Posted by jt2xTTU on 3/13/2017 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:57:00 AM (view original):
Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:36:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 11:22:00 AM (view original):
Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.
Hell yeah I am surprised. But I knew they could leave. But if you followed closely since you are arguing outside the discussion, you would know that I am only saying that we need to be able to react to this. And if you are good in math, the probability something like that hapoens, my situation was probably 1 out of 40, maybe less.
You CAN react and replace them in 2nd cycle but are choosing not to, why is that? My guess is it is because you don't think your available options are good enough (comparable?) to help you win a championship.
20 ap three cycles won't open anything! What are you talking about? I don't have the ap.
I thought all recruiting actions opened on the 2nd to last cycle? I'm guessing there is not 1 player in that group you'll find worthy.
It does not. It opens the same way it did. And don't forget you haven't built any efforts...
3/13/2017 1:49 PM
Posted by bathtubhippo on 3/13/2017 12:33:00 PM (view original):
meh, I disagree. i don't consider what's left on the final day to be replacement-level for D1. for D2, absolutely. but not for D1. I'm looking right now in Tark....I have 3 scholarships open for my SC team...and I don't consider any of the guys left to be worth signing. to me replacement level for a solid D1 team means they should be at least able to get around 80 in most cores. otherwise, I will do better off taking the walk-ons and having 3 more scholarships open to start the next season with more AP.
I am at Alabama, the only player I am taking is a 503 PF frosh... And he sucks. But he will do and was my best option left. Do I need to become a D3 team?
3/13/2017 1:51 PM
Posted by johnsensing on 3/13/2017 12:54:00 PM (view original):
The issue with EEs (and it's a sad commentary on WIS management that we're still beating this topic however many months after 3.0 rolled out) is that apparently some users -- and WIS, I suppose -- like the "realism" of EEs, but don't like the "realism" of a multiple-EE school being able to replace those EEs with functional high-DI players (140/160 ranked DI players that fall to DIII definitionally aren't functional high-DI players). If we care about "realism," then you have to give the EE-school a chance to replace -- if we don't, why have EEs at all? Right now, if you have 1 or 0 open schollys, then get multiple EEs, you are screwed -- there is just no realistic way to bridge the gap, and the vast majority of the functional DI players are gone by the time you can really give yourself a chance. There are easy fixes that would mitigate some of this (no second session signings before 5 am the second day first and foremost) -- I remain disappointed that WIS has not implemented them.
Bang exactly. Well put!
3/13/2017 1:52 PM
Some things bear repeating:

"With very few exceptions, EE possibilities on the projected big board are top 20 in their class at their position. The majority of EEs actually declaring are top 12 in their class/position. If you're recruiting a guy from roughly the top 100 overall who projects to 90+ in the cores for his position, chances are he's going to end up on the Big Board before his senior season. Can you predict precisely who will go when you recruit? No. Can you predict who might go? Absolutely."
So, sorry but saying (as someone has in this thread) "to me, the issue is the total randomness" is just a stupid and totally false thing to say.

"If you have 34k in funds, you have 34k in funds. Manage your 34k well and you need no postseason cash. Manage it poorly, and your team will be poor, as deserves to be the case."
3/13/2017 1:58 PM (edited)
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 1:49:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jt2xTTU on 3/13/2017 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:57:00 AM (view original):
Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:36:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 11:22:00 AM (view original):
Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.
Hell yeah I am surprised. But I knew they could leave. But if you followed closely since you are arguing outside the discussion, you would know that I am only saying that we need to be able to react to this. And if you are good in math, the probability something like that hapoens, my situation was probably 1 out of 40, maybe less.
You CAN react and replace them in 2nd cycle but are choosing not to, why is that? My guess is it is because you don't think your available options are good enough (comparable?) to help you win a championship.
20 ap three cycles won't open anything! What are you talking about? I don't have the ap.
I thought all recruiting actions opened on the 2nd to last cycle? I'm guessing there is not 1 player in that group you'll find worthy.
It does not. It opens the same way it did. And don't forget you haven't built any efforts...
Why haven't you "built any efforts"? An elite team with no scholarships can unlock all actions on at least 5 different players prior to the 2nd session with those 440 high value APs.
3/13/2017 1:56 PM
we are beating a dead horse unfortunately...and we are always going to have the same idiots who don't know **** about DI thinking they know what is happening. until WIS addresses this one way or the other it will be the same conversation over and over. oh well. SAD!
3/13/2017 2:04 PM (edited)
Posted by CoachSpud on 3/13/2017 1:58:00 PM (view original):
Some things bear repeating:

"With very few exceptions, EE possibilities on the projected big board are top 20 in their class at their position. The majority of EEs actually declaring are top 12 in their class/position. If you're recruiting a guy from roughly the top 100 overall who projects to 90+ in the cores for his position, chances are he's going to end up on the Big Board before his senior season. Can you predict precisely who will go when you recruit? No. Can you predict who might go? Absolutely."
So, sorry but saying (as someone has in this thread) "to me, the issue is the total randomness" is just a stupid and totally false thing to say.

