What about using depth chart instead of playing time

Yes, seble, you took the words right out of my mouth. If player positions "lock-in" at the start of conference play, then coach will have much less of a chance to finagle them in order to skew awards.

...and I love this update.

Posted by jetwildcat on 5/22/2014 3:09:00 PM (view original):
What about using depth chart instead of playing time

Not sure I understand.  You could just change your depth chart to whatever you needed, change positions, then change depth chart back.  Or do you mean something different?

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 3:05:00 PM (view original):
The drawback to basing on playing time is that you'd theoretically have to wait quite a while for a player to become eligible.  I like the idea of being able to adjust positions immediately upon recruits showing up.  The one idea that makes sense to me is limiting it to a window of time, possibly up until the regular season starts.  That way, a player is set for that season at least.

the amount of time between recruiting ending and the season starting is small. i know i am not alone amongst coaches who are highly active during recruiting, then dying to set their team up... but the waiting 2 more days kills the momentum and then its a struggle just to get the team ready by the first regular season game. its normal to have micro periods of high and low interest alternate, but its unfortunate you can't set the team up right away, to get that important job done during a peak, instead of a valley of interest... anyway, adding one more thing that *has* to be done that early would really suck for folks like me. i basically had to give up on redshirts, after so many seasons paying for it in recruiting, then forgetting to put it on until after the 1st or 2nd game...

i like this change but i think limiting to the 1.5-2 day window immediately following the dead zone that is the end of recruiting, is the worst of all possibilities. i think the abuse potential is over stated here. what about until non conference is over? or 5 days into the season even? that would give ample time, while avoiding the pre-conference award shuffle problems.

AFTER NON-CON - would give us something to do on that OFF day before conference games. 

Posted by gillispie1 on 5/22/2014 3:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 3:05:00 PM (view original):
The drawback to basing on playing time is that you'd theoretically have to wait quite a while for a player to become eligible.  I like the idea of being able to adjust positions immediately upon recruits showing up.  The one idea that makes sense to me is limiting it to a window of time, possibly up until the regular season starts.  That way, a player is set for that season at least.

the amount of time between recruiting ending and the season starting is small. i know i am not alone amongst coaches who are highly active during recruiting, then dying to set their team up... but the waiting 2 more days kills the momentum and then its a struggle just to get the team ready by the first regular season game. its normal to have micro periods of high and low interest alternate, but its unfortunate you can't set the team up right away, to get that important job done during a peak, instead of a valley of interest... anyway, adding one more thing that *has* to be done that early would really suck for folks like me. i basically had to give up on redshirts, after so many seasons paying for it in recruiting, then forgetting to put it on until after the 1st or 2nd game...

i like this change but i think limiting to the 1.5-2 day window immediately following the dead zone that is the end of recruiting, is the worst of all possibilities. i think the abuse potential is over stated here. what about until non conference is over? or 5 days into the season even? that would give ample time, while avoiding the pre-conference award shuffle problems.

You're saying that the two days between recruiting end and start of regular season is a low interest time?  I would've thought the opposite.  Don't you log on to set up depths/practice/etc. for the new recruits?  That seems like the optimal time for adjusting positions.

I'm not opposed to extending the window if necessary, just surprised that this wouldn't be the popular time frame to do it.

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 3:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jetwildcat on 5/22/2014 3:09:00 PM (view original):
What about using depth chart instead of playing time

Not sure I understand.  You could just change your depth chart to whatever you needed, change positions, then change depth chart back.  Or do you mean something different?

Instead of taking the minutes played at a position during a game, take where the player was on the depth chart at the start of a game.

I obviously don't know how the code looks, so I don't know how I would implement this exactly, but something like...at the beginning of a season, the player has an existing position, with '1 point' attributed to that position and '0 points' attributed to the others. At the start of each game, whichever position(s) he's listed the highest in get a 'point' added. His profile-listed position is whichever position has accumulated the most points thus far in the season, including the starter point.

