Posted by elmossle on 4/7/2017 9:40:00 AM (view original):
I can take losing EE's as part of the game. Its what you have to deal with for landing top talent. I get it. But what is so stupid and beyond my comprehension is the SIM signing players to scholarships that are glorified walk-ons. I am still recovering from a similar situation like Kevin's only I had 6 players on scholarship last season and improved to 7 this season. But because I lost a few seniors last season, I had max resources to recruit the players I did this season, even thought I was leading on a 5* player and lost yet another coin flip.

So instead of starting this season with 5 Walk-ons like I did last season, the SIM signs 2 players and now I get to start recruiting with only the resources for 3 players. I give up. It seems like for every little bit I dig out of the hole I'm in, WIS manages to find a way to shovel a lot more dirt back in. I am afraid to say, unless there are huge changes made and soon, this game is DEAD.

No, the game isn't dead. Maybe your account will be, and that's fine. Your choice to play or not. You're making choices, and experiencing the consequences of those choices. Hoarding resources to overwhelm your opponents in a bidding-based commodity game is not a good representation of how college recruiting works. You can try to play that way in 3.0, but you aren't likely to be as successful as before.

shoe,

How or where did I say anything about hoarding resources? Two seasons ago I lost some EE's and at the same time lost all of my recruiting battles to coin flips. Two of which I was at VH to the other coaches High. Sure, I took the chances on those players and lost, fair and square.

My point was last season I had only 6 players on scholarship that I signed and 5 walk-ons with a Sim signed player. This season I did better in recruiting trying to rebuild, and now have 7 scholarship players. However instead of receiving the same 5 walk-on players like last season, the Sim decided to sign 2 players to scholarship for an unknown reason. Thus, I now only get resources to recruit with the 3 openings instead of the 5 I should have since in theory, nothing changed from last season to this season. Still would have started the season with 7 players on scholarship just like I did last season.

If you can please explain how this is me trying to "hoard" resources to overwhelm those I would be recruiting against, I am all ears.

Posted by elmossle on 4/7/2017 1:54:00 PM (view original):
shoe,

How or where did I say anything about hoarding resources? Two seasons ago I lost some EE's and at the same time lost all of my recruiting battles to coin flips. Two of which I was at VH to the other coaches High. Sure, I took the chances on those players and lost, fair and square.

My point was last season I had only 6 players on scholarship that I signed and 5 walk-ons with a Sim signed player. This season I did better in recruiting trying to rebuild, and now have 7 scholarship players. However instead of receiving the same 5 walk-on players like last season, the Sim decided to sign 2 players to scholarship for an unknown reason. Thus, I now only get resources to recruit with the 3 openings instead of the 5 I should have since in theory, nothing changed from last season to this season. Still would have started the season with 7 players on scholarship just like I did last season.

If you can please explain how this is me trying to "hoard" resources to overwhelm those I would be recruiting against, I am all ears.

1) You can cut those guys after the season, without penalty. I believe you will also get resources for them at that point, but I'm not 100% sure, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

2) If you're not concerned about stocking up on scholarship resources, then why would you complain about the sim signing 2 guys (who are better than walk-ons, generally) to add some flesh to your bench, guys you can cut after the season? The system is set up that way to disincentivize playing short and loading up on just a few players every year. It's the same principle behind the concept of never getting more than 6 scholarships worth of resources, regardless of how many you have to fill, and not having class sizes more than 6 allowed.

The sim will always try to get you to 9. It doesn't always succeed (probably because they go after the same players in those situations, and sometimes it loses to itself).

Hoarding? Lmao ... was there a truck where you could get 5 star recruits out of the back and he jumped in line 3-4 times? That sentence sounded like a dour grapes coach who it bitter about not being able to bring in top quality talent on their own and is relying on wis to.

Posted by mullycj on 4/7/2017 3:47:00 PM (view original):
Hoarding? Lmao ... was there a truck where you could get 5 star recruits out of the back and he jumped in line 3-4 times? That sentence sounded like a dour grapes coach who it bitter about not being able to bring in top quality talent on their own and is relying on wis to.

You're projecting, mulls.

Posted by shoe3 on 4/7/2017 2:31:00 PM (view original):

Posted by elmossle on 4/7/2017 1:54:00 PM (view original):
shoe,

How or where did I say anything about hoarding resources? Two seasons ago I lost some EE's and at the same time lost all of my recruiting battles to coin flips. Two of which I was at VH to the other coaches High. Sure, I took the chances on those players and lost, fair and square.

