Ferguson Police should be outlawed Topic

You never hear of anyone being shot by a cop for doing exactly what the cop tells them to do

Inevitably, we find out the person that was shot did not follow the directions of a person that has a gun and the legal right to fire it.

Even if you don't agree with what the cop is telling you to do, do it, he has a gun and the backing of the government.

If you didn't like what the cop had you do, fight it later, when the guy you disagree with does not have the ability to use his gun.

Seems pretty simple to me.

Or, in other words, don't be a punk.
8/18/2014 7:49 PM
I agree with that fundamentally ,but there really should be some common sense used before firing a weapon.  I believe that most of these guys carry tasers also.  Why not Taser first? 


8/18/2014 8:06 PM
None of that is important.

The only thing that's relevant is the rhetoric and innuendo based on the selected few "facts" (among many wildly conflicting accounts of what may have actually gone down) that support the version of the story that this was a racially motivated cold-blooded murder on the part of the police officer in question.

That makes for a good story, and gives the social-cause wanna-be's something to run with.

What actually may have happened is irrelevant.
8/18/2014 8:14 PM
nits make lice
8/18/2014 8:18 PM

After police in Kenosha, Wis., shot my 21-year-old son to death outside his house ten years ago — and then immediately cleared themselves of all wrongdoing — an African-American man approached me and said: “If they can shoot a white boy like a dog, imagine what we’ve been going through.”

 

I could imagine it all too easily, just as the rest of the country has been seeing it all too clearly in the terrible images coming from Ferguson, Mo., in the aftermath of the killing of Michael Brown. On Friday, after a week of angry protests, the police in Ferguson finally identified the officer implicated in Brown's shooting, although the circumstances still remain unclear.

I have known the name of the policeman who killed my son, Michael, for ten years. And he is still working on the force in Kenosha.

 

Yes, there is good reason to think that many of these unjustifiable homicides by police across the country are racially motivated. But there is a lot more than that going on here. Our country is simply not paying enough attention to the terrible lack of accountability of police departments and the way it affects all of us—regardless of race or ethnicity. Because if a blond-haired, blue-eyed boy — that was my son, Michael — can be shot in the head under a street light with his hands cuffed behind his back, in front of five eyewitnesses (including his mother and sister), and his father was a retired Air Force lieutenant colonel who flew in three wars for his country — that’s me — and I still couldn’t get anything done about it, then Joe the plumber and Javier the roofer aren’t going to be able to do anything about it either.

***

I got the phone call at 2 a.m. on Nov. 9, 2004. It was my oldest daughter. She said you need to come to the hospital right away, Michael’s been shot by the police. My first gut reaction was, “Michael doesn’t do anything serious enough to get shot by a police officer.” I thought he’d gotten shot in the leg or whatever. When I arrived, I saw the district attorney huddled with about five police officers. The last time I saw my son alive he was on a gurney, with his head wrapped in a big towel and blood coming out of it. I learned that an officer had put his gun up directly to Michael’s right temple and misfired, then did it again, and shot him.

From the beginning I cautioned patience, though Michael’s mother and sister were in an uproar. They had watched him get shot. But as an Air Force officer and pilot I knew the way safety investigations are conducted, and I was thinking that this was going to be conducted this way. Yet within 48 hours I got the message: The police had cleared themselves of all wrongdoing. In 48 hours! They hadn’t even taken statements from several eyewitnesses. Crime lab reports showed that my son’s DNA or fingerprints were not on any gun or holster, even though one of the police officers involved in Michael’s shooting had claimed that Michael had grabbed his gun.

The officer who killed my son, Albert Gonzalez, is not only still on the force ten years later, he is also a licensed concealed-gun instructor across the state line in Illinois—and was identified by the Chicago Tribune in an Aug. 7 investigative story as one of “multiple instructors [who] are police officers with documented histories of making questionable decisions about when to use force.”


From the beginning I allowed the investigation to proceed and didn’t know it was a sham until many of the facts were discovered. But before long I realized a cover-up was under way. I hadn’t understood at first how closely related the DA and the police were—during his election campaign for judge, the DA had been endorsed in writing by every police agency in the county. Now he was investigating them. It was a clear conflict of interest.

The police claimed that one officer screamed that Michael grabbed his gun after they stopped him, for reasons that remain unclear though he was slightly intoxicated, and then Gonzalez shot him, sticking the gun so close against his temple that he left a muzzle imprint. Michael wasn’t even driving his own car. He’d been out with a designated driver, but the designated driver drank and was younger, and so my son made the decision to drive.

 

Wanting to uncover the truth, our family hired a private investigator who ended up teaming up with a retired police detective to launch their own investigation. They discovered that the officer who thought his gun was being grabbed in fact had caught it on a broken car mirror. The emergency medical technicians who arrived later found the officers fighting with each other over what happened. We filed an 1,100-page report detailing Michael's killing with the FBI and US Attorney.