For me personally (because I don't want to generalize), the two days before nonconference games begin isn't a period of low-interests, and I do use that time set up depth charts, adjust practice minutes, and team game planning. However, the begin of a season is usually a time of fluid change for my teams, so it would be better if I had more that two days to make a decision(s) that affect my team/players for the entire year. That's why I would prefer for that adjustment period to be extended through the entire nonconference schedule.

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 3:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gillispie1 on 5/22/2014 3:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 3:05:00 PM (view original):
The drawback to basing on playing time is that you'd theoretically have to wait quite a while for a player to become eligible.  I like the idea of being able to adjust positions immediately upon recruits showing up.  The one idea that makes sense to me is limiting it to a window of time, possibly up until the regular season starts.  That way, a player is set for that season at least.

the amount of time between recruiting ending and the season starting is small. i know i am not alone amongst coaches who are highly active during recruiting, then dying to set their team up... but the waiting 2 more days kills the momentum and then its a struggle just to get the team ready by the first regular season game. its normal to have micro periods of high and low interest alternate, but its unfortunate you can't set the team up right away, to get that important job done during a peak, instead of a valley of interest... anyway, adding one more thing that *has* to be done that early would really suck for folks like me. i basically had to give up on redshirts, after so many seasons paying for it in recruiting, then forgetting to put it on until after the 1st or 2nd game...

i like this change but i think limiting to the 1.5-2 day window immediately following the dead zone that is the end of recruiting, is the worst of all possibilities. i think the abuse potential is over stated here. what about until non conference is over? or 5 days into the season even? that would give ample time, while avoiding the pre-conference award shuffle problems.

You're saying that the two days between recruiting end and start of regular season is a low interest time?  I would've thought the opposite.  Don't you log on to set up depths/practice/etc. for the new recruits?  That seems like the optimal time for adjusting positions.

I'm not opposed to extending the window if necessary, just surprised that this wouldn't be the popular time frame to do it.

Since most of us want to be ready for the 1st exhibition game we actually we only have 11 hours (between 3AM and 2PM) to do all that.  I'm with Gillispie on this one.  That is a rushed time period.

Would be better if the recruits showed up on the roster as soon as you signed them.

Posted by mullycj on 5/22/2014 3:29:00 PM (view original):
AFTER NON-CON - would give us something to do on that OFF day before conference games. 

I like this idea ... you can make the change in position up to the first conference game.

This is not a discussion of recruits showing up earlier.  That's not an easy change unfortunately. 

To clarify what I was suggesting: the deadline would be up until the exhibition games end, not that smaller window before the exhibition games begin.  So it's more like 1.5 to 2 days.  Also, you'd have the entire recruiting period to adjust players already on your roster.  We're only talking about incoming recruits that would have a smaller window.

The reason I like that earlier deadline is because the whole point of it is to limit the chances of people doing wacky things to make gameplanning more difficult for opponents.  If we wait until conference games, that's 10 games of non-conference where someone could theoretically do it.  Again, I'm not necessarily opposed to that, it just negates some of the reason for having any deadline at all.

Posted by hughesjr on 5/22/2014 4:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mullycj on 5/22/2014 3:29:00 PM (view original):
AFTER NON-CON - would give us something to do on that OFF day before conference games. 

I like this idea ... you can make the change in position up to the first conference game.

Just playing devil's advocate - if you were going to adjust some positions, would you really wait that long to do it anyway?

Posted by seble on 5/22/2014 4:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by hughesjr on 5/22/2014 4:23:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mullycj on 5/22/2014 3:29:00 PM (view original):
AFTER NON-CON - would give us something to do on that OFF day before conference games. 

I like this idea ... you can make the change in position up to the first conference game.

Just playing devil's advocate - if you were going to adjust some positions, would you really wait that long to do it anyway?

I wouldn't wait that long .. but I don't personally have a problem in doing it for the entire season. 

But, if the only real disadvantage to this is potential gaming of the awards system then this would prevent that (a guy playing the whole season at PG then shifting to SG for the award, as an example).  It would also allow some time to pass in the season so you could base a change on actual player growth or injuries, etc.

I actually LOVE the idea of being able to change positions, so any time available to do it is fine with me.