Using Tandem Starting Pitchers Topic

cwillis802
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Oh, okay. I guess I misunderstand what Tandem is then.  I thought that 3A would pitch HALF of the game he starts and then when his pitch count is reached, 3B comes in to pitch the remainder of the game.  You are saying that 3A pitches his game and then the next time around the rotation, 3B gets the start? 
2/12/2011 8:23 PM
contrarian23
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No, cwillis you had it right the first time.

Tandem 3A/3B means exactly what you think.  The 3A guy will start and then be relieved by the 3B guy.  Usually you would set each of their pitch counts to something like 40, 50, or 60.

In contrast, Starter 3A/3B means that they alternate turns in the rotation.  The 3A guy starts the first time that slot in the rotation comes up.  The next time that slot in the rotation comes up, the 3B guy starts.
2/12/2011 8:28 PM
cwillis802
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Right contrarian.  I went and looked it up again because I was sure I was right.  The guy that posted before me was confused.  With that said, I like your comments on the forum and would be curious what you think about Tandems.  Also while we're at it, what do you think of Starter 3a/3b configurations?
2/12/2011 8:30 PM
bottomlee
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I was replying to Dougs post.  My bad.
2/12/2011 9:27 PM
contrarian23
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Posted by cwillis802 on 2/12/2011 8:30:00 PM (view original):
Right contrarian.  I went and looked it up again because I was sure I was right.  The guy that posted before me was confused.  With that said, I like your comments on the forum and would be curious what you think about Tandems.  Also while we're at it, what do you think of Starter 3a/3b configurations?
Thank you for the kind words, though I know I can be a pain in the *** sometimes.  It's the contrarian in me.

Anyway, I like tandems.  I have used them many times with good results.  They come in particularly handy in progressives, where you often don't have enough SP and have to rely on guys with low IP/G to start games.

I have also used tandems for the lefty/right strategy described here.  I don't think it's a huge advantage, but it's a small one.

The one thing I don't like about tandems is that it's not a realistic way to use pitchers.  I can't think of any example of pitching usage in MLB history that would closely resemble what the Tandem setting does.  However, since we have the problem of pitchers who both started and relieved (eg 92 Schilling) effectively getting punished by their low IP/G, I think this alternative at least lets you get some value out of those guys.

2/12/2011 9:35 PM
cwillis802
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I'm surprised actually that some ballclub with a small payroll in MLB hasn't tried a tandem at 4th and 5th starter.  Some team like the Pirates could go with a righty for 4-5 innings and bring in a lefty for the remainder and have great versatility in their rotation. 

In Sim however, it doesn't seem that lefty/righty matchups mean all that much.  My left handed hitters seem to hit lefty pitching better and my righties hit righty pitching better.  But, perhaps this is just some anomoly that my particular team is going through.  Have you noticed such a trend with your hitters?  Pitcher?
2/12/2011 9:41 PM
eschwartz67
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I find that tandems using 2 SPs doesnt work well.  Starters have logic built into the sim that makes tham less effective when they are used as a reliever.  So, a strict starter's stats will suffer if he is used as the back end of a tandem.  If you can use a starter/reliever tandem that can eat up the innings you need, that would work better.  If you have 2 starters, Starter 3a and Starter 3b is a better solution.
2/13/2011 12:31 AM
boogerlips
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The previous comment isn't correct.

2/13/2011 1:37 AM
zubinsum
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Posted by eschwartz67 on 2/13/2011 12:31:00 AM (view original):
I find that tandems using 2 SPs doesnt work well.  Starters have logic built into the sim that makes tham less effective when they are used as a reliever.  So, a strict starter's stats will suffer if he is used as the back end of a tandem.  If you can use a starter/reliever tandem that can eat up the innings you need, that would work better.  If you have 2 starters, Starter 3a and Starter 3b is a better solution.
I agree, that is why I advocate using a relatively high ip/g, high ip/162 reliever as the back end of a tandem. 
2/13/2011 8:50 PM
crazy sven
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using tandem correctly makes one less decision for SIM to screw up
2/15/2011 4:58 PM
grayfoxx
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They still screw it up. My tandemA starter went 4 innings, my tandemB started the 5th - a walk, a ground out, a homerun - my tandemB got pulled after 10 pitches even though he had a TPC of 60 and a pull setting of one.
2/15/2011 5:52 PM
dracul
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Posted by zubinsum on 2/13/2011 8:50:00 PM (view original):
Posted by eschwartz67 on 2/13/2011 12:31:00 AM (view original):
I find that tandems using 2 SPs doesnt work well.  Starters have logic built into the sim that makes tham less effective when they are used as a reliever.  So, a strict starter's stats will suffer if he is used as the back end of a tandem.  If you can use a starter/reliever tandem that can eat up the innings you need, that would work better.  If you have 2 starters, Starter 3a and Starter 3b is a better solution.
I agree, that is why I advocate using a relatively high ip/g, high ip/162 reliever as the back end of a tandem. 
Wow.  So a backend Tandem *Starter* will receive a "reliever as a starter" performance penalty??

That's insane.  Why would WIS want to penalize people without giving any indication that such a penalty exists?

Is this a factual assessment or just an informed opinion?
2/15/2011 5:57 PM
skunk206
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It's neither, because there is no performance penalty.  Boogerlips pointed that out in the very next post.
2/15/2011 6:02 PM
eastvanmungo
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So, what's the consensus?  When setting up a tandem duo does the weaker (as in worse) pitcher go first or second?
2/22/2011 10:36 PM
jfranco77
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I usually put the better guy first. No sense wasting the better guy when your worse guy put you in a 4-1 hole after 4 innings. If the worse guy pitches 2nd and gets beat up, you'll get into your bullpen.
2/22/2011 11:01 PM
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