 

It took six years to get our wrongful death lawsuit settled, and my family received $1.75 million. But I wasn’t satisfied by a long shot. I used my entire portion of that money and much more of my own to continue a campaign for more police accountability. I wanted to change things for everyone else, so no one else would ever have to go through what I did. We did our research: In 129 years since police and fire commissions were created in the state of Wisconsin, we could not find a single ruling by a police department, an inquest or a police commission that a shooting was unjustified. There was one shooting we found, in 2005,  that was ruled justified by the department and an inquest, but additional evidence provided by citizens caused the DA to charge the officer. The city of Milwaukee settled with a confidentiality agreement and the facts of that sealed. The officer involved committed suicide.

The problem over many decades, in other words, was a near-total lack of accountability for wrongdoing; and if police on duty believe they can get away with almost anything, they will act accordingly. As a military pilot, I knew that if law professionals investigated police-related deaths like, say, the way that the National Transportation Safety Board investigated aviation mishaps, police-related deaths would be at an all time low. 

And so, together with other families who lost loved ones, I launched a campaign in the Wisconsin legislature calling for a new law that would require outside review of all deaths in police custody. I contacted everybody I could. In the beginning, I contacted the governor’s office, the attorney general and the U.S. attorney for Wisconsin. They didn’t even return my phone calls or letters. I even contacted Oprah, every Associated Press bureau in the nation, every national magazine and national news agency and didn’t hear a word.

But Frank Serpico, the famous retired New York City police detective, helped. He had his own experience taking on police corruption. I set up billboards and a website and took out newspaper ads, including national ads in the New York Times and USA Today, and Serpico allowed me to use his endorsement. “When police take a life, should they investigate themselves?” the ad read.


 

Finally we began to get some movement, helped by a friendly Republican legislator, Garey Bies, and a Democratic assemblyman named Chris Taylor, in August of 2012. In April of this year we passed a law that made Wisconsin the first state in the nation to mandate at legislative level that police-related deaths be reviewed by an outside agency. Ten days after it went into effect in May, local police shot a man sleeping on a park bench 15 times. It’s one of the first incidents to be investigated under the new law.

I’m not anti-cop. And I am finding that many police want change as well: The good officers in the state of Wisconsin supported our bill from the inside, and it was endorsed by five police unions. But I also think the days of Andy Griffith and the Mayberry peacekeeper are over. As we can see in the streets of Ferguson, today’s police are also much more heavily equipped, armed and armored—more militarized. They are moving to more paramilitary-type operations as well, and all those shifts call for more transparency and more rules of restraint. And yet they are even less accountable in some ways than the U.S. military in which I served. Our citizens need protection from undue force, here in our own country, and now



Read more: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/08/what-i-did-after-police-killed-my-son-110038_Page2.html#ixzz3AnG3FaK0



8/18/2014 8:32 PM (edited)
Posted by tecwrg on 8/18/2014 8:14:00 PM (view original):
None of that is important.

The only thing that's relevant is the rhetoric and innuendo based on the selected few "facts" (among many wildly conflicting accounts of what may have actually gone down) that support the version of the story that this was a racially motivated cold-blooded murder on the part of the police officer in question.

That makes for a good story, and gives the social-cause wanna-be's something to run with.

What actually may have happened is irrelevant.
If it turned out to be racially motivated, would you be surprised?
8/18/2014 8:34 PM
Posted by The Taint on 8/18/2014 8:34:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 8/18/2014 8:14:00 PM (view original):
None of that is important.

The only thing that's relevant is the rhetoric and innuendo based on the selected few "facts" (among many wildly conflicting accounts of what may have actually gone down) that support the version of the story that this was a racially motivated cold-blooded murder on the part of the police officer in question.

That makes for a good story, and gives the social-cause wanna-be's something to run with.

What actually may have happened is irrelevant.
If it turned out to be racially motivated, would you be surprised?
No.

But I bet if it turns out to be justified, there are a number of people who would refuse to accept it.
8/18/2014 9:23 PM
Posted by MikeT23 on 8/16/2014 7:19:00 AM (view original):
People who get shot by cops tend to be ****-ups.   

You never hear "Valedictorian, working to help the homeless, shot and killed by rogue cop."

Maybe we shouldn't spend a whole lot of time worrying over a dead ****-up.
This.  And it includes blond-haired, blue-eyed Michaels who are sons of ex-Air Force pilots.

As a general rule, you're cuffed because you did something or you're considered a threat to do something.    Cops don't walk up and cuff people out of the blue.
8/18/2014 9:31 PM

On Friday night, the city of Ferguson, Missouri was absolutely packed with militarized police. But when the looting started, they did nothing about it. In fact, news reports indicate that the police were lined up just blocks from where the looting was happening but did not make any attempt to stop it.

When I first read the news reports that I am about to share with you, I could hardly believe them. I had to read them more than once just to be sure that I was understanding what I was reading. According to eyewitnesses, police vehicles were seen driving by some of the stores while they were being looted and they did not respond.

