DOMA & Prop 8 Topic

I thought we talking about society, not me specifically.
6/18/2013 11:53 AM
Society as a whole is better off when people have the freedom to live the life they want to live*.


*this should go without saying but obviously this doesn't include things like murder etc that clearly harm someone else.
6/18/2013 11:57 AM
I would like the freedom to live a life in an American society where marriage means "one man / one woman", as has always been the case since the begining of human culture and civiliation. 

As would many other people.

Why are you against my being able to live the life I want to live?
6/18/2013 12:18 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 6/18/2013 12:18:00 PM (view original):
I would like the freedom to live a life in an American society where marriage means "one man / one woman", as has always been the case since the begining of human culture and civiliation. 

As would many other people.

Why are you against my being able to live the life I want to live?
You are allowed to have a one man/one woman marriage. Why do you insist on dictating how everyone else gets to live?
6/18/2013 12:47 PM
Society gets to decide that, not me.

But I'm a member of society, so I get a say.
6/18/2013 12:49 PM
FWIW, in anticipation of your likely follow-up comment, society doesn't always make the best choices, as can be seen by past "choices" such as slavery, bans on interracial marriage, etc.
6/18/2013 12:52 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
Yes, it makes society better.
How does SSM make society better?

You can be vague or specific but I'd like to know.
6/18/2013 12:55 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 6/18/2013 12:49:00 PM (view original):
Society gets to decide that, not me.

But I'm a member of society, so I get a say.
Sometimes. And sometimes society isn't capable of making the right choice (as you noted with slavery, interracial marriage, etc) and courts have to right the wrong. And, even then, society as a whole is better off.
6/18/2013 12:55 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
Yes, it makes society better.
How does SSM make society better?

You can be vague or specific but I'd like to know.
More people have the freedom to live the life they want.

Standard murder etc disclaimer applies.
6/18/2013 12:56 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 6/18/2013 12:49:00 PM (view original):
Society gets to decide that, not me.

But I'm a member of society, so I get a say.
Sometimes. And sometimes society isn't capable of making the right choice (as you noted with slavery, interracial marriage, etc) and courts have to right the wrong. And, even then, society as a whole is better off.
And if SCOTUS ends up upholding DOMA and Prop 8, would you accept that society has spoken and the courts have upheld and validated society's choice?

Or will you continue whining?
6/18/2013 1:13 PM (edited)
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 12:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
Yes, it makes society better.
How does SSM make society better?

You can be vague or specific but I'd like to know.
More people have the freedom to live the life they want.

Standard murder etc disclaimer applies.
I'm not convinced that more people having the freedom to live the life they want is better.

A few states have legalized the use of pot.   As an ex-doper, I recognize that the buzz of pot pretty much robs one of ambition.  Maybe it's just for a few hours, maybe it's for the rest of your life.   It's nice to be mellow but it can be taken way too far.   I'm sure that you're all for the legalization of pot but do you at least understand the drawbacks?
6/18/2013 1:24 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 1:24:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 12:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
Yes, it makes society better.
How does SSM make society better?

You can be vague or specific but I'd like to know.
More people have the freedom to live the life they want.

Standard murder etc disclaimer applies.
I'm not convinced that more people having the freedom to live the life they want is better.

A few states have legalized the use of pot.   As an ex-doper, I recognize that the buzz of pot pretty much robs one of ambition.  Maybe it's just for a few hours, maybe it's for the rest of your life.   It's nice to be mellow but it can be taken way too far.   I'm sure that you're all for the legalization of pot but do you at least understand the drawbacks?
Plenty of legal things have drawbacks. Alcohol, cheeseburgers, and cigarettes are three examples. Yet we have the freedom to use them if we want. Pot isn't any worse than alcohol.

But, keeping with your theme, what is the drawback of allowing gay marriage?
6/18/2013 1:28 PM
Posted by tecwrg on 6/18/2013 1:13:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 6/18/2013 12:49:00 PM (view original):
Society gets to decide that, not me.

But I'm a member of society, so I get a say.
Sometimes. And sometimes society isn't capable of making the right choice (as you noted with slavery, interracial marriage, etc) and courts have to right the wrong. And, even then, society as a whole is better off.
And if SCOTUS ends up upholding DOMA and Prop 8, would you accept that society has spoken and the courts have upheld and validated society's choice?

Or will you continue whining?
Nope. I'll still disagree.
6/18/2013 1:28 PM
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 1:28:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 1:24:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 12:56:00 PM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/18/2013 12:55:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/18/2013 10:24:00 AM (view original):
Yes, it makes society better.
How does SSM make society better?

You can be vague or specific but I'd like to know.
More people have the freedom to live the life they want.

Standard murder etc disclaimer applies.
I'm not convinced that more people having the freedom to live the life they want is better.

A few states have legalized the use of pot.   As an ex-doper, I recognize that the buzz of pot pretty much robs one of ambition.  Maybe it's just for a few hours, maybe it's for the rest of your life.   It's nice to be mellow but it can be taken way too far.   I'm sure that you're all for the legalization of pot but do you at least understand the drawbacks?
Plenty of legal things have drawbacks. Alcohol, cheeseburgers, and cigarettes are three examples. Yet we have the freedom to use them if we want. Pot isn't any worse than alcohol.

But, keeping with your theme, what is the drawback of allowing gay marriage?
Why do dopers always say "It's no worse than alcohol?"   It actually is.   You can get stoned up in about 12 seconds.   It takes a while to get ********* drunk.   You have to put in some effort.  Smoke outside, slip on a pair of shades and no one knows you're stoned unless you give it away with your actions.   Drink a pint of whiskey and people smell it on you.   Pot and alcohol aren't comparable in a lot of ways.   I've never seen a bunch of stoners have a brawl over a dropped doobie.

Haven't we covered the many drawbacks of SSM in the previous 200+ pages?

So, I'll ask again, why do you insist on asking questions that have already been answered?
6/18/2013 1:33 PM
Because he's run out of argument.

He's already gone back to "What's the harm, it doesn't affect you".
6/18/2013 1:40 PM
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DOMA & Prop 8 Topic

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