My point was last season I had only 6 players on scholarship that I signed and 5 walk-ons with a Sim signed player. This season I did better in recruiting trying to rebuild, and now have 7 scholarship players. However instead of receiving the same 5 walk-on players like last season, the Sim decided to sign 2 players to scholarship for an unknown reason. Thus, I now only get resources to recruit with the 3 openings instead of the 5 I should have since in theory, nothing changed from last season to this season. Still would have started the season with 7 players on scholarship just like I did last season.

If you can please explain how this is me trying to "hoard" resources to overwhelm those I would be recruiting against, I am all ears.

1) You can cut those guys after the season, without penalty. I believe you will also get resources for them at that point, but I'm not 100% sure, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

2) If you're not concerned about stocking up on scholarship resources, then why would you complain about the sim signing 2 guys (who are better than walk-ons, generally) to add some flesh to your bench, guys you can cut after the season? The system is set up that way to disincentivize playing short and loading up on just a few players every year. It's the same principle behind the concept of never getting more than 6 scholarships worth of resources, regardless of how many you have to fill, and not having class sizes more than 6 allowed.

The sim will always try to get you to 9. It doesn't always succeed (probably because they go after the same players in those situations, and sometimes it loses to itself).

shoe,

1) I am well aware of the fact that I can cut those guys and get the additional resources. I did that with the Sim signed guy last season and was counting on those resources in my budgeting and used that to get my 4th player I had spent heavily on in the first recruiting session. The point I'm trying to make is just what you said, I get those resources LATER!! I shouldn't have to wait to get those extra AP's and cash to recruit when they will be more beneficial to me in session 1 not session 2, which IMO is a waste but that is a topic for another day.

2) What makes you think I am trying to stock pile open scholarships?? Do you actually think having a team with only 6 scholarship players is a good strategy for winning? Anyone saying a coach is intentionally "limiting" themselves to have more openings to recruit with is crazy. When recruiting started for this season I had 8 openings. EIGHT!!! Of the 4 players still on the roster for this season, was the glorified walk-on the Sim signed last season so I actually only had 3 players. I ended up signing 4 players after I lost one battle where I had a 39% chance to sign the player versus the 26% chance to the team the recruit signed with. I lost another recruit to a 51% -49% coin flip. Had both of those players signed with me, I would have signed 6 players and still only had 9 scholarship players on the roster this season. Did I take a chance with those battles, sure I did. Unfortunately I haven't had one of those go my way since 3.0 but it sure isn't so I can have more openings and a terrible season. So don't give me this hoarding openings crap. The frustration is, I had 5 walk-ons last season, why don't I have that same number this season? If I did, then I could have a better chance of signing 3 or 4 more players this recruiting season and have almost a full roster once again. Instead, I've been limited to resources for 3 openings which if I play my cards right, I might, might get 2 players in session 1 with the hope of getting 2 more in session 2 with my additional resources if I can unlock them in time.

This is all without mentioning the fact that I have 2 Juniors who will most likely leave early for the NBA. Sure I'm going to get those resources to in session 2, but at that point, I'm back to having 6 or 7 players on scholarship, maybe 8 if I am lucky once again next season. But if all that happens, I'm guessing you would think that I was hoarding more openings for next season because of the banner crop of recruits that will be available right?

Like I stated before, it is a vicious cycle where you can't get ahead and WIS has it setup to continue to screw us over.

Nonsense. You are making choices. The game isn't screwing you, or anyone else. Your choices aren't turning out to be as beneficial as you hoped in this version of the game. Learn from it, and adapt your gameplay. Lots of great coaches are still great coaches. People are still winning championships, and it's not because they're lucky.

ETA - the answer to the question of why the sim signed players last season and not this season was explained in my last post. Sim will *try* to get you to 9, but sometimes it loses those leftovers to other sims. Bottom line is, you shouldn't plan on more than 3 walk ons if you're concerned about scholarship resource allocation.

Posted by shoe3 on 4/7/2017 9:05:00 PM (view original):
Nonsense. You are making choices. The game isn't screwing you, or anyone else. Your choices aren't turning out to be as beneficial as you hoped in this version of the game. Learn from it, and adapt your gameplay. Lots of great coaches are still great coaches. People are still winning championships, and it's not because they're lucky.

ETA - the answer to the question of why the sim signed players last season and not this season was explained in my last post. Sim will *try* to get you to 9, but sometimes it loses those leftovers to other sims. Bottom line is, you shouldn't plan on more than 3 walk ons if you're concerned about scholarship resource allocation.

You must have watched Gump tonight that is for sure. Best wishes moving forward.

Posted by shoe3 on 4/7/2017 9:05:00 PM (view original):
Nonsense. You are making choices. The game isn't screwing you, or anyone else. Your choices aren't turning out to be as beneficial as you hoped in this version of the game. Learn from it, and adapt your gameplay. Lots of great coaches are still great coaches. People are still winning championships, and it's not because they're lucky.