"If you have 34k in funds, you have 34k in funds. Manage your 34k well and you need no postseason cash. Manage it poorly, and your team will be poor, as deserves to be the case."
Not the problem again! We don't mind this... have you read anything? Cause I am starting to think then when we talk about a banana that you will slip onto, you think we mean an orange that has a poisonous juice.
3/13/2017 2:01 PM
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 10:58:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 9:14:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 7:48:00 AM (view original):
Isenhour (on the fence), Williams(on the fence), Gridley (likely staying). I had 40 ap, first session and I replaced the player who was leaving (1 scholly). With about one day left, once I had signed my new player, I started building efforts with 20 ap on a late player (could not get to give a scholly). I decided Williams (guard) was the most likely to leave since he was on the board as a soph also.

This is dumb.

How am I suppose to accept my team goes from a potential NT contender to a pretender? What's the strat if your faith is a random thing?

I could accept this random if I had a chance to prepare for it. I don't. I won't be able to build any traction to more than one player...

Fix this. And face the facts, it's killing the game and the fun of the game.

If my math is right, you still have 8 returning players on your potential NT contender.

When you recruited those 3 did you think they had the potential to declare early?
It's not the point and it will derail the discussion.
ROFLMAO, he wants to complain about the game, Mike, about how unpredictable and random it is. Who could have guessed that three guys in the top 5 at their positions would go EE?

As tecwrg correctly states, "Ignoring the consequences of how EE's are playing out within the current framework of HD 3.0 seems like a foolish way to go. Recruiting should be done with your eyes wide open if you're going after the best of the best recruits."
3/13/2017 2:02 PM
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 1:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 1:49:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jt2xTTU on 3/13/2017 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:57:00 AM (view original):
Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:36:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 11:22:00 AM (view original):
Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.
Hell yeah I am surprised. But I knew they could leave. But if you followed closely since you are arguing outside the discussion, you would know that I am only saying that we need to be able to react to this. And if you are good in math, the probability something like that hapoens, my situation was probably 1 out of 40, maybe less.
You CAN react and replace them in 2nd cycle but are choosing not to, why is that? My guess is it is because you don't think your available options are good enough (comparable?) to help you win a championship.
20 ap three cycles won't open anything! What are you talking about? I don't have the ap.
I thought all recruiting actions opened on the 2nd to last cycle? I'm guessing there is not 1 player in that group you'll find worthy.
It does not. It opens the same way it did. And don't forget you haven't built any efforts...
Why haven't you "built any efforts"? An elite team with no scholarships can unlock all actions on at least 5 different players prior to the 2nd session with those 440 high value APs.
I had one scholly, I put 40 ap to sign the one scholly I was sure to lose. I do so, then I move to build effort on a 20 ap, for three cycle. It was not enough to open a scholly but I bet at the start of 2nd session, it will.
3/13/2017 2:02 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 10:19:00 AM (view original):
So is this one of those issues where "realism" isn't a consideration?
If you want to use realism as your measuring stick, that's fine with my side of the issue. Kentucky and Duke are having multiple EEs and replacing them with 1 and done guys.....every time. They don't have to worry about getting less resources or anyone saying "if you recruit an EE, expect a tradeoff when he leaves" kind of crap.
3/13/2017 2:04 PM
Posted by Benis on 3/13/2017 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Why do so many people who don't play D1 care so much about rules pertaining to only D1?
A better question might be, "Why are so many D1 coaches such whiners?"

"I am at Alabama, the only player I am taking is a 503 PF frosh." So it is obvious what to do. BLAME THE GAME.
3/13/2017 2:20 PM (edited)
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 1:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 1:49:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jt2xTTU on 3/13/2017 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:57:00 AM (view original):
Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:36:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 11:22:00 AM (view original):
Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.
Hell yeah I am surprised. But I knew they could leave. But if you followed closely since you are arguing outside the discussion, you would know that I am only saying that we need to be able to react to this. And if you are good in math, the probability something like that hapoens, my situation was probably 1 out of 40, maybe less.
You CAN react and replace them in 2nd cycle but are choosing not to, why is that? My guess is it is because you don't think your available options are good enough (comparable?) to help you win a championship.
20 ap three cycles won't open anything! What are you talking about? I don't have the ap.
I thought all recruiting actions opened on the 2nd to last cycle? I'm guessing there is not 1 player in that group you'll find worthy.
It does not. It opens the same way it did. And don't forget you haven't built any efforts...
Why haven't you "built any efforts"? An elite team with no scholarships can unlock all actions on at least 5 different players prior to the 2nd session with those 440 high value APs.
I had one scholly, I put 40 ap to sign the one scholly I was sure to lose. I do so, then I move to build effort on a 20 ap, for three cycle. It was not enough to open a scholly but I bet at the start of 2nd session, it will.
But didn't you notice that you had recruited some excellent players who may leave early? If you did, then why would you spend all your AP on one guy until he signed, and then complain about not having enough to unlock actions on players to replace EEs that you knew were possible? You had enough to unlock other players. You chose not to.
3/13/2017 2:07 PM
Posted by CoachSpud on 3/13/2017 2:04:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 10:58:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 9:14:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 7:48:00 AM (view original):
Isenhour (on the fence), Williams(on the fence), Gridley (likely staying). I had 40 ap, first session and I replaced the player who was leaving (1 scholly). With about one day left, once I had signed my new player, I started building efforts with 20 ap on a late player (could not get to give a scholly). I decided Williams (guard) was the most likely to leave since he was on the board as a soph also.

