 all time, considering the fact that modern players are just so much better than turn of the century guys.

how is that a "fact"? Can you prove it?

Posted by wylie715 on 12/21/2018 6:05:00 PM (view original):
how is that a "fact"? Can you prove it?

I mean, is that really up for debate? It's a different game today.

Babe Ruth probably doesn't make a roster in 2018.