Posted by nachopuzzle on 5/7/2014 2:41:00 PM (view original):
Here is the follow-up to the original ticket that I posted on this thread a few days ago.

Ticket:

Hello, this is a follow-up to a ticket I previously submitted about a thread in the HD forum named "long overdue...user polls". I would have attached these responses to that ticket, but for some reason that ticket was closed. I believe seble was the admin that wrote the original reply to my ticket.

Keep in mind, the majority of the poll options originated from the HD community and not myself, so I will do my best to interpret their meanings.

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I'm not sure what's meant by this one.

> "halftime feedback" as popularly understood by the HD community refers to the correctional measures that kick-in to make sure teams aren't vastly under and/or over performing.

- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* This is a little vague. Is there a specific scenario or type of player you're talking about?

> This refers to the discrepancy with the way fouls are sometimes determined, like wild swings between team fouls in the first & second halves of games and a team's best defensive player picking up two fouls in the first minute of a game, etc.

- Increases chances of offensive of offensive fouls for teams running uptempo
* Not sure I see the reasoning behind this one, but if there's data to back this up I'm open to incorporating it.

> I'll ask around and see if any body that can offer insight or produce any data/specifics on this option...but considering it's overall lack of success in the poll, I don't think this is high on the community's list either.

Thanks

Response:

More feedback:

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I was not aware of this concept floating around. This isn't accurate. What happens is that the current outcome in the engine may be somewhat affected by previous outcomes. This is not something that flips on at halftime. It happens throughout the game and is meant to prevent extreme results. An example would be instead of a guy shooting 8/10 in a game he may shoot 6/10 or 7/10. It's not an overwhelming adjustment.


- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* There's no discrepancy in how fouls are determined, it's always the same logic. The variables affecting that logic may change throughout the game. Normally there's a reason (even if it's not always obvious), but sometimes it's just random luck. That stuff happens in real life too, so I don't see a reason to eliminate it from the sim.

Again, its safe to assume that seble is the one speaking here.

Posted by terps21234 on 5/7/2014 3:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 10:48:00 AM (view original):

Posted by ettaexpress on 5/7/2014 12:43:00 AM (view original):
I've made a useful post on this thread far more recently than you (if indeed you have, I don't really remember). So get out a mirror if you want to see a less contributory poster on the board.

Again, you have absolutely no sense of irony. Your last sentence was just a doozy.

Name one good post you posted.  LET ME SEE THE PROOF. You haven't given any good info on this post, except to your twin Nick.  You logic is stupid, you're an idiot, and you're dumber than anyone who knows basketball. You obviously don't know **** and prove it time and time again. You don't know how this SIM works and the only one you ever played was that stupid idiotic dolphinism.

Not sure what you're on me about. I don't know anything about "dolphinsim" or whatever, so maybe you intended this for EE?

Posted by nachopuzzle on 5/7/2014 4:15:00 PM (view original):

Posted by nachopuzzle on 5/7/2014 2:41:00 PM (view original):
Here is the follow-up to the original ticket that I posted on this thread a few days ago.

Ticket:

Hello, this is a follow-up to a ticket I previously submitted about a thread in the HD forum named "long overdue...user polls". I would have attached these responses to that ticket, but for some reason that ticket was closed. I believe seble was the admin that wrote the original reply to my ticket.

Keep in mind, the majority of the poll options originated from the HD community and not myself, so I will do my best to interpret their meanings.

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I'm not sure what's meant by this one.

> "halftime feedback" as popularly understood by the HD community refers to the correctional measures that kick-in to make sure teams aren't vastly under and/or over performing.

- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* This is a little vague. Is there a specific scenario or type of player you're talking about?

> This refers to the discrepancy with the way fouls are sometimes determined, like wild swings between team fouls in the first & second halves of games and a team's best defensive player picking up two fouls in the first minute of a game, etc.

