And one final thing, if I want to have two teams in a world and pay TWICE as much money to play the game as a coach with one team, well then.  Reward points only get you so far, sooner or later you've got to shell out for some more seasons (unless you're winning titles and going to the Elite Eight and Final Four like, every season and only a very few users can make that claim).

Personally, I don't have a strong opinion on the opening issue one way or another, but since many of the "fixes" proposed here have included making some drastic change to FSS, let me just say:

LEAVE FSS ALONE.

Don't make it free. Don't make its info universal, nor dramatically limited. Just leave it basically the way it is. It's a critical, strategic part of the game - there are successful coaches who FSS 2-3 states, and others who FSS 30+ states regularly. That diversity in approach is a great thing. And there are many coaches like me who've figured out an FSS approach that works for them, who are going to be really ****** off if that's compromised to solve another issue that they care a lot less about.

Posted by dcy0827 on 5/23/2014 11:05:00 PM (view original):
Coaches WERE playing by the rules in place at the time.  The rules got switched midstream.  That's what you don't seem to understand genius and THAT'S what's ******* people off. 

It is obvious that its a computer game that was designed NOT to have more than one team per world.  If they wanted you to be able to have more than one team per world then they could have easily created it that way.  They didn't.

One obviously has an advantage of knowing exactly what two teams in a given world are doing if they have two teams in the same world.  That is a form of collusion under the rules if two coaches do the same thing.

dcy, answer this honestly, if two teams in the same recruiting area (lets call it 1000 miles) told each other before recruiting everything that one coach with 2 teams knows about their teams, would you consider that cheating?  In all seriousness, if a person thinks that scenario is OK, then they would also think that owning two teams is OK too.

I mean, if me and BillyG told each other exactly how much money we had, exactly who in the recruiting area where we are going to recruit and why, etc.  Then while recruiting is happening we shared sitemails detailing every dollar we spent where, told each other how much we had in reserve, etc.

If you would consider any of that inappropriate, then one player owning both my and BillyG's team would be just as inappropriate.

Now, that is not to say that BillyG or I actually used any of that information.  But the thing about information is ... if you have it then you can't unlearn it.

All of that said, do I think that everyone who has 2 teams is purposefully trying to cheat .. of course not.  Cheaters are going to cheat no matter what, its what they do.  People can certainly go out of their way to minimize and mitigate the advantages that they have by having two teams.  Having two teams is not going to guarantee that one will win multiple championships .. it is not a HUGE advantage unless one is actively trying to cheat.

But, if one is going to have rules in a game then people should follow the rules so that everyone is playing on an even playing field.  If you are going to have a rule then you have to have a start date and you have to enforce it for everyone.

I mean, do I think that the advantage is hugely different if someone is at 947 miles or 1003 miles away .. no, not at all.  There is no difference between those two scenarios.

hughesjr with the microphone drop; exit stage right. thread over.

Posted by hughesjr on 5/24/2014 7:08:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dcy0827 on 5/23/2014 11:05:00 PM (view original):
Coaches WERE playing by the rules in place at the time.  The rules got switched midstream.  That's what you don't seem to understand genius and THAT'S what's ******* people off. 

It is obvious that its a computer game that was designed NOT to have more than one team per world.  If they wanted you to be able to have more than one team per world then they could have easily created it that way.  They didn't.

One obviously has an advantage of knowing exactly what two teams in a given world are doing if they have two teams in the same world.  That is a form of collusion under the rules if two coaches do the same thing.

dcy, answer this honestly, if two teams in the same recruiting area (lets call it 1000 miles) told each other before recruiting everything that one coach with 2 teams knows about their teams, would you consider that cheating?  In all seriousness, if a person thinks that scenario is OK, then they would also think that owning two teams is OK too.

I mean, if me and BillyG told each other exactly how much money we had, exactly who in the recruiting area where we are going to recruit and why, etc.  Then while recruiting is happening we shared sitemails detailing every dollar we spent where, told each other how much we had in reserve, etc.

If you would consider any of that inappropriate, then one player owning both my and BillyG's team would be just as inappropriate.

Now, that is not to say that BillyG or I actually used any of that information.  But the thing about information is ... if you have it then you can't unlearn it.

All of that said, do I think that everyone who has 2 teams is purposefully trying to cheat .. of course not.  Cheaters are going to cheat no matter what, its what they do.  People can certainly go out of their way to minimize and mitigate the advantages that they have by having two teams.  Having two teams is not going to guarantee that one will win multiple championships .. it is not a HUGE advantage unless one is actively trying to cheat.