This is dumb.

How am I suppose to accept my team goes from a potential NT contender to a pretender? What's the strat if your faith is a random thing?

I could accept this random if I had a chance to prepare for it. I don't. I won't be able to build any traction to more than one player...

Fix this. And face the facts, it's killing the game and the fun of the game.

If my math is right, you still have 8 returning players on your potential NT contender.

When you recruited those 3 did you think they had the potential to declare early?
It's not the point and it will derail the discussion.
ROFLMAO, he wants to complain about the game, Mike, about how unpredictable and random it is. Who could have guessed that three guys in the top 5 at their positions would go EE?

As tecwrg correctly states, "Ignoring the consequences of how EE's are playing out within the current framework of HD 3.0 seems like a foolish way to go. Recruiting should be done with your eyes wide open if you're going after the best of the best recruits."
You are really an idiot. When they gave you any maths courses or logic courses, you failed to an extend that is impossible to understand. We know THE GUYS CAN LEAVE! we are not talking about this...
3/13/2017 2:07 PM
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 1:29:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Benis on 3/13/2017 1:23:00 PM (view original):
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 12:40:00 PM (view original):
Posted by Benis on 3/13/2017 12:35:00 PM (view original):
You play D3 Mike. Guys with significant flaws can be great at D3. One of the things I love about it. But D1 isn't like that.
Sure it is. It's relative, but it's the same game. And everyone is in the same boat, everyone is competing under the same rules.
No way.
Way. Same game. Weird, right? It's just that "significant flaw" for D3 is a post player with under 50 rebounding, whereas for D1, it's under 80. You can find uses for both players in their respective division, if they have good skills or talent elsewhere.
It's the same game but different enough to know there's a difference.

D3 doesn't have to deal with EE.
D3 does have to deal with D1/D2 quickly snagging guys they've been recruiting since Day 1.
Surely you can tell the slight difference while notice the similarities, right?

D3 doesn't always land the guy they want so they take a walk-on instead of a low-level player.
D1 doesn't always land the guy they want so they take a walk-on instead of a low-level player.
Surely you can tell the similarity here.

I could go on. There are differences but they're more similar than not.
3/13/2017 2:29 PM
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 2:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 2:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by pkoopman on 3/13/2017 1:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 1:49:00 PM (view original):
Posted by jt2xTTU on 3/13/2017 12:15:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:57:00 AM (view original):
Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):
Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:36:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 11:22:00 AM (view original):
Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.
Hell yeah I am surprised. But I knew they could leave. But if you followed closely since you are arguing outside the discussion, you would know that I am only saying that we need to be able to react to this. And if you are good in math, the probability something like that hapoens, my situation was probably 1 out of 40, maybe less.
You CAN react and replace them in 2nd cycle but are choosing not to, why is that? My guess is it is because you don't think your available options are good enough (comparable?) to help you win a championship.
20 ap three cycles won't open anything! What are you talking about? I don't have the ap.
I thought all recruiting actions opened on the 2nd to last cycle? I'm guessing there is not 1 player in that group you'll find worthy.
It does not. It opens the same way it did. And don't forget you haven't built any efforts...
Why haven't you "built any efforts"? An elite team with no scholarships can unlock all actions on at least 5 different players prior to the 2nd session with those 440 high value APs.
I had one scholly, I put 40 ap to sign the one scholly I was sure to lose. I do so, then I move to build effort on a 20 ap, for three cycle. It was not enough to open a scholly but I bet at the start of 2nd session, it will.
But didn't you notice that you had recruited some excellent players who may leave early? If you did, then why would you spend all your AP on one guy until he signed, and then complain about not having enough to unlock actions on players to replace EEs that you knew were possible? You had enough to unlock other players. You chose not to.
40 ap, if you know D1 is normal to land a player. Somebody going 80 ap could have landed the prospect. Remember, I only have one scholly. So I truly played it well.
3/13/2017 2:43 PM
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