What Is A "Fair Share" When It Comes To Taxes? Topic

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Posted by The Taint on 8/5/2011 10:14:00 AM (view original):
Plenty of soldiers complain about going into Iraq.  I hear it all the time.

Maybe they shouldn't have joined the military.   I'm pretty sure the dumbest fo the dumb know that soldiers go where they're told.  It's part of the deal.

Of course, 52% of them joined because "they had no other options".

8/5/2011 10:48 AM
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There are military men in my family.  They grumble about being deployed much like all of us complain about our job.  "I gotta go to Afghanistan in March.  Goddam, it's hot over there" = "We've got a meeting at 3 PM.  Those things bore me to tears".

8/5/2011 10:55 AM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/5/2011 10:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by The Taint on 8/5/2011 10:14:00 AM (view original):
Plenty of soldiers complain about going into Iraq.  I hear it all the time.

Maybe they shouldn't have joined the military.   I'm pretty sure the dumbest fo the dumb know that soldiers go where they're told.  It's part of the deal.

Of course, 52% of them joined because "they had no other options".

I guess I have to explain so a 5 year old could understand. If the grants for education get cut like they say they are going to be then if they decide that they (those of military age) want to continue to live and KEEP EATING then if there are no jobs available, (here it comes)then their only choice will be to try to enter the service because there will be no other options open to them!!
8/5/2011 11:01 AM
moose.....this is not a good time of the month to disagree with Mike. It might be a good idea if we all changed the subject. After all, only patriots join the military and because they are patriots they never argue about their fair share of the tax bill.
8/5/2011 11:09 AM
Posted by moosep on 8/5/2011 11:01:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/5/2011 10:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by The Taint on 8/5/2011 10:14:00 AM (view original):
Plenty of soldiers complain about going into Iraq.  I hear it all the time.

Maybe they shouldn't have joined the military.   I'm pretty sure the dumbest fo the dumb know that soldiers go where they're told.  It's part of the deal.

Of course, 52% of them joined because "they had no other options".

I guess I have to explain so a 5 year old could understand. If the grants for education get cut like they say they are going to be then if they decide that they (those of military age) want to continue to live and KEEP EATING then if there are no jobs available, (here it comes)then their only choice will be to try to enter the service because there will be no other options open to them!!
I thought, when you went off on the WMD tangent, that we agreed the poor should just eat a bullet.    Have you decided against that?
8/5/2011 11:16 AM
And, just so you know, I slept in my car for a short time back when I was young.  I never felt like the military was my only option. 
8/5/2011 11:18 AM
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Posted by The Taint on 8/5/2011 11:20:00 AM (view original):
Don't hear very many complaints about Afghanistan...Iraq on the other hand is a different story.  Seems like every tenth car has a veterans against Iraq war sticker on the back of it.  Seem em everywhere.
Was Mike sleeping in one of them?
8/5/2011 11:23 AM
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Posted by antoncresten on 8/5/2011 10:41:00 AM (view original):
Posted by silentpadna on 8/5/2011 10:30:00 AM (view original):

Where were we?  Oh yeah: 

"What's a "fair share"?  Still waiting....I've seen a couple of people try to address this in the myriad of class warfare posts.  You can't realisitically talk about taxes and call for people to "pay their fair share" without a reference point.......

What percentage of the burden should the top 10% of earners pay?
What percentage of the burden should the top 25% of earners pay?
What percentage of the burden should the top 50% of earners pay?

Should there be a limit on what government spends?  "


Anyone?

CRESTEN (or someone) shouted 40% above 500K.  I guess that sort of addresses the issue.  What would that do?



What is a "fair share"?  The questions above are supposed to make it easy...I find it amazing (well not really) no one wants to go there....

 

TOP 10%------45%
TOP11%-49%-- 37%
TOP 50%-74%----29%
BOTTOM %--------NOTHING
So if the top 74% of the earners paid 111% of the tax burden (your numbers), that would be the proper share?
Using your numbers if the top 10% paid 45%, that would be a fair share?  Hint:  they pay more - quite a bit more.  Using your numbers, if the top 49% paid a combined 82%, that would be a fair share?  Hint:  they pay more.  If you are saying the bottom negative11% should pay zero...well, I don't even know what that means....



From the IRS as of 2008:
TOP 10%--------Pay 69.94% of total Income Tax
TOP 50% --------Pay 97.30% of total Income Tax

BOTTOM 50% ----------- Pay 2.70% ot total Income Tax

This after the economic crash in '08, but after the tax cuts for the "wealthy".  Before the crash of '08:

From the IRS as of 2006:
TOP 10%--------Pay 70.79% of total Income Tax
TOP 50% --------Pay 97.01% of total Income Tax

BOTTOM 50% ----------- Pay 2.70% ot total Income Tax




In 2000, before Bush and before his cuts:

TOP 10%--------Pay 67.33% of total Income Tax
TOP 50% --------Pay 96.09% of total Income Tax

BOTTOM 50% ----------- Pay 3.91% ot total Income Tax


In each case (and in each case I got data for 23 years up to 2008), your "fair share" requirements were met.  The share of the top 50% earners of the burden has gone steadily up from Clinton years through the Bush years.

Looking at just the top 10%, it climbs steadily as the economy grows.  The only drops in percent of total share of the top 10% happens when the economy crashes.  You'll see a small pullback in their share in '01-'02 (after 9-11) and again in '08.  You'll see a jump UP in their share of the burden after the TAX CUTS.  How can that be????

As rates went down, share of the burden for the rich went up.  This correlates most strongly with economic growth, but inversely with rates.  Rates mean very little when it comes to a recession.  The best way to bring dollars into the treasury is to grow the economy and the numbers bear this out.

If your goal is to raise money in the treasury, leave tax rates alone.  Get out of the way of business.  If your goal is to make the "rich pay their fair share", I'd sure love someone to define it.  All of the income and [<-- edited for grammar] share stats are on the IRS page.  Anyone can find it.  Easily.

My fair share of someone else's money is not defined by how much of it I want.
8/5/2011 1:03 PM (edited)
Posted by nickbracco on 8/5/2011 11:23:00 AM (view original):
Posted by The Taint on 8/5/2011 11:20:00 AM (view original):
Don't hear very many complaints about Afghanistan...Iraq on the other hand is a different story.  Seems like every tenth car has a veterans against Iraq war sticker on the back of it.  Seem em everywhere.
Was Mike sleeping in one of them?
Making fun of the homeless?   For shame.    52% of the homeless disapprove of this comment.  I read it in a blog.
8/5/2011 12:56 PM
How do you get making fun of the homeless out of that? I was concerned about your welfare. As an ex man of the cloth I have a great deal of empathy for people who are homeless.
8/5/2011 1:19 PM
Let's not get started on "men of the cloth".
8/5/2011 1:27 PM
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What Is A "Fair Share" When It Comes To Taxes? Topic

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