Posted by moy23 on 8/6/2015 4:50:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 8/6/2015 4:18:00 PM (view original):
Merely doing something wrong/illegal doesn't mean you are to partially to blame if a cop kills you.

Another example, cop walks up to kids drinking beer at a park. Asks for ID. One of the kids is only 20. Cop shoots him in the face.

In moy's world, that 20 year old was partially to blame for his own death. If he hadn't been doing something illegal, he'd still be alive.

What did the kid do to get the cop to ask for his ID, how was his tone, was he respectful, was alcohol allowed at the park?... Why was he drinking illegally in plain sight if he knew he was underage? Could the 20 year old have done ANYTHING to reduce the tension during the confrontation or straight up avoid getting into it? If the answer to that last question is legitimately NO then the 20 year old has zero blame.

But most likely there is a small amount of blame on that underage drinker in your scenario. Very unrealistic scenario as you already know.

Now if the 20 year old turns and runs from the cop and gets shot in the back he is even more at blame, as is the cop still.

And if he tries to assault the cop and gets killed he gets all the blame, and the cop gets off scott free.

Just the fact that you are doing something illegal doesn't mean that you are to blame if someone kills you.

Sometimes it does. It does if you're assaulting someone. It does if you're robbing a bank. Or attacking a cop. Or breaking into someone's house.

It doesn't if you are merely running away.

Dubose is not to blame for his own death. Even if, with the benefit of hindsight, he would do things differently.

Posted by bad_luck on 8/6/2015 5:05:00 PM (view original):

There is a pretty big difference between your example and the Tensing/Dubose situation. See:

 

Man A pushes Man B. Man B pushes him back.

 

Man C tries to leave. Man D shoots him in the head to stop him from leaving.

 

Doesn't matter....if A, B, C or D as much as look at a cop funny, they all take twelve to the chest, back, and lower extremities.

You are at fault.  Move that damn coffee table already!

Posted by moy23 on 8/6/2015 5:28:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 8/6/2015 5:05:00 PM (view original):

There is a pretty big difference between your example and the Tensing/Dubose situation. See:

 

Man A pushes Man B. Man B pushes him back.

 

Man C tries to leave. Man D shoots him in the head to stop him from leaving.

 

You are incapable assigning blame to more than one person. I asked you one simple question 3 times, maybe 4 times.

The answer is, it doesn't matter. The situation is different.

Like I said in a different post above, there are situations where both parties are, at least partially, at fault. A/B is an example.

There are other situations where one party isn't at fault. C/D is an example.

You are leaving out 1 important detail in your C/D example. Man D asked Man C to do something, probably get out of the vehicle. He didn't just try to drive away. He obviously refused to do what the Cop (Man D) asked him to do. He set things in motion by refusing to cooperate.
You are wrong again Blockhead.

Are they going to stop making coffee tables now or will they come with a warning from the surgeon general?

Posted by bheid408 on 8/6/2015 6:18:00 PM (view original):
You are leaving out 1 important detail in your C/D example. Man D asked Man C to do something, probably get out of the vehicle. He didn't just try to drive away. He obviously refused to do what the Cop (Man D) asked him to do. He set things in motion by refusing to cooperate.
You are wrong again Blockhead.

Refusing to cooperate is not cause for murder.

Again, just doing (or refusing to do) something, even something illegal, doesn't necessarily make someone responsible for their own murder.

Yes

Why would somebody choose to flee from a police officer during a routine traffic stop?