- Increases chances of offensive of offensive fouls for teams running uptempo
* Not sure I see the reasoning behind this one, but if there's data to back this up I'm open to incorporating it.

> I'll ask around and see if any body that can offer insight or produce any data/specifics on this option...but considering it's overall lack of success in the poll, I don't think this is high on the community's list either.

Thanks

Response:

More feedback:

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I was not aware of this concept floating around. This isn't accurate. What happens is that the current outcome in the engine may be somewhat affected by previous outcomes. This is not something that flips on at halftime. It happens throughout the game and is meant to prevent extreme results. An example would be instead of a guy shooting 8/10 in a game he may shoot 6/10 or 7/10. It's not an overwhelming adjustment.


- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* There's no discrepancy in how fouls are determined, it's always the same logic. The variables affecting that logic may change throughout the game. Normally there's a reason (even if it's not always obvious), but sometimes it's just random luck. That stuff happens in real life too, so I don't see a reason to eliminate it from the sim.

Again, its safe to assume that seble is the one speaking here.

I agree that's a safe assumption. I disagree with Seble's assertion "that stuff happens in real life too", at least not in all the cases. Quite awhile ago, I had a team that was up something like 49-19 at half at home (it was either 29 or 30 points), against a really bad team. In the second half, we got outscored something like 54-13. The foul disparity in the second half was HUGE--something like 23-5, and the other team shot like 40-45 FTs, while my team shot 12 or 13. I have never seen a similar game result occur in real life. I've had similar--though not so egregious--results spit out every couple seasons. It's not even necessarily losing the game that frustrated me, just the completely unrealistic way the game plays out every so often.

Margin of victory affects a team's ranking and/or position on the projection report - true or false?

Posted by llamanunts on 5/7/2014 4:55:00 PM (view original):
Margin of victory affects a team's ranking and/or position on the projection report - true or false?

Off the top of my head...I can't speak for rankings, but as far as the projection reports are concerned I think they play a very small roll...though again, that's off the top of my coconut.

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 4:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by nachopuzzle on 5/7/2014 4:15:00 PM (view original):

Posted by nachopuzzle on 5/7/2014 2:41:00 PM (view original):
Here is the follow-up to the original ticket that I posted on this thread a few days ago.

Ticket:

Hello, this is a follow-up to a ticket I previously submitted about a thread in the HD forum named "long overdue...user polls". I would have attached these responses to that ticket, but for some reason that ticket was closed. I believe seble was the admin that wrote the original reply to my ticket.

Keep in mind, the majority of the poll options originated from the HD community and not myself, so I will do my best to interpret their meanings.

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I'm not sure what's meant by this one.

> "halftime feedback" as popularly understood by the HD community refers to the correctional measures that kick-in to make sure teams aren't vastly under and/or over performing.

- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* This is a little vague. Is there a specific scenario or type of player you're talking about?

> This refers to the discrepancy with the way fouls are sometimes determined, like wild swings between team fouls in the first & second halves of games and a team's best defensive player picking up two fouls in the first minute of a game, etc.

- Increases chances of offensive of offensive fouls for teams running uptempo
* Not sure I see the reasoning behind this one, but if there's data to back this up I'm open to incorporating it.

> I'll ask around and see if any body that can offer insight or produce any data/specifics on this option...but considering it's overall lack of success in the poll, I don't think this is high on the community's list either.

Thanks

Response:

More feedback:

- Eliminate halftime "feedback" used by the engine
* I was not aware of this concept floating around. This isn't accurate. What happens is that the current outcome in the engine may be somewhat affected by previous outcomes. This is not something that flips on at halftime. It happens throughout the game and is meant to prevent extreme results. An example would be instead of a guy shooting 8/10 in a game he may shoot 6/10 or 7/10. It's not an overwhelming adjustment.


- Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players
* There's no discrepancy in how fouls are determined, it's always the same logic. The variables affecting that logic may change throughout the game. Normally there's a reason (even if it's not always obvious), but sometimes it's just random luck. That stuff happens in real life too, so I don't see a reason to eliminate it from the sim.

Again, its safe to assume that seble is the one speaking here.

I agree that's a safe assumption. I disagree with Seble's assertion "that stuff happens in real life too", at least not in all the cases. Quite awhile ago, I had a team that was up something like 49-19 at half at home (it was either 29 or 30 points), against a really bad team. In the second half, we got outscored something like 54-13. The foul disparity in the second half was HUGE--something like 23-5, and the other team shot like 40-45 FTs, while my team shot 12 or 13. I have never seen a similar game result occur in real life. I've had similar--though not so egregious--results spit out every couple seasons. It's not even necessarily losing the game that frustrated me, just the completely unrealistic way the game plays out every so often.

I'll show my hand here and admit that my first vote relating to the engine was for "Improve the ways fouls are determined and assessed to individual players", and  this has been my biggest problem with the game by far over the years. Way to many times have I seen a team with better ATH, SPD, DEF, and IQ commit more & earlier fouls that there worse counterparts.

In Seble's response, he said "the variables affecting that logic may change throughout the game. Normally there's a reason (even though it's not always obvious)," by which I'm assuming that fatigue plays a portion in this equation...as I agree it definitely should. However, I rarely set players above fairly fresh, yet I still see it happen so many times (and to be intellectually honest I have to admit that players could be tired and I wouldn't necessarily know it).

Nor do I think that luck shouldn't play a part in the equation. However, the current method for determining and assessing fouls just drives me crazy...I could go on all day about this, but I'll leave it at that for the moment.

Posted by terps21234 on 5/7/2014 3:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 10:48:00 AM (view original):

Posted by ettaexpress on 5/7/2014 12:43:00 AM (view original):
I've made a useful post on this thread far more recently than you (if indeed you have, I don't really remember). So get out a mirror if you want to see a less contributory poster on the board.

Again, you have absolutely no sense of irony. Your last sentence was just a doozy.

Name one good post you posted.  LET ME SEE THE PROOF. You haven't given any good info on this post, except to your twin Nick.  You logic is stupid, you're an idiot, and you're dumber than anyone who knows basketball. You obviously don't know **** and prove it time and time again. You don't know how this SIM works and the only one you ever played was that stupid idiotic dolphinism.

Please refrain from calling me anyone's twin. By saying that, you make it appear as though I agree with very issue Etta addresses.

I have a different opinion on recruiting as everyone else. They explain to me why I should do things differently and I to them on why I do things my way.

I have done actual recruiting in the past, I see the benefits of FSS, but I don't believe the costs out weigh the benefits. I have first hand experience working directly with scouting services. They are not as accurate as they are in the SIM. Coaches, rely on many other factors than that. Many coaches(smart coaches) should recruit to their system(s). I think that holds true here and in the real world.

I am trying to move on to other issues with game. I mentioned 2 things the other day. Not sure they were seen among the posts.

I'd be interested in seeing what makes it so you "don't believe the costs out weigh the benefits" regarding FSS. If you scout any player(s) from a given state more than once, you could've just FSS'd that state and had reports from Future Stars for 30+ players in that state.

Posted by nickguy08 on 5/7/2014 5:21:00 PM (view original):

Posted by terps21234 on 5/7/2014 3:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 10:48:00 AM (view original):

Posted by ettaexpress on 5/7/2014 12:43:00 AM (view original):
I've made a useful post on this thread far more recently than you (if indeed you have, I don't really remember). So get out a mirror if you want to see a less contributory poster on the board.

Again, you have absolutely no sense of irony. Your last sentence was just a doozy.

Name one good post you posted.  LET ME SEE THE PROOF. You haven't given any good info on this post, except to your twin Nick.  You logic is stupid, you're an idiot, and you're dumber than anyone who knows basketball. You obviously don't know **** and prove it time and time again. You don't know how this SIM works and the only one you ever played was that stupid idiotic dolphinism.

