Starting second divisions? - Page 3 - FC Dynasty

unclevic

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As I saw somewhere in the forums, "Patience, grasshpoppers."

1/10/2010 4:32 PM

cosborn

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1900 users - give or take - including aliases. 1900 is enough for 95 full leagues. I'd recommend taking the current teams, putting them all into 10 worlds. Each world with 5 countries a 1st and 2nd division in each. Take owner history, and put the top 1/2 into first division, lower 1/2 in second division. over really new teams - if any - go into 3rd divisions. All new oners start with 5,000 seat stadiums in 3rd division.

Would make this more like the stated vision.

1/10/2010 6:08 PM

jimnei

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Quote: Originally posted by unclevic on 1/10/2010As I saw somewhere in the forums, "Patience, grasshpoppers."

Ah yes, snake_p's line. It's not incorrect to preach patience, but I fail to see why we can't be unhappy with the way things are currently going, i.e.:

1. Six months ago this game had 2000 users. Now we're just floating around the 1800-2000 range, despite an increase of alias IDs (I don't have any hard numbers to support this, but it certainly sounds/feels that way). And even if that second part is not true, the fact that the game has stalled out is concerning.

2. The January 6 update is nice and all, but considering all the clamor the FCD diehards have made regarding PBP enhancements, second divisions, scouting enhancements, and fixes for potential gaming of the FA system, it feels like this is a "cheap" update with not much to it (other than smoothing out the financial situation, which was well though out, and I think it is for the good of the game). Also considering this is the only update we've seen in 11 months for a fledgling game that gets advertising on a major website... well, that's just not a good sign.

3. There is a stale feeling about this game that I've heard multiple users talk about across my alt leagues. I don't feel it necessarily, but I can see where these people are coming from - this is purely a money management game (which is unfortunate, because the beautiful game deserves more than that) with minimal features outside of budgeting, chatting on a nearly-invisible league/world forum, and champions league tournaments that the users had to create themselves!

Look, I get it - FCD is a free game, and WIS is trying hard to get the ball rolling with. This is not meant to be a knock on norbert or WIS or whatever. But when legit complaints/problems are being brought to the table - even about something that is free - that doesn't mean "patience" overrides reason. There's a reason these issues keep coming up again and again... and it would be nice to see them addressed, instead of being pushed under the rug for the sake of patience.

1/11/2010 10:27 AM

snake_p

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Quote: Originally Posted By jimnei on 1/11/2010
Quote: Originally posted by unclevic on 1/10/2010 As I saw somewhere in the forums, "Patience, grasshpoppers."

Ah yes, snake_p's line. It's not incorrect to preach patience, but I fail to see why we can't be unhappy with the way things are currently going, i.e.:

1. Six months ago this game had 2000 users. Now we're just floating around the 1800-2000 range, despite an increase of alias IDs (I don't have any hard numbers to support this, but it certainly sounds/feels that way). And even if that second part is not true, the fact that the game has stalled out is concerning.

2. The January 6 update is nice and all, but considering all the clamor the FCD diehards have made regarding PBP enhancements, second divisions, scouting enhancements, and fixes for potential gaming of the FA system, it feels like this is a "cheap" update with not much to it (other than smoothing out the financial situation, which was well though out, and I think it is for the good of the game). Also considering this is the only update we've seen in 11 months for a fledgling game that gets advertising on a major website... well, that's just not a good sign.

3. There is a stale feeling about this game that I've heard multiple users talk about across my alt leagues. I don't feel it necessarily, but I can see where these people are coming from - this is purely a money management game (which is unfortunate, because the beautiful game deserves more than that) with minimal features outside of budgeting, chatting on a nearly-invisible league/world forum, and champions league tournaments that the users had to create themselves!

Look, I get it - FCD is a free game, and WIS is trying hard to get the ball rolling with. This is not meant to be a knock on norbert or WIS or whatever. But when legit complaints/problems are being brought to the table - even about something that is free - that doesn't mean "patience" overrides reason. There's a reason these issues keep coming up again and again... and it would be nice to see them addressed, instead of being pushed under the rug for the sake of patience

It's nice to see that someone listens.

1. Some day they'll be marketing in Europe and elsewhere internationally.

2. That wasn't really an update. It was a tweak to smooth out the inmcremental steps in league payout. Nothing near an update. And remember, this fledgling game is free and it intended to always be so.