But, if one is going to have rules in a game then people should follow the rules so that everyone is playing on an even playing field.  If you are going to have a rule then you have to have a start date and you have to enforce it for everyone.

I mean, do I think that the advantage is hugely different if someone is at 947 miles or 1003 miles away .. no, not at all.  There is no difference between those two scenarios.

very valid points - this is the discussion people should be having about multiple teams. should have been having? anyway, the problem is posts like this get lost in the sea of a million "FSS sharing" posts, so you have people talking about changing FSS altogether to fix multiple teams - which is crazy. that is not the issue. there are a few issues i guess, but what hughes brings up is one of the main ones, where changing FSS has no impact (as far as potential abuse goes).

Posted by hughesjr on 5/24/2014 7:08:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dcy0827 on 5/23/2014 11:05:00 PM (view original):
Coaches WERE playing by the rules in place at the time.  The rules got switched midstream.  That's what you don't seem to understand genius and THAT'S what's ******* people off. 

It is obvious that its a computer game that was designed NOT to have more than one team per world.  If they wanted you to be able to have more than one team per world then they could have easily created it that way.  They didn't.

One obviously has an advantage of knowing exactly what two teams in a given world are doing if they have two teams in the same world.  That is a form of collusion under the rules if two coaches do the same thing.

dcy, answer this honestly, if two teams in the same recruiting area (lets call it 1000 miles) told each other before recruiting everything that one coach with 2 teams knows about their teams, would you consider that cheating?  In all seriousness, if a person thinks that scenario is OK, then they would also think that owning two teams is OK too.

I mean, if me and BillyG told each other exactly how much money we had, exactly who in the recruiting area where we are going to recruit and why, etc.  Then while recruiting is happening we shared sitemails detailing every dollar we spent where, told each other how much we had in reserve, etc.

If you would consider any of that inappropriate, then one player owning both my and BillyG's team would be just as inappropriate.

Now, that is not to say that BillyG or I actually used any of that information.  But the thing about information is ... if you have it then you can't unlearn it.

All of that said, do I think that everyone who has 2 teams is purposefully trying to cheat .. of course not.  Cheaters are going to cheat no matter what, its what they do.  People can certainly go out of their way to minimize and mitigate the advantages that they have by having two teams.  Having two teams is not going to guarantee that one will win multiple championships .. it is not a HUGE advantage unless one is actively trying to cheat.

But, if one is going to have rules in a game then people should follow the rules so that everyone is playing on an even playing field.  If you are going to have a rule then you have to have a start date and you have to enforce it for everyone.

I mean, do I think that the advantage is hugely different if someone is at 947 miles or 1003 miles away .. no, not at all.  There is no difference between those two scenarios.

Very valid points Hughes and I sincerely appreciate the rational and well thought out answer.  I'll answer your questions, but I need to know your feelings on one other scenario that I mentioned first.  What about a father and son competing in the same world against each other?  Would that be considered "illegal" in your mind?  If so, then WIS doesn't seem like a very family-friendly, oriented type game, does it (not being sarcastic, just truthful)?  Suppose it's two brothers, very competitive.  How would they be able to compete against each other, given the way you want the system to be set up?  In your world, they couldn't/can't.  Just doesn't seem right to me.

Again, appreciate the well thought out response above.

The "family" excuse for having two teams in same world is as weak they come. If they can not find anything other than WIS to compete in they have serious problems. It is simply an excuse to use when people want to cheat. How many are real and not imagined 'family'.

Posted by dcy0827 on 5/24/2014 12:34:00 PM (view original):

Posted by hughesjr on 5/24/2014 7:08:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dcy0827 on 5/23/2014 11:05:00 PM (view original):
Coaches WERE playing by the rules in place at the time.  The rules got switched midstream.  That's what you don't seem to understand genius and THAT'S what's ******* people off. 

It is obvious that its a computer game that was designed NOT to have more than one team per world.  If they wanted you to be able to have more than one team per world then they could have easily created it that way.  They didn't.

One obviously has an advantage of knowing exactly what two teams in a given world are doing if they have two teams in the same world.  That is a form of collusion under the rules if two coaches do the same thing.

dcy, answer this honestly, if two teams in the same recruiting area (lets call it 1000 miles) told each other before recruiting everything that one coach with 2 teams knows about their teams, would you consider that cheating?  In all seriousness, if a person thinks that scenario is OK, then they would also think that owning two teams is OK too.