ETA - the answer to the question of why the sim signed players last season and not this season was explained in my last post. Sim will *try* to get you to 9, but sometimes it loses those leftovers to other sims. Bottom line is, you shouldn't plan on more than 3 walk ons if you're concerned about scholarship resource allocation.

So wait a second. You are saying that a team/coach that is leading for a recruit by a significant margin and doesn't sign the player is just making bad choices?? So when Kevin said earlier that he lost out on a player when he had a 74% chance of signing the kid and didn't, that is him making a choice and it just wasn't beneficial to him as he hoped!!?? That is call getting screwed. Period. I can see your thought process having some merit if it was the old system where you should have spent more or budgeted your resources differently to sign a player. But under 3.0, you can max out attention points, visits and have the best chance to sign a player….and still have them sign with a team that put in less effort than you did. That is not making bad choices, that is getting unlucky. The biggest problem with 3.0 is a lack of consistency. Yes there should be some randomness built in here and there, but coaches are losing players with basically a 3 times greater chance over other teams which isn't right. Should it happen some, sure but not as much as it is. Not to mention this coaches point of some times you will only have 3 walk-ons, some times you will have 5 or 6. How can anyone plan from season with that? Again, some randomness is good. What we have now is bad. Anyone who thinks differently is wrong.

I'd almost guarantee you that the coaches up 74/26 are winning the battles about 3/4 of the time. It's just that the ones that do don't come here to complain about it.

It's math.

Posted by MikeT23 on 4/8/2017 12:27:00 PM (view original):
I'd almost guarantee you that the coaches up 74/26 are winning the battles about 3/4 of the time. It's just that the ones that do don't come here to complain about it.

It's math.

It tends to even out as seasons go by. You lose two, win one, get lucky, get unlucky. It's been highs and lows at Clemson. Lots of lows at PSU/Alabama so far, but in the long run I will probably get some luck back.

FYI, these are some of the better than walk-on quality players the sim had "signed" for me this season.

Hoops Dynasty – College Basketball Sim Games - Omar Weiler - Ratings - Crum - Hoops Dynasty Basketball | WhatIfSports

Hoops Dynasty – College Basketball Sim Games - Ricky Starks - Ratings - Crum - Hoops Dynasty Basketball | WhatIfSports

I rest my case. I would rather have the recruiting resources than them on scholarship.

Since second session recruiting in D1 is virtually useless... and since sim recruits are virtually useless, I totally get it.
99% of the excellent D1 coaches would rather have the resources.
Hate this aspect... especially after losing ee's. It makes a one year penalty on ee's last a lot longer.

Posted by elmossle on 4/8/2017 9:18:00 PM (view original):
FYI, these are some of the better than walk-on quality players the sim had "signed" for me this season.

Hoops Dynasty – College Basketball Sim Games - Omar Weiler - Ratings - Crum - Hoops Dynasty Basketball | WhatIfSports

Hoops Dynasty – College Basketball Sim Games - Ricky Starks - Ratings - Crum - Hoops Dynasty Basketball | WhatIfSports

I rest my case. I would rather have the recruiting resources than them on scholarship.

You need to look at your team again, Weiler is a walk on, not a sim recruited player. Brickner is the other guy sim recruited for you.

So you'd rather stockpile the resources to use in bulk on a couple elite prospects every year, right? So why would you get offended when I notice it? At least Stewdog is openly admitting it from the start. You can definitely play that way, and lots of players do it well. You just can't take more than 3 walk ons. If you do, some of those spots can be filled by sim trying to give you a slightly more competitive team. In essence, you don't necessarily need to get to 12, but you should try to get to 9. Sort of a diminishing return principle on the value of open scholarships. As I said before, the same principle that limits human class sizes to 6, and limits the overall total of resources you will get to recruit with in a given season to 6.

Posted by rogelio on 4/5/2017 11:06:00 AM (view original):
The rule is supposed to be a max of 6 total graduating + EE. Senior X'fers and walkons do not count (no idea what would happen if a player with a potential 5th year had a sub-2.0 gpa and was not eligible to return). Not sure how stewdog's second year example happened. However, I believe that a lot of the old version "patches", like this one, may not function perfectly with the new programming. My suspicion is that the admin is just betting that no one is going to have 5-6 potential EE anymore...but that's only an explanation of why they don't care.

This rule does not prevent Lewandoski from leaving, in Benis' example, but I think the odds are good that he'll stay.

Thanks for getting my hopes up Rog! The Big Lewandowski decided he wanted to be coached by real pros and jumped to the NBA. #52 on big board.

on the plus side, he was the first EE in NMSU history. Probably in all worlds. So that's nice. Thanks Seble!