He was a very good power hitter. I think he falls a little short of HOF, though. I’m willing to change my mind if you can make a compelling case.

But, just a heads up, a compelling case isn’t just listing his raw HR total. 541 isn’t significantly more that 493, and I don’t see anyone crying about McGriff not being in.

In Ortiz, I see a guy whose personality makes people want to think of him as an all time great and overrate him. Larry Walker was a better player and barely gets 20% of the vote.

He hit .455 in three WS and 541 is 48 more than 493, thats 2 seasons of 24 hrs, which is not insignificant. McGriff also hit nearly 200 fewer doubles. Being 10th on the all time doubles list means something IMO. Check out the players in front of him please:

1. Tris Speaker
2. Pete Rose
3. Stan Musial
4. Ty Cobb
5. Craig Biggio
6. George Brett
7. Nap Lajoie
8. Yaz
9. Honus Wagner

The list is impressive. The aforementioned Barry Bonds actually hit 30 fewer doubles. Also look at the naked eye test and especially when speaking with Yankees fans. The last person they wanted to see at bat in a clutch situation was David Ortiz. Especially in the post season. I would also think the Cardinals and Tigers fans will agree with this.

More Ortiz data:

He is one of three players ever behind Hank Aaron and Barry Bonds to hit 500 home runs and 600 doubles.

He was a great clutch hitter. The two players who have finished their careers with more regular season walk-off hits than Ortiz currently has are Frank Robinson (26) and Dusty Baker (21). Robinson retired in 1976 and Baker in 1986, and no one besides Ortiz has come close to their totals in the last 30 years. Also, neither Robinson nor Baker ever had a walk-off in the postseason. In fact no player has ever had more than two playoff walk-offs in their career. Well, except for David Ortiz. He beat that record in one year when he had three in the 2004 playoffs and nearly single-handedly brought the Red Sox their first World Series title in 86 years. All in all he has four postseason walk-offs, twice as many as anyone ever.

Now 2004 we can argue but in 2013: Ortiz hit .688 in the 2013 World Series, the highest batting average in World Series history. The rest of the Red Sox hit a combined .169. Ortiz reached base 19 times in 25 plate appearances. The Sox wouldn’t have just lost the series without him, they would have been swept more than likely.

Holy ****. 541 is almost 10% more than 493. You know, like the difference between a .270 hitter and a .300 hitter. And post-season means something. Big lights, big hits. I hate Ortiz. Hate him. I don't think a DH should be in unless he was over-the-top good. I don't think his regular season numbers are good enough. But he was outstanding in the post-season and even the casual baseball fan knows who he is.

Removing the fact that his career arc SCREAMS "PED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!", he's on the right side of the HOF argument.

The raw HR/double total isn't going to convince me.

Here is a list of post-1950 players who played >90% of their games at 1st or DH and are in the HOF with an OPS <144:



Eddie Murray.












Ortiz would be #2.

Tell us again how 541 and 493 are essentially the same, mathwiz.

Posted by wylie715 on 11/16/2017 2:41:00 PM (view original):

Posted by cccp1014 on 11/16/2017 2:09:00 PM (view original):
I think he gets in because he was a winner and the PED test may not count against him as much as you think as he posted great numbers afterward as well and for 13 year post that 2003 test he never tested positive. I have a Boston bias of course but I think he gets in.

Barry Bonds never failed a PED test (that we know of) and was a much better hitter than Ortiz and he also played defense. So, you think Ortiz will get in but Bonds won't? Because Ortiz won a couple of rings? I don't think either gets in.

I'm sure Ortiz's personality will help him (though I think he's a raging douche). Bonds was a giant ***** and media hated him. I'm sure at least a few voters are just using 'roids as an excuse to keep him out because they didn't like him.

Posted by MikeT23 on 11/16/2017 4:58:00 PM (view original):
Tell us again how 541 and 493 are essentially the same, mathwiz.