Please refrain from calling me anyone's twin. By saying that, you make it appear as though I agree with very issue Etta addresses.

I have a different opinion on recruiting as everyone else. They explain to me why I should do things differently and I to them on why I do things my way.

I have done actual recruiting in the past, I see the benefits of FSS, but I don't believe the costs out weigh the benefits. I have first hand experience working directly with scouting services. They are not as accurate as they are in the SIM. Coaches, rely on many other factors than that. Many coaches(smart coaches) should recruit to their system(s). I think that holds true here and in the real world.

I am trying to move on to other issues with game. I mentioned 2 things the other day. Not sure they were seen among the posts.

Great post. I actually do disagree with you to some extent on the value of FSS, but I think you bring up a good point as well which makes me wonder if I'm actually using it too much rather than not enough as some have said.

I've worked with and for scouting services too, and you're absolutely right. Even the best can't tell you what some guy's precise potential in every category is. Even telling you how good someone is at present is often a sticky wicket. 

I've never heard of any really good coach in HD that doesn't use FSS fairly extensively. It doesn't matter how recruiting services work in the real world. It matters how it works HERE, in HD. And in HD, the FSS is incredibly valuable. That is simply beyond debate.

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 6:08:00 PM (view original):
I've never heard of any really good coach in HD that doesn't use FSS fairly extensively. It doesn't matter how recruiting services work in the real world. It matters how it works HERE, in HD. And in HD, the FSS is incredibly valuable. That is simply beyond debate.

If you want a more realistic experience, the service has to be wrong.

Posted by nickguy08 on 5/7/2014 6:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 6:08:00 PM (view original):
I've never heard of any really good coach in HD that doesn't use FSS fairly extensively. It doesn't matter how recruiting services work in the real world. It matters how it works HERE, in HD. And in HD, the FSS is incredibly valuable. That is simply beyond debate.

If you want a more realistic experience, the service has to be wrong.

But FSS is what we actually HAVE right now. And unless you want it to be more like "Dolphinsim" (which I just did some research on), where it's just a total crapshoot in recruiting, then it's not going to change. And recruiting services in real life aren't NEARLY the crapshoot you are making them out to be. They're not perfect, but they usually get it fairly right.

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 5:34:00 PM (view original):
I'd be interested in seeing what makes it so you "don't believe the costs out weigh the benefits" regarding FSS. If you scout any player(s) from a given state more than once, you could've just FSS'd that state and had reports from Future Stars for 30+ players in that state.

I coach in TX right now, in my world. I need current ratings (bottom threshold) to be at certain level to start with before I even begin. I am sure you all do that to a certain extent. At a certain level, I might get one recruit, but then that recruit might have a low WE. I expand my search range and lower my standards, now I am covering 5 states. I am not going to spend that kind of money just to see if a PG with SPD 40 is going to get better. I especially won't recruit that state if I don't see current ratings of another position at certain level within that state. Now we are talking distance and competition with other coaches. I need to lower my standards for current ratings? That doesn't make much sense either. If I can recruit to a system, I think I am much better off anyway.

In my humble opinion, at D3 (and I've even seen D2 coaches use this method almost exclusively), if you just FSS'd Texas then you'd have more than enough variety on a yearly basis to be competitive at a very very high level.

Posted by nickguy08 on 5/7/2014 6:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wildcat98 on 5/7/2014 6:08:00 PM (view original):
I've never heard of any really good coach in HD that doesn't use FSS fairly extensively. It doesn't matter how recruiting services work in the real world. It matters how it works HERE, in HD. And in HD, the FSS is incredibly valuable. That is simply beyond debate.

If you want a more realistic experience, the service has to be wrong.

That I totally agree with. I would like to see a slightly different system but I can't think of a real good way to change it.