If the police are not even going to lift a finger to stop rampant theft, then what in the world are they there for? Why don’t they just pack up and leave the streets completely? If they are just there to confront protesters and arrest journalists, all they are accomplishing is inflaming the situation.

And is this what we can expect when civil unrest spreads to more cities throughout America? Will we not be able to depend on the police to protect our homes and our businesses?

What I am about to share with you are excerpts from mainstream news reports about how the police did nothing to stop the looting. To me, this stand down by the police is one of the most disturbing aspects of the Ferguson riots so far.

This first excerpt is from USA Today

During the night, buildings burned, windows shattered, and chaos ensued as protesters stood in the street criticizing police. Officers threatened to arrest protesters who came near their trucks. Yet authorities did not attempt to stop any looting as citizens moved to protect local businesses from sporadic thefts.

This next excerpt is from the local Fox affiliate in St. Louis

Police presence is in question after St. Louis County and Missouri State Highway Patrol officers left the scene in Ferguson once looters began attacking businesses overnight.

Protesters believe the media has started to confuse the difference between themselves and the looters. Fights have begun on the streets as well as social media with some believing this has become similar to a game of chess. 

And this last excerpt is from Fox News

A reporter from the station tweeted that police cars were seen driving past some of the stores being looted and did not respond. It rained in Ferguson Friday night and protesters could be seen outside until 6 a.m.

Two store owners, standing outside their business holding guns, told Fox2Now.com that when they called 911, they were sent from one police agency to another, and got no response.

One of the owners, with a large black gun resting on his shoulder, told the station that police were lined up blocks from the looting, and did not engage looters making off with large boxes from these stores.

There’s no police,” he said. “We trusted the police to keep it peaceful; they didn’t do their job.”

Why did the police in Ferguson refuse to do their jobs?

Who told them to stand down?

Someone in the mainstream media needs to start asking some of these hard questions.

As the streets of Ferguson have descended into anarchy, business owners have been forced to take matters into their own hands.

The following are two photos of a Wal-Mart in Ferguson that were posted by the Economic Policy Journal. In this first photo, you can see that Wal-Mart employees have stacked rows of shopping carts across the front entrance in order to keep looters from getting in…

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This next photo shows that dozens of cases of bottled water have been stacked just inside the front entrance in an attempt to deter looters…

Other business owners are taking even stronger measures to protect their property.

Every night now, business owners can be seen all around Ferguson standing out in front of their businesses holding guns. You can see some examples of this in this article.

And unsurprisingly, gun sales are going through the roof in Ferguson at the moment…

Guns and ammo are selling at a feverish pace in and around St. Louis as violent clashes continue between protesters and police in nearby Ferguson, Missouri.

People are coming in with fear in their eyes and they’re saying they need something to protect their house,” said Steven King, owner of Metro Shooting Supplies, a gun shop in the St. Louis suburb of Bridgeton. “They’re scared to death.”

As I have written about previously, I believe that what is going on in Ferguson is a perfect example of how rapidly the streets of America can descend into chaos.

And I also believe that what we are watching is just a preview of what is coming to America in the years ahead.

Watch what is happening very carefully, because there is a lesson in all of this.

When chaos reigns, the police are not going to be there to rescue you.

In a crisis situation, you and your family are not going to be a priority for the authorities. So you are going to need to come up with your own plan to ensure the safety of yourself and your loved ones.

If you think that I am being overly dramatic, you must not have been paying attention to what has been going on in America in recent years.

Today, our society is becoming increasingly divided. A whole host of opinion polls and surveys show that anger and frustration in this country have reached all-time highs. The civil unrest in Ferguson didn’t just come out of a vacuum. The truth is that pressure has been building under the surface in the U.S. for years. And it isn’t going to take much for more Fergusons to erupt all around the nation.

So what do you think?

Why were the police in Ferguson told not to stop the rampant looting on Friday night?

And what do you think is coming next for America?

8/18/2014 10:07 PM
Is that a real question?   I think most of us know why they did not stop the looters. 
8/19/2014 8:25 AM
LITTLE NIGS GROW UP TO BE BIG NIGS!

KILL EM YOUNG,
8/19/2014 8:40 AM
Posted by The Taint on 8/18/2014 8:06:00 PM (view original):
I agree with that fundamentally ,but there really should be some common sense used before firing a weapon.  I believe that most of these guys carry tasers also.  Why not Taser first? 


I agree with ya, use the taser.

My point is, if a guy has a gun and you don't do exactly what they say, don't be surprised if get shot
8/19/2014 4:40 PM
If some dude is punching you in the face, you might not be able to choose your weapon.

As far as shooting him 6 times, bullets come out fast when you start pulling the trigger.  And, when you've reached the point where you have to fire, you're probably not counting trigger pulls.
8/19/2014 6:05 PM
nits make lice
8/19/2014 6:41 PM
Posted by bronxcheer on 8/19/2014 6:41:00 PM (view original):
nits make lice
I'm dumb

(ask BL and Dahs)

what???
8/19/2014 9:24 PM
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Ferguson Police should be outlawed Topic

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