Posted by burnsy483 on 5/21/2014 12:35:00 PM (view original):
What I'm saying is that more players hack away than they used to.  Not all players.

In general, they do. But in this specific situation (runner on third, one out), it doesn't seem like it's true. The strikeouts are less frequent than the overall K rate of 20+%. Players are changing their approach when they bat with a runner on third and one out.

Some are, many aren't.  It used to be a sin to not get that guy in, now, not so much.  Especially with 2 strikes, shorten up a little.

Posted by burnsy483 on 5/21/2014 12:44:00 PM (view original):
Some are, many aren't.  It used to be a sin to not get that guy in, now, not so much.  Especially with 2 strikes, shorten up a little.

What do you mean, "many aren't?"

Look at the data. Players have always struck out sometimes in this situation, the pitchers are getting paid too. Overall though, the K rate goes down when there is a runner on third and one out.

You:  "Players are changing their approach"
Me: "Many aren't."

It used to be something that almost all players did.  It was well understood.  That isn't the case anymore.  If you want to tell me the K rate is the same and I'm wrong, ok, maybe there's another reason why that rate is the same.  I'd argue the "strikeout is just another out" mentality hurts teams from time to time because many players don't change their mentality when it's more important to put the ball in play.

Posted by burnsy483 on 5/21/2014 1:37:00 PM (view original):
You:  "Players are changing their approach"
Me: "Many aren't."

It used to be something that almost all players did.  It was well understood.  That isn't the case anymore.  If you want to tell me the K rate is the same and I'm wrong, ok, maybe there's another reason why that rate is the same.  I'd argue the "strikeout is just another out" mentality hurts teams from time to time because many players don't change their mentality when it's more important to put the ball in play.

This is deja vu "Edgar Martinez walked when the game was on the line."

It used to be something that almost all players did.  It was well understood.  That isn't the case anymore.

What are you basing this on? The K rate in 2014 with a runner on 3rd and one out is 15.9%.
17.8 in 2013
15.7 in 2010
15.2 in 2000
15.0 in 1993
13.1 in 1983
15.8 in 1973
15.9 in 1963

I'd argue the "strikeout is just another out" mentality hurts teams from time to time because many players don't change their mentality when it's more important to put the ball in play.

What makes you think they aren't doing that?

Maybe he's, you know, actually WATCHING MLB baseball games.

It's no surprise to anybody who actually watches MLB games that players have changed their approach to hitting over the years.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

Please tell me how that fits into your assertion that "hitters are still changing their approach by situation".

Yea, it's pure observation.  You'll tell me I'm wrong, and that's fine, I guess.  Maybe the Mets just suck.

Granderson's strikeout rate, FWIW, is pretty much the same with runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs than it is normally.  It seems like there are more guys like that than there used to be.  

Posted by tecwrg on 5/21/2014 2:05:00 PM (view original):
Maybe he's, you know, actually WATCHING MLB baseball games.

It's no surprise to anybody who actually watches MLB games that players have changed their approach to hitting over the years.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

I watch baseball games. Yes, the overall hitting approach has changed.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

So what? An out is an out.

Posted by tecwrg on 5/21/2014 2:12:00 PM (view original):
Please tell me how that fits into your assertion that "hitters are still changing their approach by situation".

The man on third, one out K rate is almost exactly the same as it was in 2000, 1993, 1973, and 1963.

That's how.

Why don't you tell us more about how BABIP should include home runs?

Posted by bad_luck on 5/21/2014 2:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/21/2014 2:05:00 PM (view original):
Maybe he's, you know, actually WATCHING MLB baseball games.

It's no surprise to anybody who actually watches MLB games that players have changed their approach to hitting over the years.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

I watch baseball games. Yes, the overall hitting approach has changed.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

So what? An out is an out.

Except when an out is a productive out as opposed to a non-productive out.

Posted by bad_luck on 5/21/2014 2:26:00 PM (view original):
Why don't you tell us more about how BABIP should include home runs?

I already did.  I'm sorry you weren't able to follow along.

Why don't you tell us more about Kenny Lofton's HOF creds?

Posted by tecwrg on 5/21/2014 2:28:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 5/21/2014 2:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 5/21/2014 2:05:00 PM (view original):
Maybe he's, you know, actually WATCHING MLB baseball games.

It's no surprise to anybody who actually watches MLB games that players have changed their approach to hitting over the years.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

I watch baseball games. Yes, the overall hitting approach has changed.

The top 15 all-time single season strikeout totals for hitters have come over the past 10 completed seasons.  And 31 of the top 50.

So what? An out is an out.

Except when an out is a productive out as opposed to a non-productive out.

Do we have to go through this again?

Sometimes an out in play is a small gain over a strikeout. Other times, it's a huge negative. Most of the time, it's no better, no worse.

We know it evens out over the course of the year and that there is no correlation between team run scoring and team strikeouts.