I mean, if me and BillyG told each other exactly how much money we had, exactly who in the recruiting area where we are going to recruit and why, etc.  Then while recruiting is happening we shared sitemails detailing every dollar we spent where, told each other how much we had in reserve, etc.

If you would consider any of that inappropriate, then one player owning both my and BillyG's team would be just as inappropriate.

Now, that is not to say that BillyG or I actually used any of that information.  But the thing about information is ... if you have it then you can't unlearn it.

All of that said, do I think that everyone who has 2 teams is purposefully trying to cheat .. of course not.  Cheaters are going to cheat no matter what, its what they do.  People can certainly go out of their way to minimize and mitigate the advantages that they have by having two teams.  Having two teams is not going to guarantee that one will win multiple championships .. it is not a HUGE advantage unless one is actively trying to cheat.

But, if one is going to have rules in a game then people should follow the rules so that everyone is playing on an even playing field.  If you are going to have a rule then you have to have a start date and you have to enforce it for everyone.

I mean, do I think that the advantage is hugely different if someone is at 947 miles or 1003 miles away .. no, not at all.  There is no difference between those two scenarios.

Very valid points Hughes and I sincerely appreciate the rational and well thought out answer.  I'll answer your questions, but I need to know your feelings on one other scenario that I mentioned first.  What about a father and son competing in the same world against each other?  Would that be considered "illegal" in your mind?  If so, then WIS doesn't seem like a very family-friendly, oriented type game, does it (not being sarcastic, just truthful)?  Suppose it's two brothers, very competitive.  How would they be able to compete against each other, given the way you want the system to be set up?  In your world, they couldn't/can't.  Just doesn't seem right to me.

Again, appreciate the well thought out response above.

I have no issue with two people from the same family playing against each other.

I'm not sure how the issue of father/son, brothers, or whatever applies. That's not the same thing as having two teams in the same world by one person, I wouldn't think.

Posted by taniajane on 5/24/2014 4:43:00 PM (view original):
The "family" excuse for having two teams in same world is as weak they come. If they can not find anything other than WIS to compete in they have serious problems. It is simply an excuse to use when people want to cheat. How many are real and not imagined 'family'.

Sure here here ...lets make sure that there are no family members are even close friends inviting each other to play WIS.   Lets save those available teams for the SIMs.

That post is about as weak as they come.

Gee my other split personality is my sister...and we like to compete but we wont share info......get lost with that excuse lamers

Posted by taniajane on 5/24/2014 6:45:00 PM (view original):
Gee my other split personality is my sister...and we like to compete but we wont share info......get lost with that excuse lamers

Adults are trying to discuss things here.

Posted by mullycj on 5/24/2014 5:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by taniajane on 5/24/2014 4:43:00 PM (view original):
The "family" excuse for having two teams in same world is as weak they come. If they can not find anything other than WIS to compete in they have serious problems. It is simply an excuse to use when people want to cheat. How many are real and not imagined 'family'.

Sure here here ...lets make sure that there are no family members are even close friends inviting each other to play WIS.   Lets save those available teams for the SIMs.

That post is about as weak as they come.

Exactly this.

But I also don't see how family members playing against each other in the same world--even if the schools they were at were 10 miles from each other--violates any rules.

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/24/2014 7:19:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mullycj on 5/24/2014 5:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by taniajane on 5/24/2014 4:43:00 PM (view original):
The "family" excuse for having two teams in same world is as weak they come. If they can not find anything other than WIS to compete in they have serious problems. It is simply an excuse to use when people want to cheat. How many are real and not imagined 'family'.

Sure here here ...lets make sure that there are no family members are even close friends inviting each other to play WIS.   Lets save those available teams for the SIMs.

That post is about as weak as they come.

Exactly this.

But I also don't see how family members playing against each other in the same world--even if the schools they were at were 10 miles from each other--violates any rules.

I think the issue is that some people think that this is the biggest excuse used by people who get caught violating the 1000 mile rule ... No, that other account belongs to my son/father/brother.

If someone was doing that, pretending to have another family member to get 2 teams in the same conference, then that would of course be bad.

But certainly 2 legitimate teams by two family members in the same conference is fine.

I don't see this as a problem ... I suppose it could be, but I don't know of anyone doing it.  Of course, if you are purposefully cheating then that would be the point :)