I didn't say they were the same. I said 541 isn't significantly more than 493. It's obviously more...but it's not so much more that one is an auto bid into the Hall and the other gets left out.

I'm a huge sox fan living in NY amongst Yankee fans. Not all of us agree he should be in. Some Yankee fans do and some don't. I'm not gonna make a case with numbers; everyone can cherry pick whatever numbers they want. I'm not even sure if I wasn't a sox fan that i would think this way...but within five years of him being on the ballot he will be in.
To know Ortiz is to watch him play. Not just looking at the numbers. You could feel it.

I honestly don't care if he gets in. But there's absolutely no rational reason for one of him or Edgar being in and the other left out.

Posted by Tdiddy on 11/16/2017 5:17:00 PM (view original):
I'm a huge sox fan living in NY amongst Yankee fans. Not all of us agree he should be in. Some Yankee fans do and some don't. I'm not gonna make a case with numbers; everyone can cherry pick whatever numbers they want. I'm not even sure if I wasn't a sox fan that i would think this way...but within five years of him being on the ballot he will be in.

Well...yeah. Whether he does get in and whether he belongs in are two different questions.

For instance, Catfish Hunter is in the Hall of Fame, by definition, he's a Hall of Famer.

But he shouldn't be, because he isn't a hall of fame quality pitcher.

We've already discussed Hunter ad nauseam.

One of the best pitchers of his generation, he deserves to be in the HOF. You're flat-out wrong saying he doesn't deserve to be there. And drastically points out how your blind adherence to stats and only stats make you a moron in terms of baseball knowledge.

Posted by bad_luck on 11/16/2017 5:22:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Tdiddy on 11/16/2017 5:17:00 PM (view original):
I'm a huge sox fan living in NY amongst Yankee fans. Not all of us agree he should be in. Some Yankee fans do and some don't. I'm not gonna make a case with numbers; everyone can cherry pick whatever numbers they want. I'm not even sure if I wasn't a sox fan that i would think this way...but within five years of him being on the ballot he will be in.

Well...yeah. Whether he does get in and whether he belongs in are two different questions.

For instance, Catfish Hunter is in the Hall of Fame, by definition, he's a Hall of Famer.

But he shouldn't be, because he isn't a hall of fame quality pitcher.

I understand. I think Ortiz is a hall of famer and deserves to be in. Just an opinion...the numbers are what they are. No case to be made by me (it's been made already here). And i don't think Edgar is. The argument for HOF gets gray when you say so and so is in or isn't in so this guy should get in (or not). Obviously, being a red sox fan you can take my opinion for what it is.

Posted by tecwrg on 11/16/2017 5:30:00 PM (view original):
We've already discussed Hunter ad nauseam.

One of the best pitchers of his generation, he deserves to be in the HOF. You're flat-out wrong saying he doesn't deserve to be there. And drastically points out how your blind adherence to stats and only stats make you a moron in terms of baseball knowledge.

He just wasn't one of the best pitchers of his generation. That's ridiculous. He was maybe the best pitcher in the AL once...twice if you squint a little when you look at the numbers. And that's it. He had one other really good year and then the rest were just mediocre or bad.

Three really good years isn't a hall of fame career.

Posted by bad_luck on 11/16/2017 5:34:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 11/16/2017 5:30:00 PM (view original):
We've already discussed Hunter ad nauseam.

One of the best pitchers of his generation, he deserves to be in the HOF. You're flat-out wrong saying he doesn't deserve to be there. And drastically points out how your blind adherence to stats and only stats make you a moron in terms of baseball knowledge.

He just wasn't one of the best pitchers of his generation. That's ridiculous. He was maybe the best pitcher in the AL once...twice if you squint a little when you look at the numbers. And that's it. He had one other really good year and then the rest were just mediocre or bad.

Three really good years isn't a hall of fame career.

" He just wasn't one of the best pitchers of his generation. "