3. "purely a money management game" - no. Chiefly a money management game - yes. But a lot of managers are picking the game play apart and learning more than just money management. Try it yourself and maybe you won't be so impatient with it. And for those whose impatience results from them being unable to learn anything about the game play -- keep trying, it'll come to you.

<< Look, I get it - FCD is a free game >> Exactly.

1/11/2010 11:32 AM

snake_p

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Quote: Originally posted by norbert on 7/15/2009
Consolidation is not in the plans, but I would not say it would never happen. We want to wait to see if we can get the number of users we need for the current worlds from Fox Soccer, which has been a very slow process because they have a lot on their plates, but it will pick up eventually. They are behind the game 100% and have a stake in it now.

Hi, Norbert. Time for the semi-annual review of how Fox is helping you. Ready to market in Europe?

1/11/2010 11:34 AM

jimnei

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1/11/2010 1:16 PM

hamlet96

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Quote: Originally posted by jimnei on 1/10/2010Agree with cosborn, especially regarding league/world consolidation.

+1

1/11/2010 9:43 PM

snake_p

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Quote: Originally Posted By jimnei on 1/11/2010Again, just because it's free doesn't make these issues go away. Nor does it mean that anyone has to be patient . It can be preached a thousand times over, and you could be (and are) right about it - but that doesn't mean other users accept or even hear it. In a world that demands immediate gratification, I'd say a majority of this game's users will go the "impatient" route - and unless that European marketing you talk about, snake_p, happens very soon, it could spell disaster for FCD

Actually, contrary to the firmly held belief of many kids, the world does not demand immediate gratification -- they do. And until they learn that, they will continually bump their little heads against the world they live in and hurt themselves.

Oh, wait, you were talking about FCD. Yeah, often it seems impatience rules the psyches of a lot of the kids playing. That will not be a "disaster" for FCD.

1/12/2010 11:43 AM

jimnei

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1/12/2010 1:10 PM

snake_p

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1/12/2010 1:40 PM

jimnei

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1/12/2010 2:33 PM

snake_p

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Quote: Originally Posted By jimnei on 1/12/2010
None of this fixes any of the issues that have been presented by many users in both this thread and other threads of the "Ideas for Improvement" ilk.

There you are, we agree again.

We may not agree about what constitutes an "issue," however. For example, I don't think that user impatience, which is the underlying feature of most of the threads you refer to, rises to the level of an "issue." Even if it did, the cure lies in RL, not on this site.

1/12/2010 4:12 PM

jimnei

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Quote: Originally posted by snake_p on 1/12/2010
There you are, we agree again. We may not agree about what constitutes an "issue," however. For example, I don't think that user impatience, which is the underlying feature of most of the threads you refer to, rises to the level of an "issue." Even if it did, the cure lies in RL, not on this site.

I started to think about that as I was writing my last post - you make a very good point. WIS/FCD cannot fix a hypothetical societal condition.

1/13/2010 2:25 PM

cosborn

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Impatient? Really. I've been here since season 1. Simply expecting the developers to actually do what they said they would do is anything but impatient. The societal issue isn't expecting commitments to be kept. It's a refusal to look at situations with a truly open mind rather than filtering the in take of information through some filter so people only see and her exactly what they want to see and hear. The truth is - this game is nearly dead. I'd prefer to see it work. It isn't.

I've been with this 8 seasons. I won't be here for 10 unless some things actually get improved. Given the zero growth we see, I suspect I'm not the only participant who feels this way. Why should I invest my time in a game when the develolpers won't make an investment in improving?

1/16/2010 11:53 AM

FW_Kekionga

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FWIW, I hope that 2nd divisions are implemented sooner rather than later, even for worlds that aren't full with human owners. It's getting to the point that teams that have been around since season one are routinely thrashing the new guys with scores of 14-2 or 9-1, or worse. It isn't fair to the new or old owners to have to deal with that kind of game, it isn't competitive and probably isn't fun for the new guys we are trying to keep interested in the game.

With a 2nd division you would have an opportunity to get your team up to par, and a sense of accomplishment for advancement to the top tier. I do realize it is possible to make a new team and have it be a top club in two-three seasons, I have done it myself in several leagues, but I know what I am doing. But it is getting increasingly difficult and the talent gap will only become more apparent after season 10 with the maxed out free agents.

Since there is already a league or two out there with 2 divisions, I don't see this as being a horribly difficult update to implement either, as the framework and coding should already be in place to make it happen. Just my two cents.

1/16/2010 2:47 PM

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